Salvage: Zhayolm Remnants

[Ambir]

We entered 5th floor north in the 85-90 min window yesterday (didn't take not of exact time, but was about 13min left when we zoned) and no frog was up. None of the 3 ramparts aggroed, or aggroed to magic either (which was a Wiki theory at one point...)

Oh and the 4th floor frogs definitely aren't true sight. I was running around amongst them yesterday (with sneak/invis) looking for some way to get a decent pull on the Madame and they didn't notice me.

[Forbidden16]

Did you do anything at all to Marid on 4th floor ?

[Ambir]

Did you do anything at all to Marid on 4th floor ?

I'm assuming the Marid is the reinforcement pop from the rampart?

We were just looking to get to the next floor when we were doing those ramparts, and I was using Wiki at the time so I didn't realise that you could select the correct rampart by the day we entered (we were doing a L4N frog to finish some Usukane feet). After the first rampart I was on teleport duty so I didn't see what popped although at least one rampart popped reinforcemnets, and we didn't kill any of the popped mobs, just ported when the rampart was dead.

We did kill all four ramparts though, not intentionally, but because we suck at guessing...

[Forbidden16]

Yea ;/ , just that comment about Marid reinforcement having to do with possible spawn of Madame has made me curious as well.

[divisortheory]

Someone else try killing all 4 ramparts. Maybe even in a certain order. The only orders that might even have a possibility of mattering are:

- clockwise starting with the correct rampart
- clockwise ending with the correct rampart
- counter-clockwise starting with the correct rampart
- counter-clockwise ending with the correct rampart.

[Ambir]

We did 4-3-1-2 if it helps add to the data. (..and I think you'd have to end with the correct rampart... if you started with the correct one you'd go straight to floor 5 and not be able to kill the other 3?)

[Kaylia]

Didnt people report popping her after killing a single rampart only? Or maybe it's just the last one killed like people said, and in this case, the one opening portal is the same one that pop it. That would mean 1/16 to pop it..which explain why people never see it (once every 16 run, excluding people who just skip her without checking).

[divisortheory]

We did 4-3-1-2 if it helps add to the data. (..and I think you'd have to end with the correct rampart... if you started with the correct one you'd go straight to floor 5 and not be able to kill the other 3?)

The porter would unlock, that doesn't mean you have to take it though. Although I do agree ending with the correct rampart is more likely. Also in the case of 5th floor North, correct rampart first -obviously- isn't the case, since if you choose the correct rampart first it's impossible to kill any other rampart since the others depop. You'd have to end with correct rampart, then warp back and do the next one, then keep repeating until correct one is dead.

That would mean 1/16 to pop it..which explain why people never see it (once every 16 run, excluding people who just skip her without checking).

Careful, probability can play tricks on you. Assuming a random rampart unlocks the porter and a random rampart pops the Madame, it's a 1/4 chance that killing the correct rampart first also pops the Madame. Not 1/16.

[jibini]

Oh and the 4th floor frogs definitely aren't true sight. I was running around amongst them yesterday (with sneak/invis) looking for some way to get a decent pull on the Madame and they didn't notice me.

Aggro by sight/sound, pursue by sight?

That's how Puks work, so it's certainly not unprecidented.

Oh, and bees/orcs/sight aggro mobs that pursue by sight/scent will have hide work when it's raining. Guess the rain is suppose to cover the... scent trail? And I know I've lost Orcs in Davoi by using Flee, leaping into the river, and getting far away...

[divisortheory]

yea, water (whether it be rain or running through a puddle) always drops aggro from scent tracking mobs. crawlers are another example.

[Ambir]

Oh and the 4th floor frogs definitely aren't true sight. I was running around amongst them yesterday (with sneak/invis) looking for some way to get a decent pull on the Madame and they didn't notice me.

Aggro by sight/sound, pursue by sight?

That's how Puks work, so it's certainly not unprecidented.

Oh, and bees/orcs/sight aggro mobs that pursue by sight/scent will have hide work when it's raining. Guess the rain is suppose to cover the... scent trail? And I know I've lost Orcs in Davoi by using Flee, leaping into the river, and getting far away...

When you cast on one of them, they all start casting on you at the same time, which indicates they are linking by sound too. They're all facing different directions when they're in the room so I don't think they'd all start casting at the same time with sight linking...

[Kaylia]

Careful, probability can play tricks on you. Assuming a random rampart unlocks the porter and a random rampart pops the Madame, it's a 1/4 chance that killing the correct rampart first also pops the Madame. Not 1/16.

Yeah, huge brain fart here.

[Aemora]

Quick Question: What is the rampart / day association for the Fourth floor again? I read it a couple pages back, but it was scattered in various reports with day dependancies and whatnot :/

If anyone could answer rq, I would <3 you like baby puppies (Yes... Small, annoying yelping BABY Baby Dogs)

Edit: Nvm, found it...

Rampart to kill : Day you enter

• - First : Fire & Earth
  - Second : Water & Wind
  - Third : Ice & Lightning
  - Fourth : Light & Dark

[Odog]

Damn killed BC chariot tonight and did a strategy not many try i think?

We had 2 blms and stunned 9/10 Discoid throughout the fight. One got off cause of recast timer and that was it. 6th Floor chariot was MUCH harder than BC like this lol. Anyhow, he did not resist 1 stun with blms having weapons. Maybe this is all known and used info but most the time i see the strat talked about of just make all the mages get hit so i thought i would add this :D

usukane head
ares legs

/wrist

[divisortheory]

http://nyankonyanko.x0.com/log/eid561.html

I'm tired and don't feel like translating right now, so does this say anything important?

The main point I got from this was "we have a theory that killing every mob in the zone (frog NMs being irrelevant) followed by the manticores will pop 6F Madame." Am I missing anything else or is it more speculation?

[NynJa]

you're a math whiz. is it even mathematically possible to kill every mob from floors 1-5 (that you can run into) ?

[divisortheory]

Probably not. But if you ignore the north half of 3F it might be. Would require splitting up on 1F and 2F for certain though. 2 Ridills would help >.> And bring like 4 SMN so when you get to the long rectangle room on 3F just astral flow it with 4 SMNs all using Shiva (since Mamools are weak to ice).

[Jaceot]

Too many mobs for that thoery in my opinoin theres about 160 from floors from 1-5 even if you only do one half of the 3rd floor. For crazy theories killing all mamool seemed better to me, cause thats about 100 mobs (since you have to clear the 2nd floor to do that). And then you could mirror that with Arrapago and say kill all lamia for the TH on floor 6.

But speaking of crazy theories. Divisortheory, your screenshot a few pages back of the 5th floor madame being up is way to censored! do you have one that has the /clock? Cause i realized that my group entered at about 23:30, and zoned up at about 59 minutes, that could put us getting up in a small time period known as "Dawn" (isnt dawn from like 4-6? or is that something else, i think undead depop at 4 but it isnt officially day till 6). I know you changed days cause you had firesday but went up with the fourth rampart so it seems possible you couldve goneup during dawn.

The darn jp group had thier /clock off

But of all the theories so far I kinda like this one. Cause then Maybe 5th floor north is dusk!

I think im gonna solo Zhayolm tomorrow to try this out, Think i can do it as a thief/nin with full armamament of haste / evasion / bloody, sleep, acid, bolts? Can totally skip the first floor, 2nd floor start in the rings / ranged / waist room and clear it. go get legs, then head, and hands (skippign stuff depending on what i get from chest). Third floor get hp and maybe agi dex and str. 4th floor is the problem, can a single rampart have more than one marid out at a time? cause I could handle just one marid, but anymore than that and I'm not sure. I'll plan to enter at around noon or something so i can have 2 chances at dawn cause i dont know how long 2nd floor will take me.

[docvicious]

Dusk is 17-18, Dawn is 6-7

Kyahan plus 1 are 17-7 thats who i got dusk till dawn before i get flamed

[Almalexia]

Poked around the north side today with a group of 6.

Entered on Firesday.
Port up from Floor 1: 11:30
Port up from Floor 2: 18:50
Port up from Floor 3: 28:30
Killed 4F N Poroggo Madame.
Targeted the First Rampart, waited for Reinforcements, killed rampart, killed Rogue Marid.
Port up from floor 4: 38:50
No Madame in three rampart room. Three ramparts would not aggro magic. So my theory about killing the Rogue Marid from the correct rampart didn't work for the 5F N Madame.

With nearly an hour to spare, we started killing the Archaic Gears in the first room. We scanned the floor when the gears were dead. No Madame.

One curious feature of the gears on this floor is how they're all confined to a pattern of movement except for 5 free-roaming gears in the first room. I almost think that this presents a sort of obstacle course-- avoid every gear and the chariot on your way to the portal doors. If you succeed in opening the doors without drawing aggro, a Madame pops.

Another thing, and I find it odd that this was just ignored, is how the largest room of gears will assist the chariot guarding the portal doors. If you don't clear the gears, they will come for you. Wizerd and Divisortheory posted this a long time ago and I had forgotten about it. There was much... excitement when our small team was gearraped mid-battle with the chariot.

This is quite a security system, but why? I've been able to get past the chariot aggro-free sometimes. On occasions when I do aggro, the door isn't even locked and the portal is already in sight. The gears aren't helping to guard the portal door. They're protecting the chariot.

I pose that the 5F N chariot does drop something, or is involved in popping something of significance. The reaction of those gears to chariot aggro couldn't be just another confusing Salvage gimmick... could it?

Also, to anyone who killed the 5F South chariot, did any Archaic Gear in the largest room link with the chariot? I want to know if the "security system" is a north exclusive.

5F N chariot dropped a Zhayolm Card, much to the dismay of those who saw the treasure box icon and celebrated too early.