Salvage: Zhayolm Remnants

[Maxxthepenguin]

Note to self: Don't Guillotine Zizzes.

[DanielRemora]

I'm after a little advice.

We've ran this zone 5 or 6 time aiming for the boss. But we keep timing out on the 6th floor (Without even clearing it). We have wasted tonnes of time before on the first and second floor, but this time we sat down and worked it out, and were sure we could do it. We ended up timing out with the 6f Chariot at 50%. There were no wipes, etc.

Here's a run down...

PT1: WHM RDM BRD MNK NIN RNG.
PT2: BLU WHM BLM

All players are well equipped, and play their jobs very well.

First floor:- Basically, we killed the first 2 rooms in each section, including the annoying mamools that seperate the rooms in question. This gives us 6 of each cells + the initial chest drops. Sneak Invised and ported up SW. The first floor took about 34-35 mins. I didn't get any shots of the other ports unfortunately...

Second floor:- Cleared the SW room + mamool (I need clarification here... some sites say its required to open the door. Is that true?). Went NE, killed 3 (Linked) lizards for 2 ranged, and 2 waist/back. Went NW and killed a few too many, getting most of us head gear. Ported up.

Third floor:- Killed our way through getting MP and HP cells. By the time we reach the south room we had enough, so were able to skip that.

Fourth floor:- Killed Third rampart and ported.

Fifth floor:- I popped Powder boots, the NIN followed and after a few attempts with event skipped on the door/portal, we got up all intact.

6th floor:- I immediately saced the AC, then we started killing. Timed out with all but the AC dead @50%~.


So... where are we going wrong. This is literally the furthest we've gotten on this area now.

Thanks in advance.

[Forbidden16]

First of all keep in mind that Salvage is a hardcore race from the second you zone in, never forget that.

• You're spending TOO much time on first floor, just clear the first rooms in each quadrant, and only go to second rooms of a quadrant if you're missing any vital cells for a vital job (Magic, SJ, abilities).
  [/*:m:87a28]
• Second room you are supposed to be able to kill at least two dropper mobs from each quadrant, Poroggo Madame, and Jakko and still be fine on time.
  [/*:m:87a28]
• From third room to sixth room you didn't explain much your process, but I assume you're spending huge amounts of time on the 3F South path mamools.[/*:m:87a28]

IMO, you seem to be following the correct routes, but either your kill speed is very slow, or your group is wasting time or not being fast on port ups, etc. Always have a person on the way to porter as you're finishing the last mobs in any floor, and be on the next floor killing immediately, every second counts. Also, I mentioned the 2F NMs because killing boss and all Zhayolm NMs in same run is very viable and even though you're skipping them you're running out of time, which needs a serious tweak. Your setup has dual WHM's, if possible switch one for another front line job; you have pretty decent support, and BLU in tank party can help lots for Discoid.

[DanielRemora]

Yeah, figured the first floor we could shave some time off.

I was aiming for the WHM WHM RDM MNK MNK to have their SJ, Weapon, Ability and Magic all unlocked. This meant we needed the additional kills in each section... And of course a couple of additional weapons for the extra people who came along, as well as the BRDs magic.

The third to 5th floor explanations were brief because essentially that's what they were. 4th and 5th floor we skipped, and 3rd floor we just killed enough to get 3 HP and 3 MP cells. I can see the 1st floor shaving off ~15 mins though. And 2nd floor I think if we skip all those extra mobs we killed, we'll be able to get through it ok.

I'll see if they want to try again tomorrow and see how it goes.

ty Forb

[Lordwafik]

If you're just hunting madames, you shouldn't waste time getting abilities for WHMs , especially since you have two as well as a RDM on top of that. Plenty of support.

[Slott]

Yeah, figured the first floor we could shave some time off.

I was aiming for the WHM WHM RDM MNK MNK to have their SJ, Weapon, Ability and Magic all unlocked. This meant we needed the additional kills in each section... And of course a couple of additional weapons for the extra people who came along, as well as the BRDs magic.

The third to 5th floor explanations were brief because essentially that's what they were. 4th and 5th floor we skipped, and 3rd floor we just killed enough to get 3 HP and 3 MP cells. I can see the 1st floor shaving off ~15 mins though. And 2nd floor I think if we skip all those extra mobs we killed, we'll be able to get through it ok.

I'll see if they want to try again tomorrow and see how it goes.

ty Forb

Since I typically couldnt get more than 5-6 for this zone and we needed to get good at boss, I suggest you change your gearing up strategy. We typically went with Mnk thf brd rdm blu and some form of a 6th, whether it be a 2nd rdm, a blm, or another melee. We've killed the boss several times with a monk main tanking, thief behind the monk, and blu and rdm as only support (6 in range at all times however)

Your key 6 should be monk monk blu whm rdm brd. You don't need more healing than that. Blu can kill extremely quickly on the way up, and against boss can cure better than a redmage once changing spells. (more mana efficient, and has access to more spells) Whether they sj whm or nin is up to you.

[Daiiawn]

i dont really know what a "great" time for floor 1 is, but my group generally takes 16-18 mins with
rdm war/nin drk thf thf sam brd blm, we can probably speed it up a little by splitting into 2 groups and clearing 2 rooms at a time. At the moment im happy with 16-18 mins, as it will match our timing plan for 4fn runs.

As the others have said, concentrate only on the 4 inner rooms on floor 1, only going deeped in if you need more of a specific cell (which im guessing would be the case for magic with you guys, especially if your mnk is /nin).

On floor 2 are the doors openable without clearing entire rooms? i always thought you had to clear a room and kill the mamool to open others, but have not needed to try this out yet (going to try a 5fn run soon enough, so will be useful to know for then)

[Wizerd]

i dont really know what a "great" time for floor 1 is, but my group generally takes 16-18 mins with
rdm war/nin drk thf thf sam brd blm, we can probably speed it up a little by splitting into 2 groups and clearing 2 rooms at a time. At the moment im happy with 16-18 mins, as it will match our timing plan for 4fn runs.

As the others have said, concentrate only on the 4 inner rooms on floor 1, only going deeped in if you need more of a specific cell (which im guessing would be the case for magic with you guys, especially if your mnk is /nin).

On floor 2 are the doors openable without clearing entire rooms? i always thought you had to clear a room and kill the mamool to open others, but have not needed to try this out yet (going to try a 5fn run soon enough, so will be useful to know for then)

A great time for 1F is about 11-13 minutes for my group, going with 10 people, getting everyone magic, SJ, abilities, and dealing with just the original 2+4 weapons, if I recall correctly. We stay together for the first 2 rooms, then get the magic cells we need, then me and my RDM split up from the group, duoing raptors to get abilities while the rest of the group goes and does the rest of the rooms and the bugards. We end around the same time, and the second RDM ports us up.

[DanielRemora]

On floor 2 are the doors openable without clearing entire rooms? i always thought you had to clear a room and kill the mamool to open others, but have not needed to try this out yet (going to try a 5fn run soon enough, so will be useful to know for then)

Just checked BG wiki, and it's the only one that clearly says "Yes, you need to do this.".

I guess that would make NE the best place to port- Because obviously they are lizards, making it easier than the wyverns, and they drop more than one(+body) cell type?

As the others have said, concentrate only on the 4 inner rooms on floor 1, only going deeped in if you need more of a specific cell (which im guessing would be the case for magic with you guys, especially if your mnk is /nin).

Additionally, I think I'll save 2 magic cells, and 2 weapon for duplication rather than having to kill the additional mobs for the extra cells. Should shave of even more time. I can focus just on the 4 rooms then.

Groups gonna try it tonight, hope all goes well!

Edit:
Here's what I've wrote as a basic strat for my group.

1st Floor:
3x Magic: RDM, BRD, MNK
4x Ability: MNK, MNK, RDM, RDM
4x SJ: MNK, RDM, MNK, RDM
5x Weapon: DD, DD, MNK, MNK, RDM

1st floor:

-BLM sneak invis to North East port.
-Kill the first room of each section.
-SAVE MAGIC FROM THE LAST 2 ROOMS, AND EVERYTHING FROM THE LAST ROOM.

2nd Floor:
Body (random drop~): WHM, MNK, MNK, BLM, RDM, xxx

Back: MNK, MNK, xxx
Ranged: BRD, RNG, xxx
Rings: MNK, MNK, WHM, RDM
-Clear NE lizards
-Kill Mamool Ja.

4x Magic MNK, WHM, BLU, RDM
2x Ability WHM, xxx
2x SJ WHM, xxx
2x Weapon BRD, WHM
-Pop madame with the 5 cells saved from the last floor!

Legs: MNK, MNK, xxx
-Kill SW wyverns for legs.

-Someone wait at the tele

Head: RDM, MNK, MNK, WHM
-Kill NW wyverns for head.


3rd Floor:
-stat cells are random. DON'T spend too much time here.
-have someone head straight to the tele.

Head West/South.

required cells-
At least 2 HP, (MNK, MNK, RDMs (convert))
2-4 MP (RDM, WHM, RDM, BLU)

-Kill Everything until the south room. If we have the MIN cells, port up.


4th Floor:
-Kill rampart, port.


5th floor:
-thf, /thf flee, anyone with flee. I'll bring 2-3 flee boots...
-Multiple people ideally! Skip the floor.

6th Floor:

-All head to one of the alcoves. Someone sac the ac.
-Roam the room and kill everything. The AC doesnt aggro (Might link though...?) Kill AC last using standard boss strat of 2 mnk or w/e we have.

-Buff up now before porting to save wasted MP.

7th Floor:

Beat boss. everyone should be in range of special, but out of tp, etc, etc.

[Slott]

baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad idea to try to duplicate anything you dont need to. That frog can be a royal whore and take anywhere from 3-20 minutes depending how often she charms. You're better off not doing that. Your mages dont need staves that badly.

1st Floor:
3x Magic: RDM, BRD, MNK
4x Ability: MNK, MNK, RDM, RDM
4x SJ: MNK, RDM, MNK, RDM
5x Weapon: DD, DD, MNK, MNK, RDM

Assuming you're getting an extra 2 magic/weapons you said to save for 2nd floor: the 2 magic could be done by killing 2 ziz, you have 1-2 ja's unaccounted for (and if you're the group with the blu, I have no idea why a blu doesnt have an sj for weaponskilling, and you're basically saying you're farming 1 ja cell from the 2nd bugard room (first one passed the mamool) to dupe instead of farm an extra bugard. It makes absolutely no sense.

Another thing, your 2nd magic should go to blu, not bard. Bard after the blu. Disseverment and hysteric barrage make short work of mobs. No idea why you put your blu so far behind...

From starting crate + 4 inner room's you're guaranteed: 6 weapons, 6(5) ja, 5(6) magic, 5sj (if you start with 2 ja, you get 1 magic, so 6 ja 5 magic from just inner rooms) if you get 1 ja 2 magic, then 5 ja 6 magic from just inner rooms. Clear 2 ziz for extra magic, and 2 bugards for extra sj. My group clears first floor in 9-12 minutes


Armor: We typically do melee first. it reduces damage they take significantly, and i dont know how they drop without a thief, but with one you're typically flooded with them


With your only 2 dps as 2 monks, put more emphasis on your blu. Gear them up 3rd - they're a very good source of dd, and you lack any dd aside from 2 monks.

[DanielRemora]

Typically our second "MNK" is often a NIN, it depends who shows up really :3
And the first floor cells are only from the chest and the inner rooms. We're not farming any from the 2nd rooms.

From the chest, I counted only the garunteed drops.

2 Weapon, 1 Magic, 1 Ability and 1 SJ.

The Inner rooms results in 4 of each. Bringing it to 6 Weapon, 5 Magic, 5 Ability and 5 SJ. Obviously we were going to keep 2 magic and 1 of each other to pop madame.

As far as the madame goes, we've killed it during frog runs before, and it's always down in a matter of 2-3 mins. It hasn't actually charmed us yet >_> Lucky I guess, lol. Forb mentioned that we should have time to do this anyway, so I think its worth a shot rather than having to spend more time killing additional extra rooms. This way we can get everything we need. I should sort the priority out though... How does this sound?

I saw your point on BLU, so heres the revised priority:

7 magic (RDM BLU MNK MNK BRD + Any additional healer + BLM)
6 Ability (MNK MNK BLU RDM + Any additional DD)
6 SJ (MNK, RDM, MNK, BLU + Second RDM (If applicable) + Any)
7 Weapon (Damage Dealers (That does include BLU) MNK MNK BLM then Healers)

I don't see us needing more than that. Of course you guys are the experts which is why I'm asking.

Gonna try a run in about 30 mins, so we'll see how it goes.

[Slott]

You either get 2 ja 1 magic or 2 magic 1 ja from chest, i didnt see you account for that. Either way, poroggo seems like a risk/waste of time vs first floor mobs.

[DanielRemora]

Ok we're skipping it. If the magic drops we wont ffarm the extra room, if it doesn't we will.

Thanks

Going in in a sec

[Uzor]

baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaad idea to try to duplicate anything you dont need to. That frog can be a royal whore and take anywhere from 3-20 minutes depending how often she charms. You're better off not doing that. Your mages dont need staves that badly.

Are you kidding? >.O 2nd floor Poroggo Madame have never ever used Frog Chorus for us, and she usually dies within 30 sec tops

Edit: naturally, I meant second floor. Not third

[DanielRemora]

Ok, so we did it. Went pretty well too, until the boss- lol.

Positioning was a little shaky, a couple of people were in the wrong place the first couple of discoids, so that didnt work out too well. This led to like 2 deaths, which increased damage, which led to another death. So we held it just fine for 5 mins while we got unweak, at which point it was too late. We started with about 20 mins left... Just needs some practice I guess. I have no idea how you do this with 1 BLU and 1 RDM healing in a PT of 6... Seems entirely impossible. MP wasn't enough. The first 4 TP moves it used were discoid...

We had 8 People.
PT1: RDM BLU NIN MNK BLM BRD. The brd was basically the first to die... he didnt have SJ, so couldnt assist heal.
PT2: RNG THF. The BLM was their designated healer, but that didnt really work out, these were #2 & 3 to die :/

Timed out at 30%.

Basically the BLU kept SS up, and main healed. I was the ~na whore and small cures. BLU ran out of MP, I take over while hes resting, I run out of mp. Convert, keep healing. Eventually ran out of MP again. Way too many discoids -.-

[Zarath]

Ok, so we did it. Went pretty well too, until the boss- lol.

Positioning was a little shaky, a couple of people were in the wrong place the first couple of discoids, so that didnt work out too well. This led to like 2 deaths, which increased damage, which led to another death. So we held it just fine for 5 mins while we got unweak, at which point it was too late. We started with about 20 mins left... Just needs some practice I guess. I have no idea how you do this with 1 BLU and 1 RDM healing in a PT of 6... Seems entirely impossible. MP wasn't enough. The first 4 TP moves it used were discoid...

We had 8 People.
PT1: RDM BLU NIN MNK BLM BRD. The brd was basically the first to die... he didnt have SJ, so couldnt assist heal.
PT2: RNG THF. The BLM was their designated healer, but that didnt really work out, these were #2 & 3 to die :/

Timed out at 30%.

Basically the BLU kept SS up, and main healed. I was the ~na whore and small cures. BLU ran out of MP, I take over while hes resting, I run out of mp. Convert, keep healing. Eventually ran out of MP again. Way too many discoids -.-

Do you keep on whacking it when discord comes off? My group lays off it until at least one curaga comes down, setting us up above the discord amount HP wise. Which isn't too much of a problem, most of my team has /whm or something of that matter to keep HP amounts pretty high and fast.

[DanielRemora]

Do you keep on whacking it when discord comes off? My group lays off it until at least one curaga comes down, setting us up above the discord amount HP wise. Which isn't too much of a problem, most of my team has /whm or something of that matter to keep HP amounts pretty high and fast.

Yeah, we did. Seemed ok until that 4th Discoid. Positioning was the biggest problem though, The first 2 hit us for almost 800.

[Mokou]

If you're having trouble with boss, then try killing the south rampart on third floor. Usually if we're only aiming on boss then we invis to rampart and kill it for the drinks. It dies very fast and you should get Oracle's, Barbarians and maybe a Revitalizer from it as well as some other stuff.

I'd recommend taking a WHM though. Sometimes BCC is extremely easy and only uses Discoid a couple of times all fight, but I've also seen about 20 in a single fight before. Luckily we had 2 WHM that day so it wasn't too bad, although we were both fairly low on mp towards the end (we didn't take any resting breaks).

[recuperi]

taking a merited whm also cuts discoid damage down another 5% from shellra 5, meaning about 250 more damage avoided from just that spell. that might not seem like alot, but if its a discoid spamming fight it adds up alot

oh and also what the guy said a couple posts above me; taking about a 10 second break after discoid to get curagas off/recast stoneskin helps alot in the overall fight

[Lordender]

fucking stupid deimos feet, we got like 5 of these compared to 2 macha feet. I swear, we call this shit emos feet now >.>