Salvage: Bhaflau Remnants

[Hiruke]

Today I attempted the 3rd floor Rampart. If you save MNK 2hrs, it shouldn't really be too hard to kill these quickly. Without agroing any of the Archaic Gear, my group killed both Archaic Gears on this floor. The one on the East got off Restoral as its second WS, and died shortly thereafter. I believe it had all three gears intact at the time. The one on the West died as a single gear, but did not use Restoral at all.

So, the theory is either incorrect, or strangely only applies to the East Archaic Gears.

[safer]

you didnt do as the theory stated..... divisor said they must not use restoral, but you just said it did.....


and congratz ayn...... we got pretty close last time, hoping for a win next time we go

just curious how much time did you have when you arrived to the boss?

typically we spend about 40min or so on the first floor pretty much clearing everything in order of bifrons > trolls > wamoura > wamouracampa but have 1 person sit at the port for when we finish farming

second floor we do the 4 puddings, and if we need more magic, we'll go south, if we dont , we go north... usually 1 person runs to the port while everyone else pulls a scorp or 2 to kill in the mean time

third floor 1 person runs to the port while others farm w/e is there in the meantime

fourth floor jus have someone flee past the middle room to the port

that gives us about 30min~ after rebuffing for the boss.... got it down to 16% cause not enough DD's =/

[Ayn]

just curious how much time did you have when you arrived to the boss?

We had about 30 minutes exactly when we got to the boss.

typically we spend about 40min or so on the first floor pretty much clearing everything in order of bifrons > trolls > wamoura > wamouracampa but have 1 person sit at the port for when we finish farming

30-35 minutes here. I find this takes longer with the more people we have. The hardest part of Salvage for me is getting the lots sorted out. Furthermore, once Kkel (our resident Ridill WAR when Ryko's not on another job) gets his weapons, we begin to split up, and mobs die so fast that things begin to auto sort. . so we spend some time trying to determine what lotted where. I *try* to come up with a drop lot order, but it's rough -- next time I may just do "x-person gets fully equipped first (such as a tank)" but it's not always that simple.

second floor we do the 4 puddings, and if we need more magic, we'll go south, if we dont , we go north... usually 1 person runs to the port while everyone else pulls a scorp or 2 to kill in the mean time

9 times out of ten we have all the equipment we need from floor 1, so we just go south for stats, and then magic/MP/subjobs on floor 3. Kudos to Ryko yesterday for essentially kiting every single scorpion in the south room while we picked them off.

third floor 1 person runs to the port while others farm w/e is there in the meantime

Typically do the same. I stay long enough to help kill some flans, then run off and get ready to port.

fourth floor jus have someone flee past the middle room to the port

Ditto. At some point on the third or fourth floor, I tell the tanks to start building TP to 300% for spirits. Hey, every little bit helps, you know?

that gives us about 30min~ after rebuffing for the boss.... got it down to 16% cause not enough DD's =/

We had 5 DDs; me (THF) Akanei (MNK) Forge (MNK) Nightwing (BLU) and Kkel (WAR) along with 3 BLMs. Our SAM had to unsign last minute because of his shitty internet not allowing him to log on. The usual plan we have is that the WAR, SAM, and THF build TP from a distance with Archery / Marksmanship. I run in and do a TA Shark bite, while the WAR does Mistral Axe. Light isn't the best skillchain on these things, admittedly, but it allows us to make a skillchain without standing in melee range for too long. When a SAM is there, we do Sharkbite -> Gekko for Disto. What also worked out great was a BLU being able to do a self-distortion chain for the BLMs to burst.

The fight was pretty smooth up until 60-55% or so. It just got to the point where LBC would shift alot, making it hard for tanks to reposition. A Homing Missile went off, and we got it back into position. . but he started being a bastard again. Eventually we just said fuck it and had one of our Monks pop a Braver's Drink, then both go in with SV minuets and do Hundred Fists. I think together, they dropped the mob a good 20% or more in that short time. The last 10% or so was messy as homing missiles went off, BLMs started dying, but eventually we pulled through.

For what it's worth, our set up was:

PLD/NIN
NIN/DRK
BRD/WHM
BRD/WHM
WHM/BLM
RDM/BLM (I think, can't remember Jay's sub)

MNK/WAR
MNK/WAR
BLM/WHM
BLM/RDM
BRD/WHM
WAR/NIN

THF/NIN (forgot to switch to WAR sub and didn't want to make the run start late, go me)
BLM/WHM
BLU/WHM

Normally we would have one less BRD and BLM, and two more Rangers (or a SAM and a RNG) -- neither of our regulars could make it, though.

Hopefully that was of help to you. As always you can toss me a POL message/talk to me in game if you need help figuring anything out.

[Faranim]

next time we go i'll try that third floor theory out... anyone know if they mean the single gears.. or just the triple gears you gotta kill quickly? and does the side matter?

Triple oly. I'd recommend perhaps building TP on outside mobs and doing a SC so your BLMs can burst. Those things are really hard to kill quickly.

Well, my translation might be incorrect, I've only had a couple semesters of Japanese and just mangled the babbelfish into something more English.

I think we can establish at this point that:

1. The rampart pops after killing the Archaic Gears (Triple)
2. The Archaic Gears need to be killed in a certain state (most likely, all 3 gears still in-tact)
3. The Archaic Gear (single) might not matter, or it might be a requirement to not aggro any of them.

There are basically 2 ways to kill the Gears in 3-gear mode. 1 is to simply kill it before it has a chance to lose any gears. Another is to weaken it and let it use restoral.

Normally, Gears become 2-gear at 50% HP, and 1-gear at 25% HP. Using Restoral brings back a missing gear, and also restores 25% HP (I think). Does anyone know if it's possible to lose gears that were restored? Ex:

Melee-burn down to 20% HP. The Gears should be in 1-gear mode.
Gears use Restoral. 2-gear mode and 45% HP
Melee-burn back down to 20% HP. Does another gear fall off again, or will it keep 2-gear mode?

Skillchain + Freeze2 MB might be the only way to do it....



Edit: Unrelated, but on the 2nd floor we did some quick tests with RDM nukes. We found that nukes that did under 1000 damage didn't bring the North/South flans out of spike mode (highest we got was 996 damage or something). Large nukes from BLMs almost always end spike mode if they don't kill the Flan. I'm not sure what the actual damage threshold is, just something I noticed.

[Hiruke]

you didnt do as the theory stated..... divisor said they must not use restoral, but you just said it did.....

Are you, like, serious? Could you please actually read my post and the posts it refers to before you decide to be rude to me for no reason?

[Hiruke]

I think we can establish at this point that:

1. The rampart pops after killing the Archaic Gears (Triple)
2. The Archaic Gears need to be killed in a certain state (most likely, all 3 gears still in-tact)
3. The Archaic Gear (single) might not matter, or it might be a requirement to not aggro any of them.

There are basically 2 ways to kill the Gears in 3-gear mode. 1 is to simply kill it before it has a chance to lose any gears. Another is to weaken it and let it use restoral.

Normally, Gears become 2-gear at 50% HP, and 1-gear at 25% HP. Using Restoral brings back a missing gear, and also restores 25% HP (I think). Does anyone know if it's possible to lose gears that were restored? Ex:

Melee-burn down to 20% HP. The Gears should be in 1-gear mode.
Gears use Restoral. 2-gear mode and 45% HP
Melee-burn back down to 20% HP. Does another gear fall off again, or will it keep 2-gear mode?

Skillchain + Freeze2 MB might be the only way to do it....

Edit: Unrelated, but on the 2nd floor we did some quick tests with RDM nukes. We found that nukes that did under 1000 damage didn't bring the North/South flans out of spike mode (highest we got was 996 damage or something). Large nukes from BLMs almost always end spike mode if they don't kill the Flan. I'm not sure what the actual damage threshold is, just something I noticed.

I'm not sure which of those possible pop methods would be more of a pain. If they need to be killed before using Restoral at all, that might not be so bad. Trying to kill them with all 3 gears intact could be a bitch, as they could definitely not use Restoral when you want them to, and just batter you with crazy AoE damage.

As far as Flans and nuking goes... Did you nuke them several times each, or just once? I understand that in a recent run one of my groups did, RDM nukes knocked it out of spike mode. So is the threshold magical damage over time, or a single nuke?

[blowfin]

Tried Bhaflau Remnants again the other night, we didn't have anywhere near the right setup for the boss so we just aimed at the 1st and 2nd floor NM's seeing as people still want the gear.

Mad Bomber was up, killed, rampart spawned 0 Spiders for us.
We popped the 2nd floor rampart and got no HQ bee's either.
We timed out right as the 2nd rampart ran out of health.
I wasn't paying any close attention to time/moon phase etc.

The run netted 1 Lvl 15 Tekko and 1 lvl 15 Ares Boots. Both dropped before we even tackled Mad Bomber.

I'm thinking theres some kind of pattern to the HQ mobs being spawned. Similar to how you can go for several hours hunting coffer keys only to get 2 or 3 drop within about 5 minutes. But no one has managed to figure out how to get consistent coffer key drops right?

The same way we've had no lvl 15 items at all drop in some Bhaflau runs but we've had up to 3 drop on others, you can get absolutely stuff all from the ramparts or be flooded with HQ pops.

Personally I don't like the erratic nature of this one bit, I'd much rather the HQ pop rates be consistent but lower than constantly erratic from one extreme to another. All it does at the moment is test people's patience.

[safer]

you didnt do as the theory stated..... divisor said they must not use restoral, but you just said it did.....

Are you, like, serious? Could you please actually read my post and the posts it refers to before you decide to be rude to me for no reason?

sorry, i wasnt trying to be rude... your initial post made it seem like you didnt get the rampart to pop when you said you 'attempted it', as in "tried to test out the theory, but it didnt work"....if you did get the rampart to pop then conratz, and it was just a misunderstanding

guessing no drop on lvl 35 items? =<

[futceez]

Here is data from when we have gone ... I converted real time (in EST) to Vana'diel time for the first kill each day using this site. I didn't bother doing any verification on the conversion (I'm most worried about time zone issues, but I do know that it has worked in the past for me).

Gate Widow
Vana'diel Time: Iceday: 1013-08-11 16:44:35
Moon Phase: 29% Waning Crescent
[2007/01/12 01:04:11] 25 Kallstrom defeats the Chigoe. (NO POP ... this is the first Chigoe killed)

Vana'diel Time: Earthsday: 1013-09-10 12:00:25
Moon Phase: 40% First Quarter Moon
[2007/01/13 04:43:13] a6 Geminorum defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/01/13 04:46:17] a6 Roan defeats the Gate Widow.

Vana'diel Time: Watersday: 1014-07-07 08:55:00
Moon Phase: 52% Last Quarter Moon
[2007/01/25 01:43:00] 25 Aspiringfinch defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/01/25 01:46:53] 25 Shizune defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/01/25 01:51:55] 25 Zumi defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/01/25 01:57:42] 25 Aspiringfinch defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/01/25 02:01:42] 25 Shizune defeats the Gate Widow.

Vana'diel Time: Earthsday: 1015-07-22 13:07:05
Moon Phase: 40% First Quarter Moon
[2007/02/09 01:53:05] 25 Freja defeats the Gate Widow.
[2007/02/09 02:03:54] a6 Hawker defeats the Gate Widow.

Skirmish Pephredo
Vana'diel Time: Watersday: 1013-07-15 00:52:55
Moon Phase: 90% Waning Gibbous
[2007/01/10 23:28:31] 25 Roan defeats the Skirmish Pephredo.

Vana'diel Time: Firesday: 1014-09-17 23:31:40
Moon Phase: 86% Waning Gibbous
[2007/01/27 21:30:04] 25 Aspiringfinch defeats the Skirmish Pephredo.
[2007/01/27 21:34:30] 2c Ramuh defeats the Skirmish Pephredo.

The conclusion: Nothing really, except that I can't disprove the theory.

Maybe its moon phase (just noticed it from sykes' post):
First Quarter Moon & Last Quarter Moon = Gate Widow
Waning Crescent & Waning Gibbous = Skirmish Pephredo
Waxing Crescent & Waxing Gibbous = Zebra Zachary?
New Moon & Full Moon = Peryton?

Well, we did Bhaflau today and it was Waxing Gibbous, no gates widows popped from RR from 99% to 74%, then we went for the boss and killed it in 20mins (3rd kill).

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a338/Futceez/LBC3.jpg

[Lindstrom]

I like how you've got an Empress Band going in that picture.

Has everyone else been getting a shitload of bodies from bosses? We've gotten 5 cuirasses, 2 pairs of haidate, and 1 pair of ledelsens from LBC, and frankly we're pretty much out of people to give cuirasses to, but we kill LBC with 8 people usually.

Also, tried the Peryton Rampart last night but didn't get any to spawn, and I wasn't clever enough to check the time or moon phase or anything. It did seem like the Rampart had less health (or higher DoT) and was going down faster, too.

[Lhexh]

You are just crazy lucky.. we've killed LBC 9 times and gotten a grand total of 1 Phobo's Cuirass and 1 Bodb's Robe and have so many damn bobd's Crowns we got sick of doing that zone.

[Not Kuno]

Random post but can someone put in the good Bhaf maps onto the wiki? The shitty ones that don't explain anything are there and I don't remember where the good ones went. >.> (Ie ones like the 3rd floor)

[divisortheory]

Random post but can someone put in the good Bhaf maps onto the wiki? The shitty ones that don't explain anything are there and I don't remember where the good ones went. >.> (Ie ones like the 3rd floor)

Maybe someday. In the meantime you can look at this guide I've created (especially the Strategy section), it doesn't have new maps but it does explain things a little better than what's already up there.

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/User:Divis ... u_Remnants

[safer]

Has everyone else been getting a shitload of bodies from bosses? We've gotten 5 cuirasses, 2 pairs of haidate, and 1 pair of ledelsens from LBC, and frankly we're pretty much out of people to give cuirasses to, but we kill LBC with 8 people usually.

care to give a brieft outline of party setup to kill with 8? i'd like to be able to attempt the boss even when we have low numbers attending

[divisortheory]

Has everyone else been getting a shitload of bodies from bosses? We've gotten 5 cuirasses, 2 pairs of haidate, and 1 pair of ledelsens from LBC, and frankly we're pretty much out of people to give cuirasses to, but we kill LBC with 8 people usually.

care to give a brieft outline of party setup to kill with 8? i'd like to be able to attempt the boss even when we have low numbers attending

We killed it with 10 with the strategy described here: http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/User:Divis ... s#Boss_Run

Take away the 2 extra melee (THF and DRG) and you have 8. It's really very easy, when we did this we had 1 death the entire time, and before LBC was at 40% nobody even went out of white HP.

[Not Kuno]

Holy crap that's awesome. I was so sad when the good maps were taken down because I dont give 3 craps what mobs are where I want to know what they drop cause the same mobs dont drop the same stuff always. It works great in stuff like Arra but not at Bhaf.

[Lindstrom]

We usually zerg at the beginning since it WS's less frequently above 25% and there's no real benefit as far as time goes to do it at the end. We also don't chainspell stun, and I've got a Gjallarhorn and I bounce parties so everyone gets songs so MP is fine while RNGs get their songs. Usually we go with that outlined strategy Kalia linked to, with BRD BLM BLM RNG RNG MNK WHM and maybe BLU or DRG or something, depending who shows up. Takes us probably 20-30 minutes, frequently getting the 10 minute warning after we distribute drops.

[Suiram]

Holy crap that's awesome. I was so sad when the good maps were taken down because I dont give 3 craps what mobs are where I want to know what they drop cause the same mobs dont drop the same stuff always. It works great in stuff like Arra but not at Bhaf.

I feel the same way, which is why whenever we've done a boss run in Bhaflau, I just open to page 5 of this thread and use Faranim's maps about halfway down. The 3rd floor map is the same one as the wiki, but it also has the 2nd floor, so it works out perfectly since 1st floor is easy to remember and 4th floor we skip (not much to fight anyway unless you're trying to pop rampart).

[divisortheory]

What did we decide about whether or not Flans can regain spikes after losing them? Is it possible?

[Lindstrom]

What did we decide about whether or not Flans can regain spikes after losing them? Is it possible?

Sometimes when they use WS it looks like they lose them and put them back up (though they have a specific animation to put them up, similarly to how wamouracampas/ghrahs/euvhis/etc stop to change position).

Don't really know for sure but it's no big deal if you just melee them from start to finish. Sucks for the melee resistant ones but it's nicer knowing you'll get the Rampart garunteed.