Bleach

[kuronosan]

Reviewing your old work to keep canonical consistency is something every writer has to do. That's what makes a good writer.

A bad writer, however, reviews their old work and still spits on the canon by changing it.

Lastly, none of the current Espada are VL (unless the top three are or one of them is) because that would defeat the threat of the Espada completely if they were and they all ended up dying.

Also, Grimmjow was stated to be an Adjuchas-class menos (as were most, including Nel and Nnoitora... after all, if they weren't, why would they be looking for them).

Another thing, for those stating that Barragan can't be a VL - remember that VLs only have a human-sized appearance... not a humanoid appearance. The more like a human they are when they release, the stronger they probably are. Just because Barragan has a skull for a face doesn't make him an Adjuchas - remember that Ichigo's inner hollow is easily VL level and he has a skull for a face.

Just wait until Kubo's next make-believe chapter. He'll explain it eventually. Hopefully I haven't given up on reading the series by then. I'm holding out for the conclusion to the captain fights.

[Souj]

Reviewing your old work to keep canonical consistency is something every writer has to do. That's what makes a good writer.

reviewing your work, and rereading your work because you forgot stuff are completely different. I could see for One Piece how some of the little details could be forgotten, but bleach isnt that big.

[Sho]

Lastly, none of the current Espada are VL (unless the top three are or one of them is) because that would defeat the threat of the Espada completely if they were and they all ended up dying.

That doesn't "defeat" any threat of the Espada if they are VL from a certain stand point. What happened in the past story is likened unto something that happened in Dragonball Z-- The Androids and Cell arriving on Earth. Assuming you've watched this or read the manga before, you'll remember that Trunks predicted (flat out told them due to coming from a messed up future) them coming to earth, and to be ready they should train (and if they didn't, the future would never change). Obviously this isnt the exact same thing happening, but you can see that there was an imminent threat on the way (Espada & Aizen), and that you are clued in that the Captains, Vizard, Ichigo, Urahara and Co. are all getting ready in their own ways.

Obviously 4 of them are, why not all? All of the current dead Espada were all killed off separately, so most of them never got the chance to attack in one big force to be as menacing as Hitsugaya predicted. I think people miss that fact a lot.

Also, Grimmjow was stated to be an Adjuchas-class menos (as were most, including Nel and Nnoitora... after all, if they weren't, why would they be looking for them).

We all know they were Adjuchas Menos from the flashbacks, yes. The fact now however is that all of them have taken on Humanoid appearances, and should be taken that they are Vastro Lorde now. What makes you say Grimmjow is still Adjuchas? Even in Grimmy's retelling of his past, you learn that he fed on Shawlong and the others so he would not regress into a Gillian and evolve... that is unless you don't believe going from looking like a panther to looking more like a human isn't going from Adjuchas to Vastro Lorde. Also there's the fact that Grimmjow (and the others) aren't really seen eating other hollow at all.

Another thing, for those stating that Barragan can't be a VL - remember that VLs only have a human-sized appearance... not a humanoid appearance. The more like a human they are when they release, the stronger they probably are. Just because Barragan has a skull for a face doesn't make him an Adjuchas - remember that Ichigo's inner hollow is easily VL level and he has a skull for a face.

This is also a misconception of a lot of people that I've seen amongst Bleach fans. They don't believe that something that's obviously LOOKING like a human could be a Vastro Lorde, based on the release. Indeed, there was never a time in the manga where anyone stated that the Arrancar's release is what classified them as a Adjuchas or a Vastro Lorde; it was all about the current appearance before release. And all of them looked mighty human in appearance (bipedal, upright stance, face, ears, etc and so on). If you think I'm wrong, please point out a time where someone in the story said a Vastro Lorde is a Vastro Lorde AFTER releasing their sword. Lets not miss the fact that all Gillian and Adjuchas we've seen so far don't even have swords at all.

People should think Arrancar's releases as the same as a Death God's (Soul Reaper) release, something that looks odd and/or spectacular, rather than a huge weapon and a human appearance-- as you just mentioned, on and about Barragan.

Kubo will explain it eventually indeed, but don't be surprised if he states that these are the Vastro Lorde everyone has been waiting on seeing-- they all look human in appearance, and they've all fought toe-to-toe with Captains, Vice-Captains, and Captain-Class opponents, confirming Hitsugaya's past explanation.

[Souj]

Sho, did you forget what you were posting and have to reread it half way through? cause that was looooooooooooooooooong.

[Sho]

Sho, did you forget what you were posting and have to reread it half way through? cause that was looooooooooooooooooong.

Oh nah, just minor syntax errors, lol. I blame Kubo at least, he never fucking made it clear what constitutes as a Gillian/Adjuchas/Vastro Lorde, outside of a broad discussion. I can think of at least 3 holes in my own theory, and 3 more holes to counter those 3 former holes.

[Souj]

oh, I didnt read what you wrote, I just the timing was right for that joke.

[CrimsonAngel]

Aren't the espada human looking beacuse they are arrancar? but then again to counter my own theory i guess Grand Fisher wasn't very human looking but still an arrancar.

And on Grimmjow & Company not eating Hollows, i thought somewhere in the manga it was said or implied that after arrancarisation they didnt need to eat hollows to keep from reverting back to Gillian?

[Pharaun]

Aren't the espada human looking beacuse they are arrancar? but then again to counter my own theory i guess Grand Fisher wasn't very human looking but still an arrancar.

And on Grimmjow & Company not eating Hollows, i thought somewhere in the manga it was said or implied that after arrancarisation they didnt need to eat hollows to keep from reverting back to Gillian?

Grand Fisher was an incomplete arrancar. He was one of the first test subjects that Aizen used when he went to HM, so using him as a counter is a flawed example. Your first assumption is the correct one.

[kuronosan]

Early Spoilers:

Spoiler: show

Barragan uses "Rot Breath", which decomposes anything it touches. Omaeda and Soi-fon dodge but Soi-fon's arm is caught. The scenery around them is decomposing and Soi-fon yells for Omaeda to cut off her arm. He does so.

Switches to Hitsugaya... he boasts that because he controls all the moisture he has the advantage over Halibel... he forms a massive ice attack but she sends it back to him with a massive water attack. Hitsu is again blown away.

Nothing new.

[Epysian]

Yeah, the Espada look human because they are Arrancar, not because of their previous evolution of hollows. The Resurrection is not something spectacular like a Shinigami's release. Instead it "resurrects" the Arrancar's hollow abilities, giving them a similar form to when they were hollows. Grimm's flashback showed he was a panther-like adjuchas, and his release was a Panther.

The Espada that have been defeated were not Vastro Lorde. If there are Vastro Lorde amongst the Espada, their release would look human. At least, that's what I assume from Hitsugaya's description of the Vastro Lorde. Also, if that level of hollow is supposed to be captain strength, and Arrancar's powers are greatly increased from their original hollow form, how on earth would they be defeated by mid tier captains like Zaraki or Byakua?

[kuronosan]

That doesn't "defeat" any threat of the Espada if they are VL from a certain stand point. What happened in the past story is likened unto something that happened in Dragonball Z-- The Androids and Cell arriving on Earth. Assuming you've watched this or read the manga before, you'll remember that Trunks predicted (flat out told them due to coming from a messed up future) them coming to earth, and to be ready they should train (and if they didn't, the future would never change). Obviously this isnt the exact same thing happening, but you can see that there was an imminent threat on the way (Espada & Aizen), and that you are clued in that the Captains, Vizard, Ichigo, Urahara and Co. are all getting ready in their own ways.

This is actually more akin to Trunks "achieving" his level beyond a regular SSj. He thought he had surpassed both Cell and Vegeta. Turns out he was more powerful, but not stronger overall. I guess this is what you're trying to point out. That point fails, however, because it doesn't take into account that we'd have to believe that Rukia and Ishida and Renji are both far beyond Captain level. If you're really going by what Hitsu says, then the VLs should all be above Captain level. We know Renji is Captain Level. We know that Ishida is probably at Ichigo's level (without hollow). We know Rukia defeated Kaien's form, which was stated to be a gillian-level form. More on this in a moment.

Obviously 4 of them are, why not all? All of the current dead Espada were all killed off separately, so most of them never got the chance to attack in one big force to be as menacing as Hitsugaya predicted. I think people miss that fact a lot.

Because if you were to read the same Bleach the rest of us are reading, you would already know that Arroneirio is a gillian (as stated by Zomari). You would also know that the all of Grimmjow's fraccion (except for D-roy) were Gillian-level prior to transformation. Now I've no doubt that the remaining Espada (and the recent ones) all were the level of VLs post-release. They were not VLs before being transformed.

We all know they were Adjuchas Menos from the flashbacks, yes. The fact now however is that all of them have taken on Humanoid appearances, and should be taken that they are Vastro Lorde now. What makes you say Grimmjow is still Adjuchas? Even in Grimmy's retelling of his past, you learn that he fed on Shawlong and the others so he would not regress into a Gillian and evolve... that is unless you don't believe going from looking like a panther to looking more like a human isn't going from Adjuchas to Vastro Lorde. Also there's the fact that Grimmjow (and the others) aren't really seen eating other hollow at all.

As stated before by others, Espada are all humanoid because the more powerful the hollow and more complete the transformation, the more humanoid their appearance afterwards. I believe it was also stated that Adjuchas and above hollows are the most common (see Shawlong, Ilforte, etc), while gillians have a more monstrous appearance (see D-roy, Iceringer, etc). VL hollows have the most stable size and release, which are supposed to mimic each other very well in size. It is implied that Grimmjow hasn't reached his limit yet and can still grow, while the rest were stopped at Adjuchas level.

This is also a misconception of a lot of people that I've seen amongst Bleach fans. They don't believe that something that's obviously LOOKING like a human could be a Vastro Lorde, based on the release. Indeed, there was never a time in the manga where anyone stated that the Arrancar's release is what classified them as a Adjuchas or a Vastro Lorde; it was all about the current appearance before release. And all of them looked mighty human in appearance (bipedal, upright stance, face, ears, etc and so on). If you think I'm wrong, please point out a time where someone in the story said a Vastro Lorde is a Vastro Lorde AFTER releasing their sword. Lets not miss the fact that all Gillian and Adjuchas we've seen so far don't even have swords at all.

Gillian - Arlieri - had sword; D-Roy - had sword
Adjuchas - Dordonii, Shawlong, Ilforte, all had swords.

I don't think you have been reading the same Bleach I have. Then you would see how incredibly flawed your theory is. A few of the current espada (possibly even one or two) are or have to be VL level (such as Stark or Ulquiorra). There is no possible way all of them are. It's never even been inferred or implied.

People should think Arrancar's releases as the same as a Death God's (Soul Reaper) release, something that looks odd and/or spectacular, rather than a huge weapon and a human appearance-- as you just mentioned, on and about Barragan.

Kubo will explain it eventually indeed, but don't be surprised if he states that these are the Vastro Lorde everyone has been waiting on seeing-- they all look human in appearance, and they've all fought toe-to-toe with Captains, Vice-Captains, and Captain-Class opponents, confirming Hitsugaya's past explanation.

Except they're not odd and spectacular. They restore a portion of their original hollow form and give them access to their powers. And I would be very surprised if Kubo revealed that to be true, as it would make the vast majority of the story he has told so far completely implausible.

[Imitarate]

If you want to know what a VL looks like, look at Ichigo's Hollow. IT LOOKS LIKE HIM BUT HOLLOW-COLORED. This is what they mean by "human looking" Vast Lord. When an arrancar is made, the destruction of the mask pushes the arrancar towards a more human form. For the most part, it's a very slight evolution. The Hog...Hyok... Plot Tchochke allows a much more complete and controlled creation of arrancar, so you see arrancar with human forms. It doesn't mean their pre-arrancar forms were human-like. Looking at releases, the only VLs I'd believe at 1 2 3 and 4 (yes, I fully believe that Ichigo's SSJ2 beat up a VL because hell, Aizen's more powerful than any VL and Ichigo has to beat him too right? Not like the 1000 year old Supreme General could ever be so strong as a 15 year old japanese high school student).

[Odesseiron]

All this Vasto Lord nonsense aside, aside from the SHITTY 6 minutes of recap, Hisagi's fight was definitely the best so far out of all these Karakura Town fights.

[trinironnie]

Well done on new ep fight ^_^b!
Bleach Episode 219 | Watch Bleach Episode 219 Anime Show online

[Epysian]

All this Vasto Lord nonsense aside, aside from the SHITTY 6 minutes of recap, Hisagi's fight was definitely the best so far out of all these Karakura Town fights.

Oh yeah, normally I just stream the episodes, but I might actually download this one and keep it. Good fight after all the recap for the ADD kids who watch this show.

[Wolfknight]

Well done on new ep fight ^_^b!
Bleach Episode 219 | Watch Bleach Episode 219 Anime Show online

yea it was very well done, Seeing his Shikai was an impressive one for sure.

[Scythiroth]

This week's episode was actually pretty awesome. I'm glad I can't complain about Bleach for once. Well, until this week's manga anyways.

[Mach6]

And on Grimmjow & Company not eating Hollows, i thought somewhere in the manga it was said or implied that after arrancarisation they didnt need to eat hollows to keep from reverting back to Gillian?

I hate to be rude but you are E.Black, am i correct?

[CrimsonAngel]

I hate to be rude but you are E.Black, am i correct?

Yes, but just how the hell would you know that?

[kuronosan]

Brace for drama. Out of the thread please, it has no place here.