Bleach

[Guitarman]

You expected Tousen to be a badass without vaizard when all we've really seen is his ass get beat by Kenpachi really quick?

I certainly wasn't "force fed" Tousen being a badass...lol. If you were angry that Touson/Gin/whoever having vaizard powers, you should have been mad like....a year+ ago? Pretty fucking obvious since then, imo.

You sir, are ...I don't know...not bright?

All this being said, it looks more like he is going to remove his glasses and open his eyes to me, but I'm sure he is also a vaizard lol.

he cuts off grimmjow's arm without blinking an eye, his presence walking around hueco mundo seems to put the espada on edge, and this entire time gin and tousen are presented as aizen's right hand men, seemingly above all the espada in power. And you call me brainless? Moron. It's called implied. And who hasn't gotten their ass beat quickly by Zaraki, except the main character? Hardly a qualifier for weakness.

Edit: and it's not "anger" that you and khajit seem so keen on pegging me with. It's more "ungh, lame". It's hardly unrealistic to want to see something new to progress the story a bit more than "lol imma vaizard too!".

[Souj]

he cuts off grimmjow's arm without blinking an eye, his presence walking around hueco mundo seems to put the espada on edge, and this entire time gin and tousen are presented as aizen's right hand men, seemingly above all the espada in power. And you call me brainless? Moron. It's called implied.

Edit: and it's not "anger" that you and khajit seem so keen on pegging me with. It's more "ungh, lame".

who seemed to be on edge when Tousen was around?
and the only reason tousen got away with cutting off grimmjaw's arm was because Aizen was there.

[Weltall]

he cuts off grimmjow's arm without blinking an eye, his presence walking around hueco mundo seems to put the espada on edge, and this entire time gin and tousen are presented as aizen's right hand men, seemingly above all the espada in power. And you call me brainless? Moron. It's called implied. And who hasn't gotten their ass beat quickly by Zaraki, except the main character? Hardly a qualifier for weakness.

Edit: and it's not "anger" that you and khajit seem so keen on pegging me with. It's more "ungh, lame". It's hardly unrealistic to want to see something new to progress the story a bit more than "lol imma vaizard too!".

1. ^, what Souj said above.

2. Wouldn't you think, if you were intelligent, that going from, "got my ass beat bad my kenpachi" to "ripping dude's arm off instantly" would be because Aizen gave him Vaizard powers....I mean....just maybe? (obviously????)

Fight on intelligence, fight on!

[Guitarman]

1. ^, what Souj said above.

2. Wouldn't you think, if you were intelligent, that going from, "got my ass beat bad my kenpachi" to "ripping dude's arm off instantly" would be because Aizen gave him Vaizard powers....I mean....just maybe? (obviously????)

Fight on intelligence, fight on!

yay for assumptions! that makes me smart!

since you seem to read only select bits and pieces, as i said above, getting your ass beat by zaraki is hardly a qualifier for weakness. He's one of, if not the most powerful character in the series.

and now that i sat and thought about it, i take back the vaizard part. I'm betting it's not the mask, but a whole-body transformation that ichigo went through with ulqiorra. It would be enough to set them apart from the espada, since aizen seems to dump anyone he deems not strong enough (see halibel), and would make them above the vaizards, seeing as they only have their masks.

[Souj]

1. ^, what Souj said above.

2. Wouldn't you think, if you were intelligent, that going from, "got my ass beat bad my kenpachi" to "ripping dude's arm off instantly" would be because Aizen gave him Vaizard powers....I mean....just maybe? (obviously????)

Fight on intelligence, fight on!

eh... I'm not saying Tousen was able to take Grimmjaw's arm because he has vizard powers.
I'm saying Grimmjaw thought he would have been beat down by Aizen if he took any action against Tousen whatsoever.
please don't twist my words to conform to your argument.

you say intelligence, but there's no such thing as intelligence when it comes to speculation. best you can get with speculation is a sound argument.

[Weltall]

I was agreeing; Tousen could only do that to Grim because Aizen was there. Grim would have at least put up a fight otherwise.

I also think he has Vaizard powers, be it a mask or full body makes no difference.

[kuronosan]

1. ^, what Souj said above.

2. Wouldn't you think, if you were intelligent, that going from, "got my ass beat bad my kenpachi" to "ripping dude's arm off instantly" would be because Aizen gave him Vaizard powers....I mean....just maybe? (obviously????)

Fight on intelligence, fight on!

Considering at the time the vizard weren't totally introduced, I'm sure most people didn't think that at all, no. And he didn't rip Grimmjow's arm off. He caught him off-guard and cut it clean off with his sword.

What an achiever you are.

[Cleverness]

Who cares if it was off guard, Arrancar hierro is their skin, on their bodies. They don't just turn their skin on. And while it wasn't released Grimmjow's arm he cut off, it was the 5th Espada's arm he cut nonetheless, without trying, without Grimmjow being able to stop it.

[kuronosan]

And Gran Rey Cero is the most powerful cero an Espada can use, Ulquiorra's the only one with two releases, Aizen won't have to lift a finger to win in Karakura Town, Zomari is the fastest, blah blah blah.

If you're holding onto "but grimmjow had hierro lol" you're forgetting what manga you're reading.

it was the 5th Espada's arm he cut nonetheless

You must already be forgetting. Grimmjow is the 6th Espada. I mean, what the hell are you reading? Ichigo cut off Yammy's arm with no problem when they first met and he didn't have his mask yet. Now Ichigo's half-powered Getsuga point blank to Yammy's neck can't even scratch him when it was enough to not only scar Grimmjow but overwhelm Ulquiorra?

Your argument is retarded.

[Souj]

Yanjirobi cut vegeta with a sword. Yanjirobe must be tronger than Vegeta.

[kuronosan]

Come on, it was the Prince of Saiyans versus Yajirobe. Yajirobe is a fucking beast with a sword. It doesn't matter if Vegeta was Super Saiyan or not; if his ki was greater than Yajirobe's he would have repelled the attack completely with a mere fart.

Yajirobe >>> Vegeta and Krillin >>>>>> Frieza 2nd form

[Souj]

Yajirobe >>> Vegeta and Krillin >>>>>> Frieza 2nd form

and since vegeta can beat krillin, that means that Yajirobe can beat Frieza.

[Max™]

He's totally going full retard next issue, like Ichgo did against Ulquiorra.

[kuronosan]

I just can't see how this is in character for Tousen. In the beginning all he talked about was justice this, justice that, walking the path of least bloodshed, filthy demons, etc... then he lets Aizen turn him into a hybrid?

What a hypocrite. Scratch that - it would have made more sense for Gin to be a vizard. This just seems like a plotkai to make Tousen not look weak since Kenpachi handed his ass to him back in soul society and Komamura has yet to seriously fight somebody.

I mean, they've already shown everything Tousen can do, so this power-up does make sense in the scheme of "my powa is bettuh den yourz powah" that Kubo has been regurgitating. In the overall sense of the plot it just seems poorly contrived and rushed.

It's a "Oh, that was the problem all long?" moment, similar to Ichigo being at only half power this entire time Orihimme has been healing him.

"Oh, lol, this whole time you've been fighting you've been weaker than you were when you entered because Orihimme doesn't fix your reiatsu lol but it wasn't important enough to mention until now because this is the only time you went bankai and your clothes were messed up" can only go so far to suspend disbelief in a manga.

There are so many problems with the plot right now that to list them all in a fashion that would be respectful to the author would take more time than I care to dedicate while I'm standing around at work.

[Drex]

an action anime has plot issues? i, too, am in shock

[Sho]

I just can't see how this is in character for Tousen. In the beginning all he talked about was justice this, justice that, walking the path of least bloodshed, filthy demons, etc... then he lets Aizen turn him into a hybrid?

What a hypocrite. Scratch that - it would have made more sense for Gin to be a vizard. This just seems like a plotkai to make Tousen not look weak since Kenpachi handed his ass to him back in soul society and Komamura has yet to seriously fight somebody.

I mean, they've already shown everything Tousen can do, so this power-up does make sense in the scheme of "my powa is bettuh den yourz powah" that Kubo has been regurgitating. In the overall sense of the plot it just seems poorly contrived and rushed.

It's a "Oh, that was the problem all long?" moment, similar to Ichigo being at only half power this entire time Orihimme has been healing him.

"Oh, lol, this whole time you've been fighting you've been weaker than you were when you entered because Orihimme doesn't fix your reiatsu lol but it wasn't important enough to mention until now because this is the only time you went bankai and your clothes were messed up" can only go so far to suspend disbelief in a manga.

There are so many problems with the plot right now that to list them all in a fashion that would be respectful to the author would take more time than I care to dedicate while I'm standing around at work.

XD Don't take it too hard bro; remember the target demographic for Bleach's readers in Japan, the people who Kubo is writing for mainly. This is standard in Shounen fashion. When you remember that, the plotline becomes more bearable

[Max™]

Still, condense the badass moments of Bleach, you'll end up with like 1/15th the issues, but man it would ROCK!

[bechyni]

Kinda ontopicis, Bleach:Memories of Nobody came on last night on Adult Swim. Was pretty good but it showed Ichigo going bankai and it was released in 2006..has it really been that long..?

[arus2001]

More or less. Yay minimalist weekly releases with it feeling like Japan has a holiday every other week.

[Souj]

Kinda ontopicis, Bleach:Memories of Nobody came on last night on Adult Swim. Was pretty good but it showed Ichigo going bankai and it was released in 2006..has it really been that long..?

heh, a couple pages ago I went back 200 pages into this thread. Nov2007 is when, in the manga, byakuya, unohana, kenpachi and kurosutchi made their appearance in HM. yes, it's been a very long time.