Bleach

[Xno Kappa]

I just don't see the point to even bring it up. His full-bring abilities were a derivative of White that were manifested through his substitute badge for a short period of time and are now gone.

He doesn't have White's or any ability whatsoever because of full-bring, he had full-bring abilities because of White.

[Uzor]

His fullbring abilities and white is pretty much one and the same, yes. His White still makes him a fullbring, though. Eat I'm saying is that it's that one that helps him materialize the sword. You're arguing semantics.

[Sho]

I just don't see the point to even bring it up. His full-bring abilities were a derivative of White that were manifested through his substitute badge for a short period of time and are now gone.

He doesn't have White's or any ability whatsoever because of full-bring, he had full-bring abilities because of White.

At the same time you can see how someone could make the same argument in favor of Full-bring. Full-bring exists in the same vain as Hollow power in humans. So as long as he has White's power, he will also have full-bring, as it's a derivative. The badge isn't really the only item that could manifest full-bring power, it was just a plot device for the story.

However, I agree that he doesn't have any ability because of full-bring, but because of White.

I only made the connection to Full-bring power because of how Kubo worded the end of the recent (Isshin) gaiden story-- he made it an explicit note to separate Shinigami, "Human", Quincy, and Hollow, which were all passed down to Ichigo. Full-bring is the "Human" connection. Really though, you could poke holes in my theory however, starting with Isshin. Was Isshin still a Shinigami when he helped birth Ichigo? Or just a simple Human? He lost his powers at that point.

[kuronosan]

His fullbring abilities and white is pretty much one and the same, yes. His White still makes him a fullbring, though. Eat I'm saying is that it's that one that helps him materialize the sword. You're arguing semantics.

When a chapter comes that shows you are correct, I will be the first to tell you.

[Uzor]

At the same time you can see how someone could make the same argument in favor of Full-bring. Full-bring exists in the same vain as Hollow power in humans. So as long as he has White's power, he will also have full-bring, as it's a derivative. The badge isn't really the only item that could manifest full-bring power, it was just a plot device for the story.

However, I agree that he doesn't have any ability because of full-bring, but because of White.

And I agree, it is because of the White. Like I said; it acted as an Asauchi for him. Reason I mention Fullbring is because I consider that Kubo's term for a human using Hollow powers, or a human that has manifested Hollow powers, in the same way that a Visored is a term for a Shinigami using Hollow powers, or who has manifested Hollow powers. Fullbring, White, it's one and the same in Ichigo's case.

Personally, I believe the Vandenreich might be Quincy's with Hollow powers, so the Visored of the Quincy community, making Ichigo a human-Quincy-Shinigami-Fullbring-Visored-Vandenreich hybrid!

Edit: although I suppose the Vandenreich is their empire, but whatever they would be could be part-Quincy-part-Hollow. There's nothing (besides their extreme power) to suggest they have learned to obtain Hollow powers, but it seems like something Kubo would to to make the circle complete. They hate Hollows, but I don't think they would mind doing it to take down something they hate even more.

[arus2001]

White's just a unique case of Fullbring since it's more than your average hollow that attacked a kid's parent(s) and left some residual. In general, though, we've kind of had hybrids of the various "types" of beings yielding certain things.

Shinigami + Hollow = Vaizard
Human + Hollow = Fullbring
Shingami + Quincy = ??? with Ichigo and his sisters as the only known examples. Perhaps Bach given his implied relationship to SS.
Shinigami + Human= ??? with Ichigo and his sisters as the only known examples
Hollow + Quincy = ???
Human + Quincy = Probably becomes one or the other depending on parentage/luck.

While never outright spoken, we can probably presume Chad and Orihime to be Fullbringers with their reverence of the coin and hairpin respectively. Ishida lucked out on the Human/Quincy mix given his heritage, but we were never told if his mom was some degree of Quincy, either. When Ichigo went FGT on Aizen, who was probably a fully integrated Vaizard thanks to the hogyoku, he was presumably a firm mix of Human/Hollow/Shinigami, no doubt contributed to Aizen's confusion in being unable to sense him properly since 3 > 2.

Still of the mind Engetsu and GT being used on White tainting Ichigo's unconscious manifestation of his zanpakutou, though. What he had simply wasn't White imitating an asauchi or even Quincy powers playing parrot. He had all three influencing on some level, with maybe even the human aspect playing a role somewhere.

[Sho]

And I agree, it is because of the White. Like I said; it acted as an Asauchi for him. Reason I mention Fullbring is because I consider that Kubo's term for a human using Hollow powers, or a human that has manifested Hollow powers, in the same way that a Visored is a term for a Shinigami using Hollow powers, or who has manifested Hollow powers. Fullbring, White, it's one and the same in Ichigo's case.

Personally, I believe the Vandenreich might be Quincy's with Hollow powers, so the Visored of the Quincy community, making Ichigo a human-Quincy-Shinigami-Fullbring-Visored-Vandenreich hybrid!

Edit: although I suppose the Vandenreich is their empire, but whatever they would be could be part-Quincy-part-Hollow

Remains to be seen. Kubo might not even mention Fullbring ever again, since it was its own plot device only created to give back Ichigo's shinigami power. That would make us both wrong. I see Fullbring power as it's own, different from Hollow, specifically for the purpose of giving Humans a connection in the overall story.

[Xno Kappa]

White and full-bring are not the same thing, that was my point. One is the basis of Ichigo's zanpaktou and the other is a derivative ability that's no longer present.

I don't know how much clearer I can make it. Call the badge a plot-device if you want, but Ichigo's full-bring was manifested and lost during one arc and one arc only until Kubo states otherwise. It has absolutely no connection to anything else for Ichigo.

[Alarial]

I don't know.

The more I think of it, I don't buy the White/Quincy powers just immitating Shinigama powers. If White was very similar to a normal Zanpactu spirit, then Ichigo didn't just "immitate" becoming a real Soul Reaper when he did his training with Urahara, he actually became a real one. He just happened to use white as his assauchi. Typically a Zanpactu will manifest itself as the focused concious power of your spirit, so White manifested itself as Ichigo's Zanpactu in the form of Ichigo's spirit energy - Bach.

That doesn't really explain why all his SR powers mimic his father, but I guess that's just a "bloodline" thing. We don't really have any information on how other SR's get their Zanpactu or become Soul Reapers, or if their Zanpactus tend to mimic their mother/father.

Also, if White was his Zanpactu all along, and his new Zanpactu looks like White.. Is he just going to get all the same abilities again? I hope not =/.

We still don't know why/how this even helps. He'll have to potentially re-learn a Bankai, which can potentially be stolen, and his Quincy side powers may make him even more susceptible to Bach.

Maybe Kenny will just save the day.

[Uzor]

No, it isn't the same. But, like I said in the post you quoted, it is the same in Ichigo's case. The White is what give Ichigo his fullbring powers.

Wouldn't say it necessarily only lasted one arc. In the Fullbringer arc, he had to learn to use them with his own Reiatsu, whereas earlier he used them with his Shinigami Reiatsu. He lost those, and instead had to learn to use it in another way. Later, he regained his Shinigami powers and could instead use them in the way he had always been.

I retread the chapter where we learned Ichigo is a Quincy, and Bach states he awakened his Quincy powers when he was attacked by a pure-blood Quincy, which seem to suggest he didn't have them before.

[Guitarman]

. Ishida lucked out on the Human/Quincy mix given his heritage, but we were never told if his mom was some degree of Quincy, either.

I think it was mentioned at some point a few chapters ago that Katagiri was a half-blood, hence why she wasn't picked to be Ryuken's wife.

@Alarial

Good lord dude. Zanpaktou and Shinigami. Not Zanpakutu and Shinigama. Sorry but my eye twitches a little bit every time you post lol.

[Sho]

Fuck it. Kenpachi will save the day regardless.

[Serra]

Yeah.. not really seeing how White = Fullbring. Fullbrings were people whose mothers were attacked by a Hollow, right? White is something completely different. It was artificially created by Aizen, more or less in its entirety infected Masaki, and then seemed to pass to Ichigo.

[Guitarman]

Fuck it. Kenpachi will save the day regardless.

This we can all agree on.

[Xno Kappa]

I'm done.

This full-bring nonsense is almost as dumb as that one time in the Naruto thread someone seriously suggested Tobi could be Sasuke's mom.

[Uzor]

Yeah.. not really seeing how White = Fullbring. Fullbrings were people whose mothers were attacked by a Hollow, right? White is something completely different. It was artificially created by Aizen, more or less in its entirety infected Masaki, and then seemed to pass to Ichigo.

Yes, except Ichigo's mom presumably wasn't attacked by a Hollow while Ichigo was in the stomach. In Ichigo's case, it was because of his White. Or at least that's what's assumed, was it ever stated otherwise? Like his father said, Ichigo's mom was far from weak. I doubt a Hollow would have been able to get close enough to her to damage her.

I do agree in the Kenpachi part. He will save the day now that he can hear his sword.

[Sho]

White and full-bring are not the same thing, that was my point. One is the basis of Ichigo's zanpaktou and the other is a derivative ability that's no longer present.

I don't know how much clearer I can make it. Call the badge a plot-device if you want, but Ichigo's full-bring was manifested and lost during one arc and one arc only until Kubo states otherwise. It has absolutely no connection to anything else for Ichigo.

I understood that, which is why I stated they were two separate powers. I did mean to say however-- if you're a human with hollow powers, you'd have both. Or it could be likely. We'll see eventually. Kenpachi save us przu.

[Abandon]

Good god, there's no hope for you. First of, I don't know which post you're referring to. Secondly, I don't know what this imaginary "no" is that I supposedly argue against in said post. Seriously, you are by far the most thick-headed person I've ever seen on BG, and I'm not going to bother answering to your trolling attempts in the future.

it is typical practice to respond to the post directly above yours without quotes. If that is a custom that you are alien to, I apologize; I know it can be difficult for people with certain disabilities to conform to that which can be considered "normal."

That being said, the amount of anger you show towards me is fucking hilarious.

[Uzor]

Then your post makes no sense. Got it. What you said, then, is

you literally answered the question with "no", then used the very thing you said no to, in your response

In response to

Nothing, thats not what I said. What I said was that he White is what Ichigo used as the core of his own version of a Asauchi to give his sword a personality. Fullbring and Quincy is what gave him his power, abilities and what manifested as his sword. And since an Asauchi (or White, in Ichigo's case) take on a personality and power of its owner's soul, Zangetsu (or his White, so to speak) took the shape of Bach, as he is a Quincy, while his fullbring powers gives him the sword. Or that's my theory, at least.

What part am I contradicting? The nothing part is in response to Fullbring having nothing to do with Oetsu forging Ichigo's sword. The rest is in no way contradicting that statement. As a matter of fact, nowhere have I ever stated that Oetsu is using fullbring to create Ichigo's sword, so I'm not sure why he would even suggest that.

So, I'll repeat. You're dense.

[kuronosan]

No, it isn't the same. But, like I said in the post you quoted, it is the same in Ichigo's case. The White is what give Ichigo his fullbring powers.

Wouldn't say it necessarily only lasted one arc. In the Fullbringer arc, he had to learn to use them with his own Reiatsu, whereas earlier he used them with his Shinigami Reiatsu. He lost those, and instead had to learn to use it in another way. Later, he regained his Shinigami powers and could instead use them in the way he had always been.

I retread the chapter where we learned Ichigo is a Quincy, and Bach states he awakened his Quincy powers when he was attacked by a pure-blood Quincy, which seem to suggest he didn't have them before.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrgh