Console Battle: Wii vs 360 vs Ps3

[Exoduso]

BRP, we have yet to see a Wii game that actually didn't have 2D graphics/wasn't a GCN port... how do you know what it's actually capable of?

I do agree with you, however, that the VC is pretty weak at the moment... at least the VC in Japan is pumping out good titles week in and week out, we're only getting a good title once in a while (and there are only really two or three games that are currently out that are worth purchasing, if you don't have the original consoles/roms anymore.

But the VC's got the potential to do what the marketplace on the 360 does... which lets people download upgrades/updates/other stuff to current games... if they do that, the VC will be a lot better. (the PS3 store should do the same as well, really... it's horrible at the moment, especially since you can't keep doing things while you're downloading something. )

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

A) Why wouldn't they? The Wii has 512 MB. With a few(and I mean few) game saves, channels, and just as few games, it becomes completely or nearly maxed out rather quickly. Allow people to play right off the card solves this issue almost entirely. Well, it would very nice if they fixed the horrible data-transferring process, the wait time on a NES game transferring to card is absolutely ridiculous.

B) I got two answers to this. Sentence 1: Oh cool, buying, just fine. However there is an issue, they are practically making pay for double the worth of what you are actually getting. Oh friendly Nintendo, the guys you grew up with, the underdog, the REAL gamer right? So far their appearance this gen has been nothing but greedy. Oh, I have no problem with a company trying to make money, but if anyone claims Sony of being greedy or Microsoft then what are they smoking? Nintendo is selling a last-gen console in terms of costs and performance and charging it at a price of a next-gen console. They also get their kicks by selling year and year old games double to four times their worth. They are going to make a lot of money, but so much for "Nintendo, the one who UNDERSTANDS me". I can't wait until the loop begins again and it's Nintendo talking trash like Sony and fucking up launches(well, nevermind they did that while they were the underdog too).

Sentence 2: What they promised? They didn't promise anything, but they loved to made it seemed they promised a lot. Sometimes even blatantly lying about the VC. When asked about online play and new features in interviews, no one said no back when people were hyped about the console. It was always a maybe or a comment that nodded toward a likely yes. They even showed people playing old games with motion sensor, like Mario jumping with a moving the controller up. If they didn't hype it so hard, I would be less critical.

C) I'm pretty sure they were hyping the idea that people will be able to make their own games and release them to each other using "Connect24".

Pirating has a very small effect on my opinion itself. Its really the people who are behind the emulators. It's sad that they can outperform Nintendo at no cost with their own games and consoles.

VC sucks, this is my opinion and I'm happy to supply why. You can say I'm crying all you like, but I think just as negatively as people who like to defend it. What, is Nintendo sending you your checks in the mail? I can't speak for everyone, but if you guys showed Sony and Microsoft half the slave-love you show Nintendo there wouldn't be a console war thread.

A) You can put it on SD cards (not even proprietary ones, real, normal SD cards), you just cant use it on other systems. If you could, what would stop people from just downloading games from the internet onto the card and using it with the Wii? Nothing. Don't be retarded here.
B) Worth is determined by individual people, which is why saying 600 bucks being cheap for the PS3 is absolutely right...for the person who said it. Compare 8 bucks for gunstar heroes with the cost of the cartridge, its comparable.
You dont understand PR speak. We're 3 months in, of course they're only going to deliver what they said they'd deliver and not what they also hinted at. Wait a while, we don't know what they have planned for the future. You seriously expected this stuff on release?
C) They weren't, they mentioned it as a possibility like once in some random magazine interview.

VC sucks, this is my opinion and I'm happy to supply why.

Because you havent given it any thought. Anyways, if you wont shut up, please just keep setting up these dominoes for me to topple. I get some perverted pleasure in destroying people's retarded arguements.

But the VC's got the potential to do what the marketplace on the 360 does... which lets people download upgrades/updates/other stuff to current games... if they do that, the VC will be a lot better.

Don't even give them the CHANCE to add microtransactions goddamnit.

[Fade]

Excuse my ignorance, but what exactly do PS3 owners have to look forward to? What are the killer ap, must have, system selling games coming exclusively to the PS3?

All I can think of:
MGS (2008?)
FFXIII (no idea)
Lair looks interesting but it could very easily suck
Gran Turismo (2008?)

With simultaneous launch of GTA4 on the 360 and with rumours of DMC coming to the 360, I'm seeing less and less reasons to choose PS3 over 360 if one is looking at games alone.

Don't trust any rumors until you get confirmation from the actual developers so until then MGS and DMC you can count as PS3 exclusives or at the very least timed exclusives and GTA4 I heard that the 360 and PS3 version will each have their own exclusive content.

Hmm other then those you listed already I'm interested in:
Heavenly Sword
Final Fantasy versus 13 (I'm more excited about this game then the regular FF13)
Ninja Gaiden Sigma (upgraded version of the Xbox game with other extras I never played the Xbox version so this is must have for me)
White Knight Story (trailer looks badass that's all I know about it)
Motor Storm
Tekken 6

Those are the only games that have been announced that interest me but I'm sure Sony has God of War 3 and Socom game in the works that hasn't been annouced yet and I'll be buying those also when they come out. Plus PS systems have been the main JRPG system the last 2 console wars so I expect to see alot of them down the road that haven't been announced yet especially since 360 is not doing so well in Japan. There's going to be less exclusives this generation of console wars but there's just enough of them for me to still warrant the price of purchasing all 3 systems.

[zoobernut]

Correct me if I am wrong but isnt this thread about console wars? I thought this thread was NOT about which system we personally liked better or thought was most fun but rather which one we subjectively thought would do best in overall sales and profit.

If this in fact is what this thread is about then BRP your arguements against VC is fundamentally flawed because the bottom line is whatever issues you have with it are your own issues and there are millions of people out there downloading millions of games from VC and no matter how you slice that it is successful. And in this world of games the bottom line is money and as long as VC is still making money they will continue to add content to it and as long as they add content to it the people who are already downloading games from it will continue to download more.

I have tried as much to examine each system in an unbiased way based on the games comming out for them and the performance of the system to date to form my opinion on how they will do. And when I do that I cannot help but feel like even if some people do not like the wii overall it is quite successful in its first few months of release. Like it was mentioned before the ps3 and xbox360 really do appeal to the hardcore gamer but the wii taps into a playerbase that for the most part has been alienated by video games.

[aurik]

B) I got two answers to this. Sentence 1: Oh cool, buying, just fine. However there is an issue, they are practically making pay for double the worth of what you are actually getting.
...

Pirating has a very small effect on my opinion itself. Its really the people who are behind the emulators. It's sad that they can outperform Nintendo at no cost with their own games and consoles.

The reason why people who write emulators can outperform Nintendo at no cost:
1) they don't need to pay to develop content
2) they don't need to pay for licensing
3) they don't have to worry about protecting content from mass piracy
4) they get something out of it -- programming experience and a fun hobby.
5) since they have zero financial liability they don't need to account for financial risk

Also, who are you to say what something is worth? You have no idea how much $ was spent on R&D for VC, running the servers, licensing the old games, etc. Do you have figures on their margins on VC, and how much they sunk to get those margins? No. You're just babbling with no idea of the actual financials.

You as a consumer have the right to not purchase VC games if they don't feel worth it to you. As a consumer you really have 3 choices: you pay what they ask for what they offer, you don't pay what they ask and forgo what they offer, or you attempt to negotiate a better price. However there's a large class of people just like you that won't even pay $5 for a really good classic game (less than you'd pay for a meal at mcdonalds) mainly because you expect it for free. And that's why you think VC is crap: you already get this and more for free by "stealing". And Nintendo has no incentive to appeal to you, because no matter how good their offer is, there's always someone willing to break copyright laws to bring it to you for less, and you'll always hold Nintendo to that impossible standard.

For people like me who prefer to live honest, VC is a convenient and cheap way to play golden oldie games without stealing, and its awesome that they're bringing out the games we want to play.

[BRP]

BRP, we have yet to see a Wii game that actually didn't have 2D graphics/wasn't a GCN port... how do you know what it's actually capable of?

Its not so much as weak as it is weak compared to its competitors. I don't care a lot of about graphics, I'm just pointing out how much money Wii is making and how Nintendo isn't cutting any slack compared to the other consoles who are actually giving the players more(despite Nintendo always being looked at some type of holy friend of gamers).

I mean Zelda, wooo. But I think when the nostalgia dies down, more people are going to start to agree with me, without online play or Wii motion, VC is not worth it.

But the VC's got the potential to do what the marketplace on the 360 does... which lets people download upgrades/updates/other stuff to current games... if they do that, the VC will be a lot better.

I hope it does, but it doesn't seem Nintendo would like to do anything like that. It might not be possible.

Correct me if I am wrong but isnt this thread about console wars?

From what the rest of the thread showed me, I don't think that's the case. Also the "vs" kind of says Console War to me. My bad if I'm out of topic however.

A) You can put it on SD cards (not even proprietary ones, real, normal SD cards), you just cant use it on other systems. If you could, what would stop people from just downloading games from the internet onto the card and using it with the Wii? Nothing. Don't be retarded here.

You might have misunderstood me. The SD card transfer process painful(you could switch games/disks for your Wii eight to thirty times in the time it takes to transfer a NES game, I haven't gotten near a 64 game yet, but it sounds cringe worthy). And I didn't say anything about playing games other than ones obtained from VC. Playing games right from your card would make it a lot easier and could kind of make the whole clumsy and slow data thing worth it.

B) Worth is determined by individual people, which is why saying 600 bucks being cheap for the PS3 is absolutely right...for the person who said it. Compare 8 bucks for gunstar heroes with the cost of the cartridge, its comparable.
You dont understand PR speak. We're 3 months in, of course they're only going to deliver what they said they'd deliver and not what they also hinted at. Wait a while, we don't know what they have planned for the future. You seriously expected this stuff on release?

PS3 costs more than 600 dollars to make per unit, its not really the same for a VC game. I really doubt it costed them one-fifth or even one-tenth of what they'll make from the game, especially looking how close it is to pure emulation.

I don't expect to get everything up front, I did not say that. It appears there will NEVER be an online Mario Cart as everyone wants or Wii motion Mario as they showed. I don't intend on selling my Wii over it, but I won't be happy about it.

Also: Waiting goes back to the original argument. If I have to wait for my VC to be worth it, then I also have to wait for PS3 to start dominating the market. I'm all for slower and better made products, but the VC is not showing any signs of improvement in the future.

Because you havent given it any thought. Anyways, if you wont shut up, please just keep setting up these dominoes for me to topple. I get some perverted pleasure in destroying people's retarded arguements.

I think I'm giving it a good deal of thought, I didn't come to this conclusion instantly and I was originally excited about the VC... very slowly I've changed my mind with each detailed revealed.

And wow... what a corny line. :X You know I'm not saying I'm destroying your argument, people have different opinions, I think mine is right... without "toppling dominos".

New postPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 6:32 pm Post subject: Reply with quote
BRP wrote:
B) I got two answers to this. Sentence 1: Oh cool, buying, just fine. However there is an issue, they are practically making pay for double the worth of what you are actually getting.
...

Pirating has a very small effect on my opinion itself. Its really the people who are behind the emulators. It's sad that they can outperform Nintendo at no cost with their own games and consoles.


The reason why people who write emulators can outperform Nintendo at no cost:
1) they don't need to pay to develop content
2) they don't need to pay for licensing
3) they don't have to worry about protecting content from mass piracy
4) they get something out of it -- programming experience and a fun hobby.
5) since they have zero financial liability they don't need to account for financial risk

Also, who are you to say what something is worth? You have no idea how much $ was spent on R&D for VC, running the servers, licensing the old games, etc. Do you have figures on their margins on VC, and how much they sunk to get those margins? No. You're just babbling with no idea of the actual financials.

This is an actually great point, but I wasn't really focusing on the 'free' part. Its the fact that these guys can make a better emulator than Nintendo and Nintendo has a better budget(and I'd think people better at doing these things since they are getting paid). Unless they buy to sell a emulator(which could have been a good idea for them) I don't think they would run into legal fees.


And are a lot of you saying that you've never complained about something you've never bought? A movie? A show? A game? A type of music? I mean I'm sure I've seen some of you complain about the PS3 and I know a lot of people who do that don't have the PS3. I know my option isn't to buy it, but as a Wii owner I feel like I have the right to say "Hey Nintendo, this VC thing is kind of crappy you know?"

[zoobernut]

That is very true BRP I agree with you as a wii owner you have a right to complain about VC and say how crappy it is. and your point is very valid. I hope that nintendo listens to the hardcore gamers out there and add more content to it to make you feel justified in buying your wii.

my point was and still is that your issues and disslikes with VC still dont negate the fact that VC is quite successful and works for a lot of the wii owners out there. and since this thread is about "Console Wars" VC stands as a positive point for the wii rather than a negative one since it increases nintendos profit from the wii and attracts more people to the system and therefore also attracts more third party developers as well.

[Kenai]

First I never said PS3 will be top dog, if you go back and actually READ I said it will be a GOOD system in time. I also admitted that right now the PS3 sucks and only IF they get there shit together will they start to pull ahead.

Second, just because a system has a good launch doesn't mean its going to stay around. Can you say Dreamcast and to some extent Gamecube? You think just because Nintendo moving units that it is impossible they might fall short. I find it funny you say that since people are saying give the PS3 time that we should give the Wii time, but yet you don't seem to be giving the PS3 anytime. So why don't you take your own advice? I also never said I didn't like the Wii but there are many people on this forums that will openly admit that after finish Zelda they are at a loss for Wii games. Sure Wii has Trauma Center and Rayman but Rayman is multi platform and Trauma Center is a DS port. Its funny how the Wii gets credit for ports and multi platform games but everyone rips the PS3 a new ass about ports or multi platform, can you see the double standard here?

And then there Zelda we all know Nintendo held this game back to push Wiis but I'm sure there is no argument there right? The VC which you say is improving but why does it look almost the same as the VC that came out when the Wii was released? They released what one game last week? This week I believe I heard they only releasing Mario Kart 64 and maybe Super Mario World this week, o yea the VC has improved 10 folds

Sure Wii is selling out but if you think the Wii has zero flaws then your dead wrong. All launch systems have there flaws so why wont you admit the Wii has them too. The Wii and the PS3 are far from perfect and there starts don't always tell what the future of the console will be.

I don't think I said in any of my post that the Wii is the perfect system (if it was, I wouldn't be considering the 360 now). I also don't seem to remember myself ever typing that the Wii would 100% beat down everything else. But I also fail to see why SOOOO many people are saying "Oh yea, I think it will end up being PS3 > 360> Wii, even though I haven't even bought a PS3 yet because there's no point" type of deal (whether you said this or not I don't care, it's just a general gripe I have that I keep seeing). I also think you forgot the difference just a few games can make, according to the VC. Super Mario 64, Mario Kart, Star Fox 64, and Super Mario World are all HUGE games, and it's VERY easy for them to keep adding more (I'm still waiting for the awesome SNES RPGs, like Earthbound, Secret of Mana, Secret of Evermore and Super Mario RPG. Maybe they will shut you up when they come out? What will? It could come out any week...) Just because you don't like the VC games out doesn't mean a lot of other people do (again, look at the download numbers), so like I said before, it's different strokes for different folks. I personally found my favorite in Bonk's Adenture.

I will continue to give the PS3 time, just like I have been since launch day. but I can't stand so many fucking people continue to use the damn "wait and see" excuse to cover up the horrible launch that should never have happened to begin with. For one full month, Zelda was Wii-exclusive, even though it is a port now, it is not on a competitor's system, it will benefit nintendo no matter which system you buy it for. Trauma Center is not a port, it is a continuation of the series. Same with WarioWare. WiiSports is fresh. Rayman is multi, that's it. And these are basically launch titles, which are apparently supposed to suck (that's the basic excuse the PS3 uses, right?). Why the hell couldn't the PS3 release stuff like this worth mentioning? Why release a shooter in the wake of the 360's GoW, and basically nothing else? Here's another hint: a system has to stop selling out in order to start flopping, and a system also has to start selling in order to catch up. Wii has the games people want (3 of them on the top 10 alone, and we all know Nintendo is the king of milking franchises, SSBB, Pokemon, Metroid, Mario stuff, it's going to sell more systems this summer, not to mention it is actually getting lots of 3rd party titles this gen), it has the price going for it, and it has penetrated the market despite the hype the PS3 HAD. It has the dev support, along with the 360 (PS3 does and doesn't depending on the devs you ask). What exactly is it doing to fail, now?

I rip the PS3 a new ass because when it was supposed to be THE system with the super specs and killer titles to justify the higher price, it just keeps losing them, with the 360 getting a large majority of the same "killer app" games at a minimum of $100 less and a bigger library, and the Wii offering it's own huge list of exclusives and franchises at less than half the price? Do you understand why I am being so critical now? These aren't fanboy rants, these are FACTS coming from someone who wants the PS3 to be worth his time and money, but you'd better damn well believe I'm not touching the thing until it is. Just because the PS3 probably won't end up being number one, doesn't mean it still can't do well (which I never said either). But Sony needs to understand that people want the system to have GAMES on it, and stop thinking that the extra features alone are going to carry it. They made the same crucial mistake with the PSP (you know, the one that would run the DS into the ground?) Don't dare insult my sold-out, fun as hell Wii by saying the PS3 is going to outsell it, not until Sony gets off their high horse and works on the GAME aspect of the system, and it actually starts selling some more systems. Don't you DARE give Sony any credit for ANYTHING, until they start doing stuff right, they should have known better than to make the choices they did. Just as I can't base a system's failure on a bad launch, you sure as hell can't base the system's failure on a really good launch...

[Xavier]

Nintendo is selling a last-gen console in terms of costs and performance and charging it at a price of a next-gen console.

This might sound a bit crazy, but I don't think I can get a 360 or PS3 for $250.

[zoobernut]

And i dont remember "last-gen" systems have any of the capabilities of the wii... the only thing that the wii is lacking in is slightly outdated graphics but i will take new innovative gameplay and fun games over good graphics anyday of the week.

[Kenai]

And i dont remember "last-gen" systems have any of the capabilities of the wii... the only thing that the wii is lacking in is slightly outdated graphics but i will take new innovative gameplay and fun games over good graphics anyday of the week.

Yea, the PS3 and 360 definitely have better graphics potiental, but the Wii games can still look good, no, REALLY good. You can't base the full Wii capabilities on Zelda, just like you can't base the others on launch titles. :wink:

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

Nintendo is selling a last-gen console in terms of costs and performance and charging it at a price of a next-gen console.

This might sound a bit crazy, but I don't think I can get a 360 or PS3 for $250.

I have a friend who did. Drug dealers are way too good at gettin shit cheap

I mean Zelda, wooo. But I think when the nostalgia dies down, more people are going to start to agree with me, without online play or Wii motion, VC is not worth it.

I, for one, havent downloaded any game that I own like LTTP. I'm using the VC for games that are new to me that i've always wanted to play on a real TV screen. Also you seem to be missing the fact that the stated goal has always been to rerelease old games.

[quote:31bee]But the VC's got the potential to do what the marketplace on the 360 does... which lets people download upgrades/updates/other stuff to current games... if they do that, the VC will be a lot better.

I hope it does, but it doesn't seem Nintendo would like to do anything like that. It might not be possible.[/quote:31bee]

Its quite possible, thats what the WiiConnect24 is partially for, we just havent had any implementation yet. Nintendo is taking their time on the online thing and for some reason 3rd parties are too.

You might have misunderstood me. The SD card transfer process painful(you could switch games/disks for your Wii eight to thirty times in the time it takes to transfer a NES game, I haven't gotten near a 64 game yet, but it sounds cringe worthy). And I didn't say anything about playing games other than ones obtained from VC. Playing games right from your card would make it a lot easier and could kind of make the whole clumsy and slow data thing worth it.

Uh, that sounds defective unless it had to format the SD card you used first for some reason.

I don't expect to get everything up front, I did not say that. It appears there will NEVER be an online Mario Cart as everyone wants or Wii motion Mario as they showed. I don't intend on selling my Wii over it, but I won't be happy about it.

They already said there will be original games to get online. That probably includes enhanced ports.

What you seem to be forgetting is the VC is like the photo channel, its not for everyone to use. Its not an integral part of the Wii experience.

I think I'm giving it a good deal of thought, I didn't come to this conclusion instantly and I was originally excited about the VC... very slowly I've changed my mind with each detailed revealed.

So when they originally announced it and said 'a way to download old games and play them on your Wii' you expected enhancements? They delivered the product they said it would be.

This is an actually great point, but I wasn't really focusing on the 'free' part. Its the fact that these guys can make a better emulator than Nintendo and Nintendo has a better budget(and I'd think people better at doing these things since they are getting paid). Unless they buy to sell a emulator(which could have been a good idea for them) I don't think they would run into legal fees.

Nintendo's emulators are flawless and play every game, not even ZSNES, which has been around like 10 years+ and only does 1 system, can play every game (Star Ocean comes to mind).

[Vixy]

Star Ocean

Has been playable fine for years now just for a fyi.

I have myself not been able to find a game that isn't playable on ZSNES.

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

Star Ocean

Has been playable fine for years now just for a fyi.

I have myself not been able to find a game that isn't playable on ZSNES.

Seriously? I just recently tried to play Star Ocean and had to resort to Snes9x. It made me sad. Maybe my version is just old...

EDIT: Wow im using 1.42 and the newest is 1.51... whoops

[BRP]

play every game

Not yet.

[Krandor]

Star Ocean

Has been playable fine for years now just for a fyi.

I have myself not been able to find a game that isn't playable on ZSNES.

I never got Yoshi's Island to work on ZSNES for me, may have just been bad ROMs though.

[Falconblade]

Star Ocean

Has been playable fine for years now just for a fyi.

I have myself not been able to find a game that isn't playable on ZSNES.

I never got Yoshi's Island to work on ZSNES for me, may have just been bad ROMs though.

'

I had it work on mine. Though It had no sound.

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

play every game

Not yet.

I'm currently talking about past emulation nintendo has done, super game boy, GBA backwards compatibility, etc.

[Mysterio]

Metal Gear, Assassins creed, Devil May Cry4 all been pushed back to fall of 07.

FF13 late 2008...

Looks like PS3 won't be making its push until the better part of a year from now.

Look for PS3 to take the lead by summer of '08

go nintendo fanboys! line-up in defiance of the evil empire while you can!

lol

[Exoduso]

lol FF13 in 2007? you wish...