Apoc Nigh Earrings

[Xanthu]

P.S. How's that WHM sub going Kerberoz?

Level 1 0/500 exp, where it's always been and always will be. Your point?

http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/5...ianrollfs3.gif

[aurik]

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

[Suiram]

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

lol

Ok, in the interests of humoring an honest discussion, the only situations that Mag+Novio would be better than Mold+Novio are those where your overall damage is limited by your MP. I understand this might be the case in soloing and a few other situations (although for me soloing, I'm pretty sure I would get slower exp with mag+novio rather than moldavite+novio but I won't get into the specifics of why at this point, and it certainly wouldn't be the case for everyone), but in my experience for the most part in an HNM situation, MP isn't really a problem, and your gear choices become less of a question of balancing MP vs. Damage but rather Enmity vs. Damage. Therefore,

Novio/Novia > Magnetic/Novio, discuss.

[Rishi]

Eh. If you have Novio in one ear, Magnetic's ~3.5% MP efficiency wouldn't match up against Molda's MAB+5 unless you grossly overnuke, degrading Magnetic to resting & non-nuke usage onry.

Similarly, Static is more of an increase if you don't have Novia. If you can go Novio/Molda, you'd be pitting Molda's MAB5 against Static's 105% MB multiplier, degrading Static to a pitiful increase in MB damage, and virtually no use outside of that.

In a nutshell, those who have Novia wouldn't care much about Apoc Nigh Earrings for BLM, so the entire issue is kinda moot as you should be looking at your other jobs instead.

Novio/Novia > Magnetic/Novio, discuss.

Cursed be the http://www.killingifrit.com/system/s.../icon_rare.gif tag.

[Celeras]

Novio/Novia > Magnetic/Novio, discuss.

Cursed be the http://www.killingifrit.com/system/s.../icon_rare.gif tag.

Theyre different earrings.

[Scorp]

The -% spell interrupt is a fairly nice addition to magnetic to. It isn't just about the conserve mp.

[Delekii]

There is no way, shape, or form that Magnetic earring ends up saving 3.5% MP over time. Conserve MP from BLM75 only save 7%, unless you are saying that it is half as good as that? Check out the various conserve mp tests done on alla blm forums http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/jobs.html ... =69;page=1 here, somewhere in all that mess is a great test of sorceror's feet.


edit: this test is a pretty good test regarding +conserve mp.

No Body Armor

Casts: 
Cost	#	% 
46	375	75.0 
43	19	3.8 
40	13	2.6 
37	25	5.0	 
34	17	3.4 
31	13	2.6 
28	17	3.4	 
25	8	1.6 
23	13	2.6


Totals: 
Casts           500 
Nominal MP      23000 
Actual MP       21468 
Pct. saved      6.66 
Adj. pct. saved 6.44


Igqira Weskit

Casts: 
Cost	#	% 
46	394	78.8	 
43	12	2.4 
40	11	2.2 
37	13	2.6		 
34	11	2.2 
31	10	2.0 
28	14	2.8 
25	20	4.0 
23	15	3.0


Totals: 
Casts           500 
Nominal MP      23000 
Actual MP       21482 
Pct. saved      6.60 
Adj. pct. saved 6.39


Igqira Weskit + Water Ring

Casts: 
Cost	#	% 
46	288	57.6 
43	29	5.8 
40	29	5.8 
37	38	7.6		 
34	23	4.6 
31	31	6.2 
28	22	4.4 
25	22	4.4 
23	18	3.6


Totals: 
Casts           500 
Nominal MP      23000 
Actual MP       20384 
Pct. saved      11.37 
Adj. pct. saved 10.98

Over the course of 500 casts with and without igqira weskit on, without saved LESS total mp than with. Another 500 casts with +15 conserve mp over igqira alone, and +17 conserve mp total, saved 11.37% as opposed to 6.6%. So, +17 conserve mp, more than 3 times the magnetic earring, saved just 4.7% mp. 4.7/3=? Just on 1.5%. Like you said, conserve mp is linear. Now, there may well be stipulations that werent taken account for in that test, but the only one I ever heard was that the day of the spell affects activation rate on conserve mp for that spell. This test was run on cure3, on various days that were not lights or darksday, during various moonphases.

BLMs have done plenty of testing as far as +5 conserve MP goes, and it ends up being more like 1.5% mp over time. Its all well and good to be high and mighty about how magnetic is the only choice for career mages, but personally I find it totally lackluster. Healing MP is moot because I can get equal or better in both ears, lolmaxmp, +conserve mp is wonderful, except that for the majority of spells there are better earrings you should be casting. The most interesting part of that earring for me is interruption rate, and it isnt very.

On WHM, there is never a time I would take off Loquac/Novia for the sake of magnetic, on BLM there is never a time I would take off a combination of moldy/abyssal()/loquac/novia/static for magnetic, on rdm I would probably wear magnetic to cast most party buffs, and on BRD, there is no reason to take off loquac/novia/musical/wind earrings. Why exactly do I want magnetic? 2% mp over time?

I somewhat regret not choosing ethereal, because like suppa, it is unique and unreplaceable. Magnetic, overall, provides a slightly small boost to mp, which is either less desirable than other earrings, or already replaceable with another piece. I dont regret choosing static, MDB and mnd on one earring are somewhat nice for some endgame fights, and bonus damage on MB allows for epeen without needing to save points and lot a novio over career blms. I certainly do not regret not getting a Magnetic, I think it is a totally lackluster piece. I can see how people could be drawn to it, and I am sure people who got magnetic are happy with their choice - but many, MANY people I talk to who sing the praises of Magnetic totally overestimate the impact of +5 conserve mp.

[Carbon]

I picked Suppanomimi and I hardly ever use it. I picked Tamas Ring and I always use it. I picked Magnetic Earring and I always use it.

The point: Go with what you use, not what's always best. Wish I would have picked Abyssal so I could sub it in for my Dark Magic spells.

(But that's not to say that I won't use it down the road. I keep on hoping, anyway.)

[Koyangi]

I use magnetic on PLD but not on BLM lol. Cure4 with conserve mp = your ethereal for the entire fight.

For someone who has picked Magnetic and goes PLD, is Magnetic really more beneficial for PLD than Ethereal? I'm geussing because /nin and new Sentinel changes makes the PLD taking no dmg or hardly any dmg most of the time. Please discuss.

[aurik]

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

lol

Ok, in the interests of humoring an honest discussion, the only situations that Mag+Novio would be better than Mold+Novio are those where your overall damage is limited by your MP. I understand this might be the case in soloing and a few other situations (although for me soloing, I'm pretty sure I would get slower exp with mag+novio rather than moldavite+novio but I won't get into the specifics of why at this point, and it certainly wouldn't be the case for everyone), but in my experience for the most part in an HNM situation, MP isn't really a problem, and your gear choices become less of a question of balancing MP vs. Damage but rather Enmity vs. Damage. Therefore,

Novio/Novia > Magnetic/Novio, discuss.

Nope, missing the point. Damage isn't the end-all be-all of black magery; when was the last time you won a fight with <1 minute on the clock?

[Xfaustx]

id get static twice if i could.















srsly

[nivlakian]

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

lol

Ok, in the interests of humoring an honest discussion, the only situations that Mag+Novio would be better than Mold+Novio are those where your overall damage is limited by your MP. I understand this might be the case in soloing and a few other situations (although for me soloing, I'm pretty sure I would get slower exp with mag+novio rather than moldavite+novio but I won't get into the specifics of why at this point, and it certainly wouldn't be the case for everyone), but in my experience for the most part in an HNM situation, MP isn't really a problem, and your gear choices become less of a question of balancing MP vs. Damage but rather Enmity vs. Damage. Therefore,

Novio/Novia > Magnetic/Novio, discuss.

Nope, missing the point. Damage isn't the end-all be-all of black magery; when was the last time you won a fight with <1 minute on the clock?

Perhaps I missed something, but I don't see where Suiram made any mention of damage being the end-all-be-all of black magery nor any reference to speed (what clock?). He simply made a point that for him MP tends not to be the limiting factor of what he does on HNM, but instead enmity making Magnetic not as helpful.

[aurik]

I didn't mention anything he said, I'm just saying he missed my point.

[JoOeetheplatypuS]

I picked Suppanomimi and I hardly ever use it. I picked Tamas Ring and I always use it. I picked Magnetic Earring and I always use it.

The point: Go with what you use, not what's always best. Wish I would have picked Abyssal so I could sub it in for my Dark Magic spells.

(But that's not to say that I won't use it down the road. I keep on hoping, anyway.)

This post is a major success in my book. Its just something people seem to forget a lot and is absolutely true.

[Delekii]

I didn't mention anything he said, I'm just saying he missed my point.

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

do you blame him? Im still not exactly sure what the point is.. that conserve mp +5 will let you do more over time on BLM than other earrings? There are a number of limiting factors to BLM damage, but generally 1.5% mp over time is not close to one of them, for me.

[aurik]

I didn't mention anything he said, I'm just saying he missed my point.

Mag/Nov > Nov/Mold, discuss.

do you blame him? Im still not exactly sure what the point is.. that conserve mp +5 will let you do more over time on BLM than other earrings? There are a number of limiting factors to BLM damage, but generally 1.5% mp over time is not close to one of them, for me.

Point is that the exact amount of damage you deal is almost meaningless.

[Delekii]

Point is that the exact amount of damage you deal is almost meaningless.

By that token, a naked blm and a blm wearing novio+moldy, zenith mitts, and yigit feat, are the same? This game is made up of small steps. Dont get me wrong, I agree with you in that it isnt always (or even often) wise to nuke for full damage disregarding all else. But when is it ever wise to nuke for less damage for the sake of 1.5% mp?

Like I said in my post, there are multiple earrings that I use or would use on BLM depending on the situation: Novio/Novia/Static/Loquac/Avyssal/Elemental.

The exact amount of damage you do is almost meaningless, but when it is 1.5% difference, the exact amount of mp you spend is even more so.

[aurik]

Point is that the exact amount of damage you deal is almost meaningless.

By that token, a naked blm and a blm wearing novio+moldy, zenith mitts, and yigit feat, are the same? This game is made up of small steps. Dont get me wrong, I agree with you in that it isnt always (or even often) wise to nuke for full damage disregarding all else. But when is it ever wise to nuke for less damage for the sake of 1.5% mp?

Like I said in my post, there are multiple earrings that I use or would use on BLM depending on the situation: Novio/Novia/Static/Loquac/Avyssal/Elemental.

The exact amount of damage you do is almost meaningless, but when it is 1.5% difference, the exact amount of mp you spend is even more so.

A single trigger of conserve mp on a nuke will give you enough for an extra stun or drain, or save a tic of rest. The ability to use this extra mp at your discretion to help the situation at-hand -- rather than always using the potential MP for an extra smidgen of damage -- is the make or break of this earring, and a blm in general.

[Carbon]

It's not about how much MP you have, it's about how well you can distribute it effectively and get it back. No point in having 5000 MP if it takes you 20 mins just to rest it all back.

I would assume the same would apply for BLM, and for this very reason, people didn't cast AM1s almost ever. Yeah, they dealt damage, but they left you gasping for MP, not to mention the casting timer on them is just ridiculous.

Quality > Quantity.

[Delekii]

Perhaps you play differently to me, but I cant remember the last time I was out of mp, or lacking it for that matter, on anything that counted. For one thing, you will only get that activation one in every 20 nukes, and for those 20 nukes you will be doing noticably less damage/gaining noticably more hate. Even when it DOES activate, chances are it will not save you enough for a single stun.