Boys cook puppy.

[Headspace]

The kid getting raped = the puppy
The gangrapers = The two boys.

I don't think we should blamed the parents for the kid getting raped, but for the gangrapers, yes we should

[BRP]

The kid getting raped = the puppy
The gangrapers = The two boys.

I don't think we should blamed the parents for the kid getting raped, but for the gangrapers, yes we should

Now what happens if that kid develops a sickness that gives him a child rape fetish that becomes apparent when he gets older. That would make it environment and not parents. (not that I'm disagreeing with you, you are the nearest relevant thing to quote)

[Daahan]

If a kid gets gang raped at school, I don't think its fair to blame the parents.

Legendary Whoosh.

A person who gets raped is not a person doing the malicious action. The point is already mute.

If a kid/person develops a rape fetish during childhood, then it's still the parents' responsibility to keep that kid in line and discipline him. The kid won't do it on his own.

Once that person becomes independent from his parents; that is, he is grown up and can fend for his own. Then most of the blame goes to him. Even in this case, there is still some blame to the parents for not raising him right and letting him become a rapist.

I really don't see how you guys think that parents don't have a majority role in raising kids and disciplining them. It's thoughts like those that are making our country want to give a person 3 years in prison for spanking their children.

[Intense]

If a kid gets gang raped at school, I don't think its fair to blame the parents.

Why not? Parents are supposed to teach their children values. The court is able to waive parental rights if they see that mom and dad are not doing their job.

BECAUSE GETTING GANG RAPED ISN'T A RESULT OF BAD VALUES IT'S A RESULT OF GETTING GANG RAPED.

I'm just going to assume you misread the original post...

Typing in all caps does not make you smarter, in fact it makes you stupid when you make no sense. As such is happening in this case...

If I misread anything, it may have been BRPs post. He may have meant blame the parents of the person who got gang raped, although I dont see why he would as it has no relevence to what the discussion has been.

I think that blaming the parents doesnt/shouldnt pass the buck from the minor who commits a crime, but I am saying that the blood should be on the parents hand as well.

What do I know though, Im just a paralegal dealing in juvenile cases...

[Bethany]

Did a bit of digging on the net for information and what I've found some what changes my view on the whole nature > nurture thing.

Children who come from violent backgrounds are more likely to display such behavior, but it isn't always that simple. Case studies have brought to light a multitude of issues that may have led a child towards cruelty to animals, but some issues recur in many case studies: parental alcoholism, feelings of neglect and being unloved, domestic violence, overly domineering parent(s), sexual and/or physical abuse within the home, lack of attention and/or affection and rejection.

However, according to Fernando Tapia, professor of psychiatry at the University of Missouri, "The etiological background of gross parental neglect, brutality, rejection and hostility seems very common, although not essential." Certainly, some violent children come from loving homes where other siblings are perfectly well adjusted. In Tapia's research, a number of these cases were explained away by physical illnesses which had caused mild brain damage.

http://www.allaboutanimals.org.uk/PT-TheLink.asp

So then I thought, well if a person who was raised in a stable loving home & they had siblings that turned out fine, could they really be violent because of some type of brain injury? I found this:

For children who suffer frontal brain injury, the behavioral consequences are often more dramatic, as documented by neuroscientist Antonio R. Damasio and fellow researchers at the University of Iowa College of Medicine. In one case, surgeons removed a tumor from the right frontal cortex of a three-month-old infant. By age nine the boy had become almost impossible to motivate in school, remained socially isolated and spent almost all of his free time in front of the television or listening to music. Occasionally he would "go wild" and threaten others, sometimes physically. Of significance, the boy grew up in a caring environment with loving parents and his siblings developed normally.

In another case described by Damasio, a 15-month-old girl suffered head injuries in a serious automobile accident. She progressed typically at first but, at age three, started to exhibit behavioral disorders. At the time, her parents noted that she failed to react at all to punishment. Later she refused to comply with rules, frequently fought with teachers and classmates, lied shamelessly, stole and broke into homes. Most notably, she constantly attacked other people both verbally and physically. She, too, had normal brothers and sisters.

Additional evidence bolstering the frontal brain hypothesis comes from Adrian Raine and his colleagues at the University of Southern California, who have studied convicted murderers. Using positron-emission tomography (PET), they found lower levels of metabolic activity in the murderers' frontal brain regions as compared with members of the general public. Further analysis, however, revealed that this difference existed only among criminals who had killed on impulse. The frontal brain appeared normal in those murderers who had planned their crimes meticulously and committed them in cold blood, seemingly without conscience.

http://www.sciammind.com/print_versi...96EF69D814FCFF

It was interesting to read some of the information on these sites. While I don't believe parents are 100% responsible for their children, I give them more of it now. Even if the child has some sort of head trauma leading to brain damage, it is in the end their duty as a parent to monitor their children for signs of there being something wrong and seek help accordingly.

Whatever the case though, we'll never know what lead these two young men to do what they did. We can all just speculate until more information is given, but personally even if they have some major brain malfunction, that's all the more reason they should be put away for their safety as well as the others in their community, animals & humans alike..

[BRP]

Being raped as a child can lead into sickness.

[Neosutra]

Don't know if this is correct or not, but I believe I read somewhere that 90% of children who torture small animals etc, even after jail time and or treatment still grow up to commit violent crimes & even murder as an adult.

If what I read was true, then these boys should get duct taped & dropped into a nice cozy little jail cell for life with a guy named Bubbah who is 300lbs and hasn't seen a woman in a very, very long time~

http://www.ncjrs.gov/html/ojjdp/jjbul20 ... page7.html

http://www.theanimalspirit.com/page3.html

http://usfnews.usf.edu/page.cfm?link=article&aid=358 - good study

Ya, you can pretty much rest assured that if your kid is doing shit like torturing animals, your better off offing the kid now and starting over.

[Bethany]

Don't know if this is correct or not, but I believe I read somewhere that 90% of children who torture small animals etc, even after jail time and or treatment still grow up to commit violent crimes & even murder as an adult.

If what I read was true, then these boys should get duct taped & dropped into a nice cozy little jail cell for life with a guy named Bubbah who is 300lbs and hasn't seen a woman in a very, very long time~

http://www.ncjrs.gov/html/ojjdp/jjbul20 ... page7.html

http://www.theanimalspirit.com/page3.html

http://usfnews.usf.edu/page.cfm?link=article&aid=358 - good study

Ya, you can pretty much rest assured that if your kid is doing shit like torturing animals, your better off offing the kid now and starting over.

Thanks for the links Neosutra. The University of South Florida study was a good one. It amazes me how varied criminal acts can be, yet most of the offenders share enough similar situations/backgrounds that something can be done to help identify those people so actions can be taken to interfere.

[Sorrower]

2 kids cook puppy alive. Hmmm i'm gonna guess they're white? Not black, not hispanic, not asian.....just white. amirite?

[melbufrauma]

these kids should be tied up to a wall of nails, all joints in their body broken and thrown in a fucking pit i hate people who are sick like these cockbags

[Pussygalore]

Either case.. they still might want to keep an eye on these guys because they have committed one pillar of the "Homicidal Triad" (killing/torture of animals) starting fires and bed wetting being the other two pillars.
http://www.yale.edu/yfp/archives/99_humanface.html

[Devek]

Not trying to be an asshole, but did you think before you wrote that?

First, there is no mention that the kids were mentally ill. If they were, it would have mentioned it in the link. Second, even if BOTH kids happened to have a mental condition, why the hell weren't the PARENTS keeping both eyes on their mentally handicapped children?

In both cases, it's the parents fault. Lots of blame lies on them if they are mentally sane, but even more still lies on the parents for letting their kids go out of control.

I hate it when people play the "oh they probably had some kind of mental condition because they did something really stupid." It's hard to believe, but people do really fucking messed up things without having some kind of mental condition.

If a kid/person develops a rape fetish during childhood, then it's still the parents' responsibility to keep that kid in line and discipline him. The kid won't do it on his own.

Once that person becomes independent from his parents; that is, he is grown up and can fend for his own. Then most of the blame goes to him. Even in this case, there is still some blame to the parents for not raising him right and letting him become a rapist.

I really don't see how you guys think that parents don't have a majority role in raising kids and disciplining them. It's thoughts like those that are making our country want to give a person 3 years in prison for spanking their children.

I took some time to think about this because I didn't want to flame a pope of Yin and I am not going to here.

First of all it is kind of a strawman argument to say that we believe that spanking a child is bad or that parents shouldn't take a firm position in their children's upbringing. I spanked my daughter until she was old enough to communicate and than we were able to talk things out until she was around 5 and at that point she was allowed to decide her own punishments and solutions in areas she messed up. My daughter has always been perfectly behaved.. yada yada.

On the other hand how many times have I seen identical parents raise 2 kids where one is perfect and the other is criminal?

It is the whole nature vs nurture argument except in real life. There is only so much impact you can have on how your child is going to end up.. If your child is hellbound to become the next mass murderer there is nothing you can do to prevent it besides killing them or sending them to an institution that simply prepares them for life in prison and nothing more..

People commit crimes for various reasons and a lot of them are simply "bad choices". Crimes that would be unnecessary if the person simply knew better. You can put a lot of blame on someones up bringing when they steal a car because they didn't know how to get a job and buy their own.

You also have situations where the parent simply didn't know what was going on. There are some statistics out there (though none can truly be verified) that 1 in every 6 boys are sexually abused before the age of 16. The amount of parents that are aware when their child is abused is very small because the child is ashamed or terrified of telling. Years later the emotional harm manifests itself somehow.. oh shit its the parents fault now?

It is almost abusive to a point to believe that you have full responsibility for how the child turns out in a two fold manner.

1) When things don't go well the parents may redouble their punishments instead of providing the child support.. lack of support leads to neglect which leads to trauma which leads to a sick child but the parents can sit there and smile and say "We did everything we could!" Try kicking a kid every time they wet the bed, thats 100% guaranteed to make them wet the bed more.

2) The whole purpose of discipline is not to force your children to OBEY but to teach them how to control themselves. Self-discipline is the most effective form of discipline at all and it takes a lot of the parents letting go and letting the child make some mistakes in safe/supporting environments so that when they turn 18 they are not just dumped on their own to make them in a non-safe/non-supporting environment. It is hard to let go if you're going to be embarrassed and look like a bad parent for letting Jimmy set his own homework schedule...

Once again though.. 80 word article.. no way we can really argue about this specific case here but to make up hypothetical situations and compare against other hypothetical situations. I would bet a lot of money there is a lot of juicy information about these kids and their history or lack of that would make this better.... but it simply isn't there.

Peoples reaction to this is almost as sick as what happened. How many different horrible things have been described that people want to do these kids? I propose that sickness in our society runs deep...

[Alvinho]

I don't know about you guys, but I don't think that 17-year-olds aren't ‘‘kids’’. Sure, in the eyes of the law they might be considered children or whatnot, but duct-taping/cooking live animals, breaking computers, etc. does not constitute for normal behavior, kid or not.

[dietvanillapepsi]

It's too bad that only on of the two kids is old enough to be tried as an adult.

[Alvinho]

I don't know the law in GA, but ‘‘kids’’ as young as 14 (maybe even younger, like Lionel Tate, who was 12 when sentenced to life) can be tried as an adult in FL.

[Scythiroth]

What the hell is wrong with people now? ~_~

Parents need to be allowed to beat their kids again, obviously (within reason).

[Ksandra]

Omg that poor puppy ;_;

Seriously parents aren't allowed to parent anymore.

[Priran]

The point is already mute.

[banhero]

least it wasn't a kitten

[Anyway]

2 kids cook puppy alive. Hmmm i'm gonna guess they're white? Not black, not hispanic, not asian.....just white. amirite?

It was in blacklanta so I doubt it.