Translation please

[Wizerd]

I MPKed people who got mad at me for checking them back on Titan...

People stopped getting mad at me pretty quickly.

[Septimus]

Moral of the story: Japanese are fucking idiots who get mad over petty things. 8)

It's like not eating with your left hand in more conservative Muslim countries or other social taboos you'd find weird because you have no fucking idea why they exist.

When your culture comes from a pack of testosterone-poisoned (read: samurais) men who packed long, sharp swords and would cut you DEAD for looking at them funny...staring is considered a rude, stupid thing to do. It's like giving the biker guy down the bar a double one-finger salute. Checking someone is the virtual equivalent of a stare. Spam checking them is the aforementioned full-fledged pair of flipped birds.

Turning off the notice works fine, yeah- but the point's supposed to be he doesn't have to. Asking is supposed to be enough (if anything, you're not supposed to in the first place- ask first, get a response then check is the polite thing to do - it indicates you're not treating the person in question as not being an object of distant contempt but rather polite curiousity.), though. Most JP players don't have a problem in the world if you ask first and the ones that do are asses by anyone's standards.

Short form: /check but ask first, get a yes = "Hey, that's neat. Can I see?" (and saying no is the -other- person being rude, since you asked politely). /check without saying anything = "WTF are you doing here, you look like a n00b" = you're an ass.

That's how I got it explained to me when I was starting by a bilingual Japanese player, in any case.

I've heard that before. While it is a good explanation and all, it doesn't explain why JPs who get cranky when you check them feel free to check any NA that they want without asking.

No, they are just being pissy drama queens about being checked.

[Khamsin]

or maybe old player but rarely play (suspend the acc. too much)

I'm gonna lead towards the latter. I haven't encountered a JP who got mad at me for /checking them in like two years X_X

Or an RMT'd account that doesn't know about the autotranslator yet?

As for /check filters, while it certainly is a bit silly to get upset for being /checked, a filter will not solve that.

Afterall, the filter merely prevents you from knowing when someone checks you, it does not actually stop them from checking. For someone who does not like to be checked, turning the filter on would be worse for them. Without the filter, they at least know that they have not been checked. With the filter on, they are in the dark and can only guess at how often they're being checked without knowing.

Unfortunately, if I don't like paying my bills I can't just stop checking my mail. If I don't want cavities, I can't just stop going to the dentist. If I don't want that creepy stalker following me everywhere, I can't just not look behind me.

Turning a blind eye to a problem will not solve it. People will continue to check even with the filters on, so it solves nothing but to bury your head in the sand.

Now... whether /check is a "problem" or not is another issue. But to those for whom it is a problem, the above argument is likely why they don't want to use a filter.

[SassiAsura]

The funny ones are the folk that have a bot that auto switches their gear when they get checked. If they're so anal about it they can just activate the damned chat filter and do the ol' ostrich in the sand thing. I usually don't go around checking people but typically, if your anon, war, in my party or farming something near me... I will be tempted to check you. Usually though I just check fellow wars. I like to see what their doing wrong.

[LD]

How do you say "You exist to be Judged by me." in JP?

[Scythiroth]

How do you say "You exist to be Judged by me." in JP?

/point at them, and send them a tell with a lot of w's and the craziest face you can make.

[safer]

How do you say "You exist to be Judged by me." in JP?

私によって判断されるために存在している。


babelfish'd

[Starr]

I checked this Samurai at Labrynth of Onzozo and she equip swapped so I check again and see keeps doing it and I saw her Bazaar comment "Please ask to check me", something like that and I thought "Who the fuck do you think you are?" so I kept checking them til they gave up which was after about 20 times.

[safer]

>_>

how can you know to ask to check her if you need to check her in the first place to read her bazaar !

[zoobernut]

or maybe old player but rarely play (suspend the acc. too much)

I'm gonna lead towards the latter. I haven't encountered a JP who got mad at me for /checking them in like two years X_X

Or an RMT'd account that doesn't know about the autotranslator yet?

As for /check filters, while it certainly is a bit silly to get upset for being /checked, a filter will not solve that.

Afterall, the filter merely prevents you from knowing when someone checks you, it does not actually stop them from checking. For someone who does not like to be checked, turning the filter on would be worse for them. Without the filter, they at least know that they have not been checked. With the filter on, they are in the dark and can only guess at how often they're being checked without knowing.

Unfortunately, if I don't like paying my bills I can't just stop checking my mail. If I don't want cavities, I can't just stop going to the dentist. If I don't want that creepy stalker following me everywhere, I can't just not look behind me.

Turning a blind eye to a problem will not solve it. People will continue to check even with the filters on, so it solves nothing but to bury your head in the sand.

Now... whether /check is a "problem" or not is another issue. But to those for whom it is a problem, the above argument is likely why they don't want to use a filter.

this analogy doesnt really work because your examples are real life examples and they directly effect you whether you want them too or not. however checking someone in a game the ONLY way getting checked effects you is the little text that pops up so essentially there is NO difference between not being checked at all and having the filter up. can you imagine if there was no text saying that you were being checked... would the jp players run around constantly blinking in order to prevent people from possibly checking them because they had no way of knowing?

[Scythiroth]

>_>

how can you know to ask to check her if you need to check her in the first place to read her bazaar !

lmao.

[Khamsin]

or maybe old player but rarely play (suspend the acc. too much)

I'm gonna lead towards the latter. I haven't encountered a JP who got mad at me for /checking them in like two years X_X

Or an RMT'd account that doesn't know about the autotranslator yet?

As for /check filters, while it certainly is a bit silly to get upset for being /checked, a filter will not solve that.

Afterall, the filter merely prevents you from knowing when someone checks you, it does not actually stop them from checking. For someone who does not like to be checked, turning the filter on would be worse for them. Without the filter, they at least know that they have not been checked. With the filter on, they are in the dark and can only guess at how often they're being checked without knowing.

Unfortunately, if I don't like paying my bills I can't just stop checking my mail. If I don't want cavities, I can't just stop going to the dentist. If I don't want that creepy stalker following me everywhere, I can't just not look behind me.

Turning a blind eye to a problem will not solve it. People will continue to check even with the filters on, so it solves nothing but to bury your head in the sand.

Now... whether /check is a "problem" or not is another issue. But to those for whom it is a problem, the above argument is likely why they don't want to use a filter.

this analogy doesnt really work because your examples are real life examples and they directly effect you whether you want them too or not. however checking someone in a game the ONLY way getting checked effects you is the little text that pops up so essentially there is NO difference between not being checked at all and having the filter up. can you imagine if there was no text saying that you were being checked... would the jp players run around constantly blinking in order to prevent people from possibly checking them because they had no way of knowing?

Well, maybe here's a closer analogy. Say you saw somebody go through your trash to find your old bills, or someone looked over your shoulder at the ATM. They aren't directly affecting you, but I'm sure you'd be bothered and to be told "just look straight ahead and don't pay attention" wouldn't make you feel any better.

Maybe they just don't want people knowing what gear they have equipped. Or maybe they just want people to ask first out of courtesy.

Either way, turning filters on won't stop people from knowing what gear they have equipped, or knowing if people are asking first out of courtesy. That is likely why they don't want to use filters... because its not a solution, it just masks the problem.

The kind of solution those people would accept is maybe a system for /check similar to /invite. When someone /checks you, you get a message saying "___ wishes to examine you" (or "___ wishes to stare at you" for JP client) then you have the option to /allow it, which then finally brings up the check window for the other person so they can look at you. That would make them happy, as it actually solves the problem, not hides it.

[zoobernut]

Well, maybe here's a closer analogy. Say you saw somebody go through your trash to find your old bills, or someone looked over your shoulder at the ATM. They aren't directly affecting you, but I'm sure you'd be bothered and to be told "just look straight ahead and don't pay attention" wouldn't make you feel any better.

Maybe they just don't want people knowing what gear they have equipped. Or maybe they just want people to ask first out of courtesy.

Either way, turning filters on won't stop people from knowing what gear they have equipped, or knowing if people are asking first out of courtesy. That is likely why they don't want to use filters... because its not a solution, it just masks the problem.

The kind of solution those people would accept is maybe a system for /check similar to /invite. When someone /checks you, you get a message saying "___ wishes to examine you" (or "___ wishes to stare at you" for JP client) then you have the option to /allow it, which then finally brings up the check window for the other person so they can look at you. That would make them happy, as it actually solves the problem, not hides it.

again this analogy is flawed you did not really read what i wrote because in this game checking HAS NO CONSEQUENCE beyond the little message that says "Name examines you" or i guess on the jp client it says "Name stares at you" however in your analogy there are consequences beyond the rudeness of someone staring at you. in both cases i dont want someone doing that because then i run the risk of getting my identity stolen and to prevent that i keep people from going through my trash, mail, looking over my shoulder at the ATM. really i cannot think of an appropriate analogy of rl to being "checked" in a video game because again without that little message there is no way that any player could know they were being checked.

again i ask IF SE had never built in a message to indicate being checked would they still worry about being checked? would they run around changing gear constantly to prevent possible checking or would they get over it because they would never know either way.

you idea of an invite to allow being checked is a good idea but uneccessary in my opinion.

[Seyrr]

Anyone else remember that merchant NPC in Bastok Markets who encourages you to check other players so you have some idea of what to try to sell them? >.>

[Khamsin]

Well, maybe here's a closer analogy. Say you saw somebody go through your trash to find your old bills, or someone looked over your shoulder at the ATM. They aren't directly affecting you, but I'm sure you'd be bothered and to be told "just look straight ahead and don't pay attention" wouldn't make you feel any better.

Maybe they just don't want people knowing what gear they have equipped. Or maybe they just want people to ask first out of courtesy.

Either way, turning filters on won't stop people from knowing what gear they have equipped, or knowing if people are asking first out of courtesy. That is likely why they don't want to use filters... because its not a solution, it just masks the problem.

The kind of solution those people would accept is maybe a system for /check similar to /invite. When someone /checks you, you get a message saying "___ wishes to examine you" (or "___ wishes to stare at you" for JP client) then you have the option to /allow it, which then finally brings up the check window for the other person so they can look at you. That would make them happy, as it actually solves the problem, not hides it.

again this analogy is flawed you did not really read what i wrote because in this game checking HAS NO CONSEQUENCE beyond the little message that says "Name examines you" or i guess on the jp client it says "Name stares at you" however in your analogy there are consequences beyond the rudeness of someone staring at you. in both cases i dont want someone doing that because then i run the risk of getting my identity stolen and to prevent that i keep people from going through my trash, mail, looking over my shoulder at the ATM. really i cannot think of an appropriate analogy of rl to being "checked" in a video game because again without that little message there is no way that any player could know they were being checked.

again i ask IF SE had never built in a message to indicate being checked would they still worry about being checked? would they run around changing gear constantly to prevent possible checking or would they get over it because they would never know either way.

you idea of an invite to allow being checked is a good idea but uneccessary in my opinion.

Well, forget the analogies.. my point was just that hiding the message does not stop people from checking you. The consequence of them checking you is now they know what you're wearing, and they can use this information against you. If they see you wearing Lizard Boots and no head gear instead of Leaping Boots and Emperor Hairpin on your lowbie THF, or a Fungus Hat instead of Optical Hat, or an NQ staff, etc. they could ridicule you and your reputation could be ruined.

Well, ok, maybe such a person would be earning that reputation. But nonetheless, if they don't want people checking them for any reason, hiding the message won't stop it. And I suspect the JPs probably care more for the courtesy than not wanting people know they're gimp. Even so, if they can't see the message, they can't see you being rude which is even more of a problem than when they could see the message. That is, they can't act appropriately to rectify the situation of a rude person checking them if they aren't notified when it happens.

And again... I have no problems with being checked, I'm just explaining why some might not see chat filters as a real solution. If the issue people had with /check was the chat log spam it creates, then yes, filters would actually solve it. But that's not the reason they complain, so they want to stop checks entirely, whether or not they know its happening. The filter doesn't actually stop /checks, it just makes you ignorant of the situation.

[zoobernut]

so then in that case i think its entirely completely 100% rude of people to get mad at you for checking them because it is built into the game mechanics if they want to get mad then get mad at SE.

i guess i really dont understand the concept of getting mad or thinking an action is "Rude" in a video game where there is no concequence or direct effect on you by someone elses action. and like you said worst case scenario someone checks you and your wearing gimp gear and they are rude to you as a result of the gear you are wearing but that is not the action of checking that is rude it is how the person deals with that information that is rude.

if there was no message indicating you were checked and there never was a message then i dont see how it could be viewed as a rude action if you never knew it was happening. the only way is if someone told you they checked you. but then it wouldnt be rude to check someone it would be rude to discuss someones gear with them... at least thats how i see it.

[Khamsin]

so then in that case i think its entirely completely 100% rude of people to get mad at you for checking them because it is built into the game mechanics if they want to get mad then get mad at SE.

i guess i really dont understand the concept of getting mad or thinking an action is "Rude" in a video game where there is no concequence or direct effect on you by someone elses action. and like you said worst case scenario someone checks you and your wearing gimp gear and they are rude to you as a result of the gear you are wearing but that is not the action of checking that is rude it is how the person deals with that information that is rude.

if there was no message indicating you were checked and there never was a message then i dont see how it could be viewed as a rude action if you never knew it was happening. the only way is if someone told you they checked you. but then it wouldnt be rude to check someone it would be rude to discuss someones gear with them... at least thats how i see it.

It's rude of me to flip you off in front of your face, but if your back is turned, then its not rude!

[markasstrick]

some people are just cunts, only thing worse than jp's like this are na's who fake being jp and act like this. one of the things that pissed me off the most was jps with "All JP PT only," or something like "English umm /no," i used to find them if i was just lfging or doing nothing and spam check them

[Swatt]

I've seen a JP THF around on my server... wish I could remember her name. She had what looked like really good gear, so I was curious.

I found that every time you check her, she will swap gear for at least a minute. And when she stops, if you try to check her again, gear swaps again! I never understood why.

Found out as of two days ago she still does it.

i do that =p not cuz i don't like being checked...it annoys the piss out of checkers

and re: starr's 20 time checking spree... its ctrl C vs ctrl 9/0 anyways, just who has the most patience =p

[zoobernut]

so then in that case i think its entirely completely 100% rude of people to get mad at you for checking them because it is built into the game mechanics if they want to get mad then get mad at SE.

i guess i really dont understand the concept of getting mad or thinking an action is "Rude" in a video game where there is no concequence or direct effect on you by someone elses action. and like you said worst case scenario someone checks you and your wearing gimp gear and they are rude to you as a result of the gear you are wearing but that is not the action of checking that is rude it is how the person deals with that information that is rude.

if there was no message indicating you were checked and there never was a message then i dont see how it could be viewed as a rude action if you never knew it was happening. the only way is if someone told you they checked you. but then it wouldnt be rude to check someone it would be rude to discuss someones gear with them... at least thats how i see it.

It's rude of me to flip you off in front of your face, but if your back is turned, then its not rude!

If I turn around and see you flipping me off then yeah I will be pissed off by it but I dont walk around all day pissed off at the possibility that people are flipping me off behind my back and I missed seeing it. Again the dependence on being angry about someones actions is entirely dependent on your ability to observe it. If they can not observe you checking them which in the game is the little piece of text that says that you have been checked then how the hell would they know if someone is checking them.