Upcoming Version Update (02/09/2007)

[Toth]

Ditto for PUP. Cat 2 merits could finally be the missing key to PUP finding its role endgame, although I really want some gear that effects my automaton's performance ala SMN AF and relic.

[Khamsin]

I think the update has the potential to be pretty interesting. For one, they never give much detail at this stage of an update. They just give a little teaser note that an update is coming, then give more info as the update draws near.

There'll be a new assault area, which means 7 new assault missions you can do the day of the patch. There'll be new monsters, which may or may not include new NMs or HNMs. There'll be new system additions and improvements, which means something added or changed about the game itself. Since they already mentioned Chocobo Racing and Beseiged, the "system additions and improvements" could be anything from Colloseum, Group II merits for BLU/COR/PUP, merit cap increases, Windurst's Conflict, job adjustments, NM adjustments, or just about anything else that either adds an event or changes the game mechanics or fundamentals. Those types of changes usually spark at least some interest.

[Tajin]

PUP role endgame?

Cant PUP configure their automatons to suit either DD/Support or DD mage role?

even with all the lol factor of bringing a pup to a fight, i dont see why you need SE to tell you which is the role of a job at endgame.

(given the fact NIN wasnt supposed to be a tank, and BST cant charm shit in the big fights)

[Toth]

A PUP can do many things on HNMs but the maton is limited in what it can achieve. Better gear and Cat2 merits can help increase an automaton's overall ability and help lessen the whole lolstigma.

[Khamsin]

Ditto for PUP. Cat 2 merits could finally be the missing key to PUP finding its role endgame, although I really want some gear that effects my automaton's performance ala SMN AF and relic.

Some PUP Group II merits I can think of that would allow PUP to better fill its role:

(Passive Trait) Increases H2H skill by 20 per merit.
(Job Ability) Boosts Accuracy and Attack of you and your automaton for 3 min. 5 min recast.
(Passive Trait) Occasionally bash your opponent with your Animator as an extra attack in a round.

[LD]

Windurst's Conflict?

Also, I'm not saying PUP can't be helped, but it would take a massive overhaul of game mechanics, spells, maton behavior, and abilities to 'fix' it.

[Jiade]

Wind: Perfect Dodge

If a Wyrm used this... it might make LVL75 BP's NON RETARDED. Well... less non-retarded. Of course, you'd want to nuke a Wind Wyrm with ice LOL so you'd have to have Shiva out. >.< Ok, scratch my ideas.

[Tajin]

Ditto for PUP. Cat 2 merits could finally be the missing key to PUP finding its role endgame, although I really want some gear that effects my automaton's performance ala SMN AF and relic.

Some PUP Group II merits I can think of that would allow PUP to better fill its role:

(Passive Trait) Increases H2H skill by 20 per merit.
(Job Ability) Boosts Accuracy and Attack of you and your automaton for 3 min. 5 min recast.
(Passive Trait) Occasionally bash your opponent with your Animator as an extra attack in a round.

That sounds like a MNK, so level MNK instead? o.O

what SE should do is give PUP a B- OR B+ skill in H2H (but yeah... >.>)

[Skjie]

I like the TOAU storyline, and don't mind that the fights are easy >.> means I get to get my reading/storyline fetish on faster :D

COP was fantastic when you were done with it.

[Toth]

PUP =/= MNK but our main source of damage, the automatons, still need work.

[Tajin]

question is:
Anyone dares to take a PUP thru all of CoP?


i dont and AFK food >.>

[Khamsin]

Ditto for PUP. Cat 2 merits could finally be the missing key to PUP finding its role endgame, although I really want some gear that effects my automaton's performance ala SMN AF and relic.

Some PUP Group II merits I can think of that would allow PUP to better fill its role:

(Passive Trait) Increases H2H skill by 20 per merit.
(Job Ability) Boosts Accuracy and Attack of you and your automaton for 3 min. 5 min recast.
(Passive Trait) Occasionally bash your opponent with your Animator as an extra attack in a round.

That sounds like a MNK, so level MNK instead? o.O

what SE should do is give PUP a B- OR B+ skill in H2H (but yeah... >.>)

An A- skill in H2H would be nice. Even if PUP had A+ skill in H2H, an accuracy and attack JA, and a trait to add in an extra attack occasionally (e.g. double attack, triple attack, kick attack type trait), it still would be distinct from a MNK. Afterall, a WAR isn't a BST because it uses axes, and a DRK isn't a WAR because they both can use G.Axe and G.Sword and have Attack/Accuracy abilities and wear much of the same equipment.

A PUP and MNK could have comparable skill, but differ in their equipment and things like automaton, counter, chi blast, etc.

[Jeryhn]

I want to see the other wyrms come out tbh with drops better than anything in the game.

Lightning wyrm, En-Thunder, wing adds stun effect
Thundaga III, Shockspikes, some Thunder damage blast

Wind Wyrm, En-Aero, Wing adds silence
Aeroga III, Blink, A wind damage Blast

Holy Wyrm, En-Light, wing adds dia 3
Banshiga III, various buff's, Holy damage blast

Water wyrm, En-Water, wing adds poison.
Waterga III, Waterga IV, water damage blast.

insert whatever 2hours you want.

Normal wyrm's two-hours correspond to the element of the wyrm. So it should be something like this:

Lightning: Eagle Eye Shot - Shoots a massive ball of lightning energy once every landing, on a random person on the hate list (similar to Proto-Ultima's Holy II and Gulool Ja Ja's Vorpal Wheel). OR Hundred Fists (LOL)

Wind: Perfect Dodge

Holy: Benediction - Every landing after the first, meaning you have basically 6 minutes to zerg the wyrm down.

Water: Manafont - Every landing, with immediate -ga IV cast. OR Meikyo Shisui

Those would be pretty hot.

More elemental wyrm fights would definitely be interesting. Here's some of the ideas I've cooked up:

Wind Wyrm
Two Hour: Perfect Dodge when Grounded
Traits: Enaero, Silence Wing, Wind Breath
Magic: Aeroga III, Silencega, Graviga, Blink (Chainspell speed)
Idea: A highly evasive wyrm that will dodge most physical attacks, a BLM -ga magic fight.

Lightning Wyrm
Two Hour: Chainspell when Airborne (limited to casting Stun)
Traits: Enthunder, Stun Wing, Thunder Breath
Magic: Thunder IV, Thundaga III, Shock Spikes, Stun
Idea: Imagine... a wyrm chainstunning you w/ random targeting.

Water Wyrm
Two Hour: Manafont
Traits: Enwater, Poison Wing, Water Breath, Magic Counter.
Magic: Waterga III, Poisonga 2.
Idea: Because Thunder is such an obviously strong elemental tier vs. this dragon, this Wyrm should have Magic Counter (like Fortitude and Colibri) to reflect magic back at spell-slinging mages.

Holy Wyrm
Two Hour: Astral Flow
Traits: Enlight, Dia Wing, Holy Breath
Magic: Holy 2 (only attack spell), summons light elementals.
Idea: This dragon's summons could work exactly opposite of Vrtra's. Where Vrtra's undead will simply try to kill you, this dragon's light elementals act as its support and do not freely attack any players, but rather spam Cure/Protect/Shell/Haste/Regen spells on its master. Astral Flow causes all spirits to cast Banishga III at top hate target. (I didn't choose Benediction as 2HR because of the fact that AV is very gay.)

[Lordwafik]

Cat2 merits should really be :

(Passive Trait) "Realization" - understanding that the pup himself isn't the main focus on his job, and his puppet is.

You don't see SMN meleeing on <HNM> , their pets are, same for bst. Same goes for all the pet jobs with controllable pets.

[Toth]

Cat2 merits should really be :

(Passive Trait) "Realization" - understanding that the pup himself isn't the main focus on his job, and his puppet is.

You don't see SMN meleeing on <HNM> , their pets are, same for bst. Same goes for all the pet jobs with controllable pets.

While that is true, neither SMN or BST have Hand-to-Hand and that's broken as it is.

[Ryko]

While that is true, neither SMN or BST have Hand-to-Hand and that's broken as it is.

BST has a (debateably) more powerful weapon and (easily) more powerful skill grade option

[Lordwafik]

Cat2 merits should really be :

(Passive Trait) "Realization" - understanding that the pup himself isn't the main focus on his job, and his puppet is.

You don't see SMN meleeing on <HNM> , their pets are, same for bst. Same goes for all the pet jobs with controllable pets.

While that is true, neither SMN or BST have Hand-to-Hand and that's broken as it is.

Broken as in "Oh my god it's great" or broken as in "this fucking sucks" ?

[Khamsin]

If anything, think of PUP to MNK as DRK to WAR. That's how it should be, I think. DRKs can melee like WAR and have some magic. PUPs can melee like MNKs and have an automaton... they only sound "overpowered" if you think of it in a Bradyguide mindset.

Naturally, DRKs aren't automatically better than WARs because zomg they have magic, and PUPs wouldn't automatically be better than MNKs if they had comparable melee skills just because it has an automaton.

The reason I don't want the PUP itself to take a back seat role is because all the efforts to get good melee gear would be in vain. lol, imagine getting usukane set and then never actually punching anything.

The PUP AF quests also make it clear (story-wise) that you're supposed to work as a team, not just let one or the other do all the work. The PUP ENM, and possibly the PUP Maat, illustrate the need to work together, as well. You have to fight alongside, and sometimes share hate with, your automaton to succeed.

For a SMN, its not teamwork, its Avatar slavery. SMN is the job that is all about the pet, not the master. DRG is the job that is all about the master, not the pet. BST and PUP I think are middle ground jobs, with PUP possibly having the most balance between the automaton and master's contribution to a fight.

You're only gimping yourself if you let the automaton do all the work so you can sub WHM and stay off to the side.

I would say its silly for a PUP to aim to be the bulk of their damage in spite of the automaton, but its equally silly to say the automaton should be the bulk of the damage, as well. It's meant to be a co-dependancy and a team effort on your role.

[Toth]

It's broken in a good way and you don't need to go /nin to enjoy dual wield.

[divisortheory]

I bet this update is going to be amazing. You know how the very first update announcement always sounds amazing and it turns out to be complete shit? Well they're doing the opposite here. The update sounds like shit, so it's going to turn out to be amazing. I bet they'll raise merit caps.