Upcoming Version Update (02/09/2007)

[Ryko]

It's broken in a good way and you don't need to go /nin to enjoy dual wield.

I more meant the whole A- Axe skill, kinda the same as WAR's. Nevermind the whole gear option thing.

[Nystul]

I bet this update is going to be amazing. You know how the very first update announcement always sounds amazing and it turns out to be complete shit? Well they're doing the opposite here. The update sounds like shit, so it's going to turn out to be amazing. I bet they'll raise merit caps.

I was thinking this as well though I think we can all agree it's far more fun to sit around and piss and moan about how everything sucks. Don't sunshine on our rainy parade!

[Jeryhn]

I bet this update is going to be amazing. You know how the very first update announcement always sounds amazing and it turns out to be complete shit? Well they're doing the opposite here. The update sounds like shit, so it's going to turn out to be amazing. I bet they'll raise merit caps.

I'd like to have Cacodemonia and the extra Bloodpact Fenrir was supposed to have. ;;

[Lordwafik]

It's broken in a good way and you don't need to go /nin to enjoy dual wield.

BST have access to good Scythe Dagger and Axe skill, but once again, we are smart enough to know our roles.


I've done 1600 rampages on mobs, 1100 eviscerations, and I didn't need to /nin for either of those. Both of them were with /war in fact.

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4729/wtfpwnqt0.jpg
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7047/bstevizf8.jpg

I've also had good dmg on exp mobs but not amazing, more 600-800'ish, but I don't have pics as they were done a long time ago and these are more recentl.

You guys don't need fixing when you basically have a permanently T-VT charmed pet with you at all times. The reason BST have slightly higher skill is weaker summoned jugpets, SMNs don't have high skill because their pets do everything for them, pups would be extremely broken with higher skill/damage output. Can you imagine a MNK with a pup's pet? That's what you're asking for basically.

[HAcoreRD]

They won't raise the level cap because they dont' want current HNMs to become too easy. That would mean they have to design new HNMs which are harder, and we all know they don't like to do that

If they did they'd probably restrict some JA's like Dragoon's Call Wyvern.

say....Convert?

[deivi]

I'd like to have Cacodemonia

its been awhile since I fought diabolos, what did that move do?

[Jeryhn]

I'd like to have Cacodemonia

its been awhile since I fought diabolos, what did that move do?

Cursega. I forget if it deals damage too. Should fall under the Ward category along with the other buff Fenrir was supposed to get (a rumored Refreshga Bloodpact).

[Xavier]

I wish Square wouldn't announce shit, and just randomly release an update. It'd save everyone the trouble of a month of bitching and condense it down into a day or two.

[Toth]

It's broken in a good way and you don't need to go /nin to enjoy dual wield.

BST have access to good Scythe Dagger and Axe skill, but once again, we are smart enough to know our roles.


I've done 1600 rampages on mobs, 1100 eviscerations, and I didn't need to /nin for either of those. Both of them were with /war in fact.

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4729/wtfpwnqt0.jpg
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7047/bstevizf8.jpg

You guys don't need fixing when you basically have a permanently T-VT charmed pet with you at all times. The reason BST have slightly higher skill is weaker summoned jugpets, SMNs don't have high skill because their pets do everything for them, pups would be extremely broken with higher skill/damage output. Can you imagine a MNK with a pup's pet? That's what you're asking for basically.

No one is asking for that and no one is doubting BSTs cannot do fantastic damage. The job of PUP does need some kind of boost for the maton mostly and also something no matter how slight for the master. I can hit most HNMs with sushi but not much else. I wouldn't mind something to help make me more useful. Even the automaton, while a good DD, cannot come close to other jobs in total DoT and sheer power. These points are what SE needs to address.

[Jeryhn]

I can hit most HNMs with sushi but not much else.

Don't most melee jobs typically use sushi anyway with A- to B+ skill in their normal weapons (excluding SAWS roles) when fighting HNMs?

[Vobent]

Where's that guy complaining about BLMs?

[Khamsin]

It's broken in a good way and you don't need to go /nin to enjoy dual wield.

BST have access to good Scythe Dagger and Axe skill, but once again, we are smart enough to know our roles.


I've done 1600 rampages on mobs, 1100 eviscerations, and I didn't need to /nin for either of those. Both of them were with /war in fact.

http://img142.imageshack.us/img142/4729/wtfpwnqt0.jpg
http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/7047/bstevizf8.jpg

I've also had good dmg on exp mobs but not amazing, more 600-800'ish, but I don't have pics as they were done a long time ago and these are more recentl.

You guys don't need fixing when you basically have a permanently T-VT charmed pet with you at all times. The reason BST have slightly higher skill is weaker summoned jugpets, SMNs don't have high skill because their pets do everything for them, pups would be extremely broken with higher skill/damage output. Can you imagine a MNK with a pup's pet? That's what you're asking for basically.

Can you imagine a WAR with black magic? That would be so hax.

Though, what I would like to see is PUP adjusted so that a PUP in their best gear + Automaton in best attachments will parse equal with a MNK in their best gear.

Or, if you make the argument that PUP will have better gear down the road, then at least parse equally a PUP in their future best gear + automaton versus a MNK in current best gear.

And if that's still too hax for you, then at least a naked PUP + naked automaton parsing equally with a naked MNK.

[Ryko]

I can hit most HNMs with sushi but not much else.

Don't most melee jobs typically use sushi anyway with A- to B+ skill in their normal weapons (excluding SAWS roles) when fighting HNMs?

I think the only HNMs I use sushi on are kirin and faf tbh. All of the ones post zilart have the evasion of a broken hipped grandmother.

[Lordwafik]

except that all jobs were intentionally made not equal ? Which is another fact I love seeing players bitch about.

Jobs were meant to excel at certain things that others can't. MNK can rape faces for xp, not so much HNM, however they can CStank alot of things.

BLM suck for merits/xp, but are great on HNM/Dynamis. PUP arent too flashy for xp, but great for Dyna/Salvage/Limbus and events like that, PLD suck at XP, but great for HNM, etc etc etc.

[Khamsin]

Well, I guess I'm straying a bit from my original point.

Mainly, I just think PUP, however strong it is or isn't, should be on par with its automaton. Should be 50/50, which does mean bring the automaton up to par since I parse for more than my automaton.

However, people should not say that a PUP works through its automaton, because the automaton is only half of it. It's not a SMN where the master stays back, and its not a DRG where the pet is a mere bonus (unless subbing a mage job, then its much more). The AF storyline makes it apparent, and playing the job itself makes it apparent, that both master and pet are vital to whatever role you are trying to fill.

So, to that end, it would be bad if SE just gave us automaton improvements and adjustments to the exclusion of all else such that the master is reduced to a /WHM back line job. What needs to happen is automaton improvements, but keeping in mind the fact the master is still meant to be half the job and is an active participant.

[Lordwafik]

Yeah coz storyline means so much. BST storyline shows the most intense bonding in the storylines of pets being loyal to us and coming to us when we're in need, yet when we release our pets they depop on us. Hardly a point.

[Siatdiat]

except that all jobs were intentionally made not equal ? Which is another fact I love seeing players bitch about.

Jobs were meant to excel at certain things that others can't. MNK can rape faces for xp, not so much HNM, however they can CStank alot of things.

BLM suck for merits/xp, but are great on HNM/Dynamis. PUP arent too flashy for xp, but great for Dyna/Salvage/Limbus and events like that, PLD suck at XP, but great for HNM, etc etc etc.

I usually like LW posts. I understand that your stating a fact, but I guess im disappointed that you think shitty balance is good game design. The players of BG are a poor comparison of the average ffxi player. Alot of people also play from the perspective of concentrating on 1 single job. I think squares only intention myself allowing players to level multiple jobs is so they could level subs up for whatever they were. Of course people would eventually level another but imo it wasnt their original idea. I think every now and then SE gets shaken up and changes their main goal for this game, because at the start they never expected ffxi to last this long or do this well especially outside of japan. Everything imo has been a last minute response to what players want, they didnt "plan ahead" so there isnt space for all the things people keep asking for. I agree that what your saying here is true, but I think that is a sad thing, especially since i think most likely that SE doesnt see it how you do, they think that the jobs are fine or they did until people bitched enough.

FFXI isnt a horrible game. But at this point it isnt great either. Yes, your friends are great and they make the game fun but that has nothing to do with how SE designed the game. If you look at the different facets of an online game, you have basic gameplay, i.e. battle system, class abilities, the meat and potatoes that attract people. People want to beat shit up, and they want it to be in an exciting format. FFXI exceled at this. Its why people play, even if they dont like endgame, they have fun just lvling other jobs to see what they are like and hang out with friends, its a chat room that you kill shit in.

There is alot to do in FFXI. For the long time endgame player who keeps leveling jobs, they can get on blm for Dynamis, then change to mnk for xp, then go farm on their bst or thf solo, etc. But for the average player who picked thief "because they always play rogue/thf classes" or the guy who picked war "because he always played tank(lol) classes" ffxi is not balanced. These people are doing what they want to, and enjoy it, but one day they hit 75, and discover that all classes are not created equally. This is why I think the idea of certain classes being good only for certain aspects of the game is bullshit and poor game design, and I doubt it was the intention of SE to be that way.

Edit: Additionally to pipe in on PUP balance, I dont see why they dont make the maton have atleast A- skill in whatever its using. The master only has h2h as an afterthought imho :/ They felt they had to give it some weapon so they gave it h2h, but the focus is on your puppet. I wouldnt be surprised if they gace it good skill, then ended up giving the master h2h also, so someone decided to lower the maton in accordance with it. They just dont get pet jobs and never will.

[Popsiclestick]

Besides the poor pups, where is the information on the monster battle area? :/

[Tajin]

LW quote

ffxi is not balanced.

If having a BRD+WHM+RDM(or BLM) + tank + 2 DD is not balanced idk what this game is :/

support + attack + defense, what else you need?

ok im generalizing too much but w/e <.<

[GraveRobberX]

Do you think SE right now is just concentrating more on the new alleged MMO rather than fix the old outdated MMO

I mean I understand, some jobs are way overpowered to others

The thing is, if you have all 18 jobs equal (balanced) and good at everything wouldn't the game become complacent?

Maybe the game staying unbalanced keeps people striving to reach the top
(To disprove therioes or show off what they can do)

Everyone went lolDrg, but there are areas the Drg shines, some places it doesn't, and that is where the other jobs come in hand

SE made the game as party-oriented game, 1 jobs strenght helps the other jobs weakness (You can see this by how some jobs just go together)

Maybe SE lost the foresight on how to keep the strenght/weakness ratio evened out thru 18 jobs

Most updates getting announce bring so many rumors, wouldn't it better to expect something rather than expecting everything
Atleast if SE brings a good update people will be pleasently surprised