Naruto

**Tajin** · 2014-02-13 21:07

Yes Sasuke can still go suck Kubo's dick for all I care.
Zabuza had a better 'redemption' moment.

Edit: At this point you can even argue Sasuke is basically a plotdevice to resurrect Orochimaru. Every other arc you can replace sasuke with 'generic naruto friend/foe' and the plot can remain more or less the same.

**Gredival** · 2014-02-13 21:08

Originally Posted by ronin sparthos

Is it really that hard to feel for Sasuke after what Itachi did to him? I mean, Itachi stuck to his ideals even when it meant some deep cover deception but until it was all revealed Sauce was pretty justified in his actions. Big bro treats you like shit for years, mindfucks you with Sharingan, fights you to the death and it's supposed to be all solid because he was really doing it to protect Konoha?

Welp, there goes years of my life on a bungled revenge plot. Cue psychosis and Mangekyos here. *insert revenge arc*

Now that Itachi has revealed everything and Sasuke has reconciled with his bro, you can look back at the petulance and justify most of Sauces actions. All in all he killed Danzo who needed to die and killed a couple of fodder idiots. Oh and he caused the Raikage to lose an arm because Raikage didn't give a shit. I'm still not feeling this Hokage nonsense though.

No Sasuke is a completely relatable character up until he learns the truth decides that the obvious solution is to wipe out Konoha. It would be understandable if he still hated Itachi for putting him through all that, though it was for the village, because it was messed up.

But instead he immediately forgave everything Itachi did and wanted to destroy Konoha vengeance. The fact that he has enough marbles to tell his groupies they are only going after those involved in turning Itachi to a double agent, but in reality he wants to wipe out the entire village, just emphasizes that his character took revenge to stupid levels.

There's a reason we all cheered when Killer B bust his chest open.

**Sho** · 2014-02-14 00:04

Originally Posted by Gredival

No Sasuke is a completely relatable character up until he learns the truth decides that the obvious solution is to wipe out Konoha. It would be understandable if he still hated Itachi for putting him through all that, though it was for the village, because it was messed up.

But instead he immediately forgave everything Itachi did and wanted to destroy Konoha vengeance. The fact that he has enough marbles to tell his groupies they are only going after those involved in turning Itachi to a double agent, but in reality he wants to wipe out the entire village, just emphasizes that his character took revenge to stupid levels.

There's a reason we all cheered when Killer B bust his chest open.

I think Kishi just wanted to portray a character that was not evil or good by any means, but a character that was deeply motivated by emotions as his end to means. From there he uses whatever means necessary to reach his goals. In anime terms, I liken him to Lelouch of Code Geass.

His emotions disillusioned him to the already half truths he knew at the time, but by that time, most readers wrote him off as a whiny bitch made person by then, without even fully knowing Itachi's backstory and Sasuke's sudden change of heart. That's why we find it even more annoying the fact that he FULLY learns about the past, but moves to subjugate Konoha in his own way, outside of Naruto's desires.

He no longer becomes disillusioned by the past and picks his own path to take, which goes from destroying Konoha, to just killing people involved with Itachi's "betrayal" to the ironic culmination of him desiring to become Hokage. Keep in mind that to the majority of fans, this no longer matters, because they wrote him off as a whiny bitch 3-4 years prior.

**Xno Kappa** · 2014-02-14 00:11

Originally Posted by Sho

I think Kishi just wanted to portray a character that was not evil or good by any means, but a character that was deeply motivated by emotions as his end to means. From there he uses whatever means necessary to reach his goals. In anime terms, I liken him to Lelouch of Code Geass.

His emotions disillusioned him to the already half truths he knew at the time, but by that time, most readers wrote him off as a whiny bitch made person by then, without even fully knowing Itachi's backstory and Sasuke's sudden change of heart. That's why we find it even more annoying the fact that he FULLY learns about the past, but moves to subjugate Konoha in his own way, outside of Naruto's desires.

He no longer becomes disillusioned by the past and picks his own path to take, which goes from destroying Konoha, to just killing people involved with Itachi's "betrayal" to the ironic culmination of him desiring to become Hokage. Keep in mind that to the majority of fans, this no longer matters, because they wrote him off as a whiny bitch 3-4 years prior.

Maybe I missed something but he literally learned nothing new from Edo Itachi, simply confirmation of what he already knows. And even then he was still confused on what to do until he hears Hashirama's story.

**Sho** · 2014-02-14 00:21

Originally Posted by Xno Kappa

Maybe I missed something but he literally learned nothing new from Edo Itachi, simply confirmation of what he already knows. And even then he was still confused on what to do until he hears Hashirama's story.

Yeah, you're right. Even so you can still shift the reader's mindset over 1-2 years and nothing would change on how they feel about the character. He still moves to become Hokage and create a better Konoha than his predecessors, which is a seemingly good act. He did take revenge to the next level, but it was all wiped clean just as fast after talking to Hashirama.

**Xno Kappa** · 2014-02-14 00:42

Regardless of whether or not Sasuke's slate has been wiped clean, readers hate him because he's just been a flat-out terrible character the last few years whose motives were ridiculous. It wasn't a character that Kishi portrayed as neither good or evil, but rather devoid of logic. That's why I put the onus on Kishi on why the character will forever be hated.

**Yugl** · 2014-02-14 00:43

Man, you guys make Sasuke's story more complicated than it really is. All he wants is revenge for his lolparents. He thought that would mean defeating Itachi since he was the one that actually took em out. He finds out that Konoha village is the real culprit. It's as simple as a stereotypical Asian mafia movie where the protagonist goes after the entire mafia when only one guy was ordered to make the hit. Not complicated.

Originally Posted by Xno Kappa

Maybe I missed something but he literally learned nothing new from Edo Itachi, simply confirmation of what he already knows. And even then he was still confused on what to do until he hears Hashirama's story.

He learns the details such as Shisui's role and all that, but nothing of significance that would change his mind. Quite frankly, his decision to protect the village is the most bullshit point of his story. All that other crap before at least made sense, but what did Hashirama's story do to sway his opinion exactly?

**Tymon** · 2014-02-14 01:02

It's Hashirama, he's ninja Jesus. The most powerful ninja ever to live except in the first 75% of the manga where he isn't even personally referenced by name and was considered to be behind both Hiruzen and Minato.

Missing anything?

**Vaspinne** · 2014-02-14 02:21

Originally Posted by Tymon

It's Hashirama, he's ninja Jesus. The most powerful ninja ever to live except in the first 75% of the manga where he isn't even personally referenced by name and was considered to be behind both Hiruzen and Minato.

Missing anything?

Hashirama obviously has his own special eye-power upgrade he's been hiding this entire time. He used it on Sasuke when he was telling his story.

Spoiler: show

Explains Sasuke's change of heart perfectly.

**Gredival** · 2014-02-14 03:06

Originally Posted by Vaspinne

Hashirama obviously has his own special eye-power upgrade he's been hiding this entire time. He used it on Sasuke when he was telling his story.

Spoiler: show

Explains Sasuke's change of heart perfectly.

That power was already used in the story; Shisui's eye.

**Vaspinne** · 2014-02-14 03:14

Originally Posted by Gredival

That power was already used in the story; Shisui's eye.

Breaking my balls with your "pointing out true things" bro

**Sunrider** · 2014-02-14 19:45

Originally Posted by Yugl

He learns the details such as Shisui's role and all that, but nothing of significance that would change his mind. Quite frankly, his decision to protect the village is the most bullshit point of his story. All that other crap before at least made sense, but what did Hashirama's story do to sway his opinion exactly?

I feel like Sasuke's resolve for revenge was already on shaky ground from the moment after Itachi died, when Obito told him how his clan really ended. His decision after that was basically hard-headedness, which was maybe softened up when he saw zombie Itachi again. By that point he was looking for any half-decent reason to abandon his crusade, which is why he grilled Hashirama, who revealed to him that Uchiha's eyes are basically doomed to turn them crazy. That maybe put the matter to rest for him.

**Eurell** · 2014-02-15 07:26

I disagree. He didn't even want revenge against Konoha until after Obito told him how his clan ended.

I actually like Sasuke as a character, loved him early on, and am enjoying him a lot now. But he really was just a huge bitch about things for a couple of years. Dude shit all over Itachi's life and dreams so he could "avenge" him.

**Abandon** · 2014-02-19 00:06

Naruto prediction, really

Spoiler: show

**Tajin** · 2014-02-19 00:09

I like that

**Abandon** · 2014-02-19 00:17

i dunno, still dont like the idea of everyone standing around, watching everything happen

**Vandole** · 2014-02-19 00:24

you have entirely wayyy too much time on your hands.

**trinironnie** · 2014-02-19 00:25

Navy doesn't keep ya busy lol

**Abandon** · 2014-02-19 00:59

not my prediction, lol. seen that shit while at work and thought it to be interesting

**Nekonaruto** · 2014-02-19 01:44

http://www.mangapanda.com/naruto/665

Yeah, scratch most of that prediction

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