Naruto

[Eurell]

Do you think Danzo could only avoid one attack? Didn't his shit last for a full minute?

[Uzor]

Also; using Izanagi doesn't require Senju DNA. All Uchiha's could use Izanagi, it's why Izanami was created.

[Rhyis.]

I think it disappeared either when he died or the minute was up.

[Uzor]

wasn't it 30 seconds at a time? Either way; it seem unlikely that a non-uchiha could keep it up for 10 minutes at a time as well as keeping Sharingan on 24/7 unless he was an Uchiha or had Uchiha DNA. So my point still stands.

[Eurell]

wasn't it 30 seconds at a time? Either way; it seem unlikely that a non-uchiha could keep it up for 10 minutes at a time as well as keeping Sharingan on 24/7 unless he was an Uchiha or had Uchiha DNA. So my point still stands.

Did he keep it up for 10 minutes? He phased into his other dimension for the majority of the explosion. And still couldn't keep izanagi up long enough to avoid the entire explosion.

[Corresapolonia]

As in the last chapter we saw that Kakashi used Kamui to save Naruto from that Kunai which was deflected by Tobi.
In this new chapter the Kunai hit Tobi on his mask and left a scratch on this very Mask.
kick my ass if i am totally shitting my mind right now but it could mean 1 thing at least (1 i could come up with)

1. Tobi has somehow Obito's second Eye (or maybe he is obito which would suck bad). As those two eyes work perfectly together (one for defense (tobi), one for offense (Kakashi) it must be relying on the same Idea of Kamui.
And as those two Techniques are actually one and the same even though they both serve different purposes, they will always connect when they are used to "warp" in the "block"-dimension, as seen in this chapter.
crappy example:

- tobi uses his technique in the narutoverse to be secure from Naruto's attack
- Kakashi uses his Kamui to transport the Rasengan into the "block"-Dimension
- As those 2 Techniques are one and the same considering the basics of this technique both must
be coming out the exact same spot in the "block"-Dimension.

Considering the movement of the Rasengan and Tobi's own speed it would fit as to where
the Rasengan explodes on him.

if that is the case then Tobi will set all he can into killing Kakashi (even though he would pretty much die after using Kamui that much).

bored as fuck that's why i wrote this garbage. Have fun everyone

[Thunder]

Do eyes have to work together? Sasuke's do, but the very first eyes we've seen (itachi) don't. Where Make fire vs destroy it and make fire vs tsukeyumi or whatevs

And plus, I think the line kakashi said about thinking tobi has 2 jutsu but really only 1 makes it a point that Tobi's "defense" space shifting is no different than kakashi's "offense" space shifting. I know that's what you said but I took it more literally. Couldn't it be that kakashi has the same exact ability as tobi but can't use it for anything besides his one-absorb thing because he lacks the uchiha blood and can't overuse/explore it?

[Souj]

I thought it was pretty obvious that the conclusion was that the place where Tobi phases in and out of, and the place that Kakashi puts things with Kamui is the same place. Thus why Tobi got hit with Kakashi's Kamui'd kunai when he was phasing through Naruto.

Kakashi's Kamui'd killer kunai

[Xno Kappa]

Hope this fight isn't as stretched out as the Sasuke/Itachi vs Kabuto bout. That shit felt like it last forever with every other chapter being flashbacks.

[Sunrider]

I think this fight could use some flashbacks by this point. We're overdue for some explanations about Tobi.

[Sho]

I believe it's Izuna, but not in the same way that Rhyis believes.

What I believe is that Tobi IS Izuna Madara, and Edo Tensei Madara IS the real, true Madara Uchiha. I've been putting in a lot of thought into it ever since a year and a half ago, and today the theory seems way more plausible than it has ever had, due to this Fourth Shinobi War Arc.

This is what I believe-- I believe that Madara & Izuna Uchiha, created an epically grand master plan to control the world via an Infinite Tsukyomi. They had this plan a very short time before Madara's Final Battle at Valley of the end vs the First Hokage, Hashirama Senju. This plan was more than likely formed just as Madara took Izuna's eyes to form his own Eternal Mangeyko after his own eyes went blind. They probably figured out the secrets on the Uchiha stone tablet, and learned about the natural evolution of the Rinnegan from the Sharingan, and started to work towards that, as per their grand scheme as well. I'm guessing their grand scheme also comprised of multiple parts:

1) Obtain the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path to house the Tailed Beasts to create the Ten Tails.
2) Evolve Madara's eyes to Rinnegan to be able to control and summon the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path.
3) Collect the DNA/chakra of a strong Senju clan member so as to use it in the Ten-Tails summoning.
4) Collect the other 8 Tailed Beasts outside of the Nine-Tails and store them in the statue.
5) Put them together and create the Ten Tails, ending in epic victory.

However, a little bit after, these plans were cockblocked due to an unknown reason leading to Madara's defection from Konoha. During this time he left to control the Nine Tails and run back a revenge fight with Hashirama before crushing Konoha. He was thought to have died after the fight, but this is more than likely false, seeing as he awakened Rinnegan just as planned, then died a short time afterwards. Before his death, the added a few more details to their plans:

1) Obtain the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path to house the Tailed Beasts to create the Ten Tails.
2) Evolve Madara's eyes to Rinnegan to be able to control and summon the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path. [Complete]
3) Collect the DNA/chakra of a strong Senju clan member so as to use it in the Ten-Tails summoning. [Complete]
4) Re-obtain the Nine Tails.
5) Collect the other 8 Tailed Beasts outside of the Nine-Tails and store them in the statue.
6) Revive Madara via Heavenly Samasara Technique in order to complete the Ten Tails summoning.
7) Put the Tailed Beasts together and create the Ten Tails, ending in epic victory.

If you read back, this actually makes sense-- when Madara was revived via Impure World Resurrection, he was angry and annoyed at the fact that he was revived in such a poor manner, as if he was already EXPECTING to be revived in a "perfect" state. He later states to the people fighting him that they would be "better off under the spell of an Infinite Tsukyomi." Kabuto and Orochimaru figured out this plan that was going on over the years, and they both each decided to cockblock these plans, with those of their own (this answers the true reasons behind Orochimaru's defection from Konoha, and research into the Impure World Resurrection technique and the Cursed Seal Technique as well as multiple other revival techniques to keep his consciousness alive). After all, Tobi was shocked when he saw Madara's body in Kabuto's possession, what other reasons would he be shocked for? Orochimaru even before this joined up with Akatsuki around the same time as Itachi, and started his plans to steal his sharingan and his body to further his own plans in opposition to Madara.

During the time Madara was dead, Izuna actively used his guise and reputation, and schemed to steal back the Nine Tails from the Third/Fourth Hokage and Kushina, and succeeded for a short time before being cockblocked by the Fourth's Thunder God Technique and sealing of the Nine Tails into Naruto. Izuna flees, and schemes to give Nagato his Rinnegan to revive Madara as well as help create Akatsuki and steal the other 8 Tailed Beast in the meantime. He accomplishes a great deal of their plan, stealing 7 of the 9 Tailed Beasts, as well as maintaining and watching over Nagato (and his Rinnegan, and the Demonic Statue of the Outer Path), all the while playing on his (Nagato's) emotions of want for a better world. Ironically what he didn't plan on is Naruto getting so powerful as to not only defeat Nagato, but also to stand in the way of he and his bro's ultimate plan. He also didn't count on Kabuto becoming just as dangerous as well, and decided to team up with him, but only after getting blackmailed with his brother's body (probably in relation to not wanting his brother to be revived via Impure World Resurrection). In retaliation and preparation, he takes back Rinnegan from the dead Nagato and forms his own Six Paths of Pain and continue the plan even without the full chakra of the Eight and Nine Tails. Madara on the other hand, severs his Edo Tensei contract with the now incapacitated Kabuto, and also moves to take back control of the Nine Tails inside Naruto (cockblocked currently by the 5 Kage) and continue the plan on his own terms as well.

Kurama (the Nine Tails) definitely knows who Tobi is, and clearly differentiates him from Madara.

Edit: The Nagato Rinnegan portion makes no sense due to it happening before the Nine Tails Attack on Konoha. That doesn't mean that Izuna didn't give him Rinnegan at a point in time before it.

[Eurell]

I can totally agree that Tobi might be Izuna, and most of what you said makes plenty of sense. I just think the theory of Madara giving Izuna his eyes instead of vice verse is ridiculous lol.

[Null]

I think this fight could use some more rocks by this point. We're overdue for some explanations about Tobi.

I'm sure we will get plenty of Tobi flashbacks as soon as his mask breaks.

[Xno Kappa]

Why wouldn't Izuna just take back his eyes after Madara's death?

[Uzor]

Why wouldn't Izuna just take back his eyes after Madara's death?

I just thought of this, and I've an idea; If it is indeed Izuna, it makes sense that he'd take Madara's eyes after his death. The problem being that they're really his eyes; meaning that he'd go blind from using it. To counter it, he might have stolen Obito's right eye and uses that one mainly - which might be why he covered the left side of his face -- where he has his real eye -- to prevent that eye from going blind and thus being useless. Y'know, similar to how Kakashi hides his eye when he's not using it.

[Xno Kappa]

Hmmm. If he took back his own eyes he'd still be blind in that state so he implanted them into Nagato in order to completely unlock the Rinnegan and ultimately regain his sight as well. Thus the phrase "there were mine to begin with." And it's apparent real Madara lived long enough to know who Nagato is so the brothers planning this all out is plausible. Izuna is making more and more sense. Only part that doesn't fit to me at all was the whole Mizukage bit.

[Sho]

I can totally agree that Tobi might be Izuna, and most of what you said makes plenty of sense. I just think the theory of Madara giving Izuna his eyes instead of vice verse is ridiculous lol.

Oh yeah, I wasn't agreeing with that part, lol.

Why wouldn't Izuna just take back his eyes after Madara's death?

I'm guessing he had his mind set on reviving Madara for a very long time up until some point and didn't want to take his Eternal Mangekyo. Meanwhile, he could have been simply stealing other fallen Uchiha eye's and ended up taking Obito's crushed eye at some point... would explain why his eye jutsu uses the same pocket dimension as Kakashi's.

Heres Madara's revival, just to remind everyone why I even posted that gigantic wall of text:

http://www.likenaruto.com/wp-content...60-600x321.png
http://www.likenaruto.com/wp-content...60-600x391.png

&

http://www.likenaruto.com/wp-content...an-600x519.jpg
http://www.likenaruto.com/wp-content...09-600x292.jpg

[Souj]

God Damn it! Why are you people still talking about this Tobi crap!

[Olbohn]

What was Kakashi referring to when he said "I've never heard of the Kamu being stopped before" and he has a flashback of the 10 tails? I didnt quite understand that panel

[Sho]

God Damn it! Why are you people still talking about this Tobi crap!

Because debunking the masses that believe Tobi is Obito is fun.