Heated Endgame Discussion

[divisortheory]

on a different note.

What would be the downside of removing D. Ring from KB and Ridill from Faffy, and relocating them to a BC? It would keep the people that have all the ABJ they would ever want from returing to the camp to waste 3 hours of their lives every day. and would give the newer players the chance to get said ABJ's.

As long as they don't go the way fo the Kraken Club by decreasing the drop rate even further, lol.

[Tajin]

Halfassed story of Yin

Where are the wamouras?

[Skjie]

Is there anyway we could cut all of the bickering out of this and split the topic back to Bercus' emails?

All it would take for that to happen, is for Bercus to get a response to the questions, I wouldnt recommend holding your breath while you wait.

Well, I was thinking split the topic, seeing as it's almost 20 pages of generic bitching since the last email.

[Rocl]

Halfassed story of Yin

Where are the wamouras?

The Wamoura Wars are a totally different event.

[Sykes]

Limbus was not "easy" on the day of release.

Yes it was. The only thing even remotely difficult about Limbus was Ultima, and any half-way competent shell could easily win on their second Ultima run (assuming they couldn't recover and win on their very first one). Everything else in Limbus (including Omega) was a joke, and any reasonably well-prepared group who didn't win a zone on their very first try surely won it on their second.

[Toth]

Hmm...the lack of news for this upcoming patch is quite disappointing. It is looking increasingly likely that there may be only 2 more announcements tops and you know one is about chocobo racing. What info could they be waiting for to be released before replying to Bercus?

[S N K]

Honestly I'd like to see SE add maybe 3 more lines to a macro box for gear swaps. 6 lines just isn't enough for my THF and I hate having to give up two more boxes just to swap out for Accuracy and TP gear.

[Ninjiz]

Limbus was not "easy" on the day of release.

Yes it was. The only thing even remotely difficult about Limbus was Ultima, and any half-way competent shell could easily win on their second Ultima run (assuming they couldn't recover and win on their very first one). Everything else in Limbus (including Omega) was a joke, and any reasonably well-prepared group who didn't win a zone on their very first try surely won it on their second.

People still managed to whipe here and there. I dont think people first few Omegas were a "joke" at all. We manage dto whipe once on omega, after that we never whiped again. But it wasnt ridicluously easy. Omega and Ultima back then was harder to me then any sky god or King. And even non Omega and Ultima fights were challenging at first. Mostly i Tremenos, or the Kings Appolyon floor if you wanted to kill them all. It all became way easy after a few runs, because you all know what to do eactly to win. Just Like how a lot of Dynamis zones are easy with people who know what they are doing.

[Tajin]

Halfassed story of Yin

Where are the wamouras?

The Wamoura Wars are a totally different event.

Oh, my bad

[Xavier]

My life has only gotten more difficult since I started hearing the voice of Aegis in my head too.

[Xavier]

Is there anyway we could cut all of the bickering out of this and split the topic back to Bercus' emails?

All it would take for that to happen, is for Bercus to get a response to the questions, I wouldnt recommend holding your breath while you wait.

Well, I was thinking split the topic, seeing as it's almost 20 pages of generic bitching since the last email.

What you call generic bitching I call actual debate of serious problems. Sorry if the carebear shit that was going on before was more your style, but it'll be split.

Gee golly gosh Square tehehe I sure hope ya listen to us, its been forever since we had a fishing update!

[Dustybrown]

Is there anyway we could cut all of the bickering out of this and split the topic back to Bercus' emails?

All it would take for that to happen, is for Bercus to get a response to the questions, I wouldnt recommend holding your breath while you wait.

I think Siadiat is right. We've been waiting on a response from them since November (technically earlier, but this specific response relates to November). I understand they're a big corporate company, but does it honestly take 4/5 months to answer a dozen questions?

I think the reason that people have digressed from the topic is that there is very little which can be said about it which hasn't already been said. Bercus has been sent several emails which show varying versions of "I'm sorry, we have no answers right now, but you'll get them soon". There's not really much that can be commented on that until we have some actually answers from the questions. At that point there will be plenty of discussion. As it stands, after months of waiting for comments on game suggestions which SE specifically said they would like to hear, it just seems like another one of those situations where they promise something but nothing worth comment comes from it (think 'we're making changes to Ulli').

Until we get some actual info from them, derailing is pretty much where this thread is going.

[Jeryhn]

Smells like thread split.

[Xavier]

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o...kytrouble2.jpg

http://people.freenet.de/DiamantLS/S...tsystemcu2.jpg

Probably two of the better pictures that illustrate and give a way around the current bottlenecking. I also want monsters like Khimaira, Hydra, Jorm, Tiamat and Cerb to have gear that at least equals the drops off of 3 Kings, and not noticeably shittier in most cases.

And if you really think progression would kill the game, look at BRP's example as a solution. 3 Kings have been around since Zilart. They've run their course. Instancing them into orb battles would allow everyone the opportunity to fight them, get their drops, etc. Then, because everyone was able to fight the original 3 Kings and get geared up, they could be competitive in going after Tiamat, Jorm, Khim, etc.

Then, in the next expansion, you could introduce BCNM/instanced encouters of those previous HNMs, while introducing new world HNMs with slightly better gear.

You could leave all of the older HNMs out in the world too if you created a seperate instance for them as well, to perserve the competition and ability to at least have 1 killed a day if nobody did the BCs anyway.

(This is all ignoring Dynamis / Limbus / Salvage, because I think those are more controllable timed events and I just want to focus on World HNMs, which I think is the largest problem in the game right now.)

I also had the chance to re-read the entire original thread while I was seperating, and I find it hilarious that there hasn't been a single real answer in the 3 months since the questions were compiled.

[Rocl]

My life has only gotten more difficult since I started hearing the voice of Aegis in my head too.

I can't wait to write about the Aegis (*'-')
I mean, decipher the Book of Yin

[Taj]

The only thing moving orb drops to other HNMs would do is move all of the botting to said HNMs, regardless of how many drop said orbs. If five HNMs drop the Behemoth orb, Linkshells are just going to send five bot/stall teams to each HNM during their respective windows. I don't see how the Orb idea is going to alleviate current problems at all.

[Xavier]

The only thing moving orb drops to other HNMs would do is move all of the botting to said HNMs, regardless of how many drop said orbs. If five HNMs drop the Behemoth orb, Linkshells are just going to send five bot/stall teams to each HNM during their respective windows. I don't see how the Orb idea is going to alleviate current problems at all.

Because you can just make the Orb 200 Kindred Seals instead, problem fixed. Aren't you a genius or something?

[Taj]

The only thing moving orb drops to other HNMs would do is move all of the botting to said HNMs, regardless of how many drop said orbs. If five HNMs drop the Behemoth orb, Linkshells are just going to send five bot/stall teams to each HNM during their respective windows. I don't see how the Orb idea is going to alleviate current problems at all.

Because you can just make the Orb 200 Kindred Seals instead, problem fixed. Aren't you a genius or something?

I don't see anything about Kindred Seals on the neat diagram. I didn't say some variation of the Orb idea presented above wouldn't work, I said the idea, presented as is, is a miserable failure and totally sucks.

[Xavier]

I posted a ton of stuff edited in after I posted before I saw your comment and your comment was probably before you saw the rest of what I posted. I just used the picture to illustrate making it an orbed battle, I can't be bothered to edit the picture.

But if you read everything I said, I really think its the perfect solution to the games problem right now. You leave 3 Kings in the game, while creating a seperate instanced encounter using an orb, purchased by something that cannot be cock-blocked by another group. If Square really felt like draining the rest of the gil in the game, they could even just make it like a 1M Dynamis fee to enter. Other ideas such as massive amounts of kindred work too.

From there, you go onto the CoP Wyrms / ToAU HNMs, which currently do not have compareable drops to 3 Kings but are more challenging to kill, and actually replace their treasure pools with slightly superior gear. Them dropping higher quality gear will do absolutely nothing to cockblock newer players to the game, because even if they can't manage to claim the heavily botted 3 kings, they'll be able to still get the gear overtime through an instanced orb fight.

A suitable amount of time passes, and you repeat the system. All of this could run along-side additions like Dynamis, Limbus, Salvage, compliment it, etc. I just think the World HNM system is increadibly broken and either needs to be given up on or fixed. Theres just no point to new HNMs if 95% of their drops are complete trash.

[TheDiscoBiscuit]

Xavier, would the NQ HNM fights, if won, be 100% drop of HQ orb? Or would it be one of the kind where you would have to do multiple times to get the HQ orb, like cloud evoker/enm thing?