Heated Endgame Discussion

[BRP]

You are repeating yourself. (and ignoring or instantly dismissing things I say you don't like). This conversation is kind of pointless, so there is no point in dragging it on.

When I say gibberish, I mean the manner you type. It very poorly structured. Hard to read.

[FinalJustice]

I think i addressed everything you said, but oh well..

It just seems like everytime someone says the game has way less people (im sorry but anywhere approx the number 2k or anywhere near is a significant amount) then before a fact proven by using /sea all for the entire server then comparing it to the past, you argue its not the case.

Then when people say SE is finally listening to people, most likely due to fewer players then before, so they are trying to change to keep the player base, you argue against that too.

I never once said FFXI is some dying corpse that SE is absolutely desperate to keep afloat. But its clear that SE is trying to change to prevent that from happening.

As far as hard to read, if you say so. Ill go retouch that line for you.

[NynJa]

I hate to say it, but /sea isnt a proper guesstimate, especially if you're going by levels. /sea is only good if youre doing /sea all to see how many people are on the server, and even then that gets skewed by the mules and afkers. /sea all ##-## really doesnt work because of anons. On my server right now, /sea all returns 2500 exact, but /sea all 1-75 returns 1787. Thats about 1/3 on anon.

[BRP]

You did ignore some my points. You downplay ENMs for no real good reason. You ignored Fellowship as a sign of SE trying to install more solo/duo/trio content. And you apparently think I'm desperate to list farming for organs, which is odd since most of game is farming, but the case I listed grants a good amount of exp and semi-endgame rewards and requires 3 at most(most of the time).

It just seems like everytime someone says the game has way less people (im sorry but anywhere approx the number 2k or anywhere near is a significant amount) then before a fact proven by using /sea all for the entire server then comparing it to the past, you argue its not the case.

I know there is less players around than before, but 2k is very drastic. Doing the occasional /sea survey isn't really full-proof and it really matters on the server. From personal experience, I see the difference being no greater than 500, and that's just trying to ignore effects like Summer and holidays have.

I believe more people are quitting in the 1 to 60 range then they are 65 to 75, but that is an entire different topic. The point is, there are a lot of new players.

Then when people say \"SE is finally listening to people, most likely due to fewer players then before, so they are trying to change to keep the player base, you argue against that too.

I didn't say why SE is listening, I'm just saying they are. What you have said is that they have to make these changes to accommodate to a situation that requires more solo/duo/trio content. The game doesn't NEED it, it just wants it. Most solo/duo/trio content is blatantly ignored in favor of straight 6-man partying, if that isn't proof enough.

I never once said FFXI is some dying corpse that SE is absolutely desperate to keep afloat. But its clear that SE is trying to change to prevent that from happening.

Every MMO team is going to want to prevent their game from going under, it doesn't matter how much money they are making at the time. That's the whole point of their job.

Listing facts and things as facts is annoying and I don't know what point you are trying to make with it. Your argument would be a lot better off and easier to understand if you didn't do it. Its kind of a cliche asshole thing to say. Its always the annoying character who says "blah, blah. FACT. Blah, blah. FACT". Sounds like one of those "Truth" commercials.

[Yeargdribble]

I hate to say it, but /sea isnt a proper guesstimate, especially if you're going by levels. /sea is only good if youre doing /sea all to see how many people are on the server, and even then that gets skewed by the mules and afkers. /sea all ##-## really doesnt work because of anons. On my server right now, /sea all returns 2500 exact, but /sea all 1-75 returns 1787. Thats about 1/3 on anon.

I thought we were all referring to /sea all numbers. The fact is that /sea all returns quite a few less people than it did 2 years ago.

As far as mid-range, you really don't need a /sea all 37-70 to realize that there are a lot less people in that range. LFP on a mid-range jobs that isn't a refresher or healer can tell you that. Camps aren't as crazily busy as they once were either.

[FinalJustice]

When guessimating server population as a whole, i only use the /sea all. Like how about awhile back before the UK lanch doing a /sea all during prime time yielded close to 5.5k-6k users. Then SE adding a server or 2, and did the migration to the new server if people wanted to go from existing ones. Which dropped server counts at prime to about maybe 4.5-5k? Then the did world shift again, but that was for limited servers when they tried to increase the population while depopulating some of the more crowded ones. But still on average at that point after the 2 server jumps was still about 3.5-4k users on prime (anons included). Now youre lucky if you pass 2.5k-3k users at peak prime time for an entire server.

But yea, when judging job lvls and how many there are, its kind of hard to do, given the number of anons, and how many are mules. But those numbers can still shed a little light, but they wont be 100% on point.

Like now let me do a server search, even though i know its not prime time.
/sea all: 2307
/sea all 1-75: 1698

/sea all 1-70: 793
/sea all 5-70: 724
/sea all 10-70: 677
/sea all 70-75: 905
anon players: 609

I mean i know its 609 people anon so we dont know what they are, but i think its enough to guessimate the player proportions to a degree. My whole point with the sea all thing was A) show the number difference in total server populations from the past to now. And B) show a vast number of players are in fact high lvl. After that it is hard to get exact numbers.

[Dirian]

Theres definitely been alot less people in camps that used to be crowded has hell. Has made leveling sam kinda nice actually.


Finding people is kind of a bitch, but then finding tanks and refreshers was always a bitch.


Not having 6 parties crammed into secret room camp might be a sign of the server population dwindling, but I'm loving not camping 15 minute respawn mobs like its fucking last window nidhogg.

[FinalJustice]

You did ignore some my points. You downplay ENMs for no real good reason. You ignored Fellowship as a sign of SE trying to install more solo/duo/trio content. And you apparently think Im desperate to list farming for organs, which is odd since most of game is farming, but the case I listed grants a good amount of exp and semi-endgame rewards and requires 3 at most(most of the time).

I downplayed it because you keep making arguments i never brought up. I never said CoP was void of 1 or 2 solo activities. I said SE has made the biggest attempt to implement small group content in ToAU. Thats one of the whole focuses of teh entire expansion. Not a side activity added later on. And so what if the whole game is farming... thats like saying FFXI was solo friendly accross the board from the day it was released because at any given lvl you could farm if you were high enough compared to the mob... and just because a BLM can solo something is not an indication of the intention of solo content. Regardless of the gorget being useful. Assault was one of the best attempts from SE to implement small group content that yielded very good rewards. Even Salvage to a degree, and now this combat change with signet. I downplayed ENM because that is one instance, and im not even thinking about useless fellowships

I know there is less players around than before, but 2k is very drastic. Doing the occasional /sea survey isnt really full-proof and it really matters on the server. From personal experience, I see the difference being no greater than 500, and thats just trying to ignore effects like Summer and holidays have.

I dont think 2k is drastic, i use to do searches all the time back in the day, since i was always party ldr, and always searching for people. I always started out with /sea all, then would submenu my way to > lvl range > job. So im well aware of the number change from then till now thank you very much.

I didnt say why SE is listening, Im just saying they are. What you have said is that they have to make these changes to accommodate to a situation that requires more solo/duo/trio content. The game doesnt NEED it, it just wants it. Most solo/duo/trio content is blatantly ignored in favor of straight 6-man partying, if that isnt proof enough.

I didnt say they require a thing. I said they are doing it to make it easier to get things done in smaller groups, which is turns makes your player base happy. Because with less people around it gets harder for people to get things done, or even do basic things like form a party pre 70 without spending 5 hrs looking for a refresher. So it was natural that they would make some things easier for a smaller group. People complained about how much work it was. And this was a direct result of less people being around, and less people at any given party range compared to the past. Between people quiting, and thousands of accounts being banned, its only natural SE would try to do things to keep us happy, they have less money coming in. How you take that statement and say im saying FFXI is on its last leg, and its dying is beyond me. Ofcourse every company would want to keep its user base... but the fact remain SE for over 3 years did very little to do that. They didnt listen, they ignored us, they didnt communicate and give players what they wanted. That is a fact (and i dont care that you dont like facts)!

So despite you saying Every MMO team is going to want to prevent their game from going under, it doesnt matter how much money they are making at the time. Thats the whole point of their job. The fact remains SE was doing a very poor job of that. And what people are saying is that after all this time NOW se is trying to change, and that we think, we feel its because of less players then before, and them making some sort of attempt to finally listen to us. But youre the one who keeps trying to argue against this like its baseless.

Listing facts and things as facts is annoying and I dont know what point you are trying to make with it. Your argument would be a lot better off and easier to understand if you didnt do it. Its kind of a cliche asshole thing to say. Its always the annoying character who says blah, blah. FACT. Blah, blah. FACT. Sounds like one of those Truth commercials.

Im sorry if facts annoy you, that not my baggauge. Id much rather someone tell me something, then use a fact and examples to back it up, rather then pull information out of thin air and expect me to take it as truth... kind of like your dozen new players every 3 days piece.

[BRP]

Im sorry if facts annoy you

You completely misunderstood what I said here. Facts aren't annoying, they are very important. The way you are presenting some facts do nothing for anyone's argument, it just comes off as annoying/hard to read. A lot of what you are saying is coming off that way. Like for example, I don't know what you mean when you say "baggauge".


This is becoming a headache. Some parts of your argument don't seem to be in conflict with what I'm saying, so I'll just ignore those parts. Infact, since this will just be the same thing over and over, I'll just go to the only fresh part of this debate, my CoP examples.

ENMs and Assaults are very alike at their core. Assaults are practically dungeon-crawling ENMs. The big differences are the way they reward: ENM was instant exp and money drops(like BCNMs) and Assaults were ??? item and points to buy bigger items. No Assaults were designed for especially for 3 people, but there are ENMs designed for both solo and three people groups.

Fellowship seems a bit more helpful than higher evasion on EM or below monsters. It's only about as useless as you let it be. Let's not forget that the Fellowship quests themselves are all pretty much solo designed and some of the most entertaining quests in the game. They are clear indications that SE was trying to make solo/duo/trio content in CoP, which is my point entirely.

Farming and farming for end-game items are two completely different things and I'll leave it at that.

About server populations: I have can't recall seeing more than 3500 people on /sea all ever, and I'm very damn sure I've never seen more than 4000. Nowadays, I see 3000 being the norm at peak times. I think it matters too much on server, because I can't believe 6000 people at once.

[Sidanoir]

Server numbers aren't down to much at least not on Leviathan....we never had a populace server like say an Asura...

But we still have a good 3000 characters logged in...approaches 4000 on the weekend....

2000-3000 is typical for off peak times...

Camps are more crowded now than ever cause as was pointed out, there is far more 75s now..

I can't remember the last time I saw less than 100 people in sky at a reasonable hour.....makes farming triggers really annoying..used to sweep sky and get 2-3 of each trigger...now have to fight for just 1...

The chance of Fafnir appearing on your scren at spawn is near 0...gotta be on top of him to even have a claim shot....

[FinalJustice]

I dont care what you said BRP... your whole argument is baseless and consists of made up data. K Thnx, you continue to argue stuff no one is talking about, so have fun talking to yourself.

[BRP]

My god, the irony.

[FinalJustice]

Says the person who states there are over a dozen brand spanking new accounts every 3 days.... irony galore

[Beckwin]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nalfantasy.jpg

[Kandykanez]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nalfantasy.jpg

You're kidding, right? If you aren't... lol

[Jeryhn]

That's actually a pretty cool pic.

[BRP]

Are they pushing off WoW players? If so, that's hilarious. Either way, that's quite sig/win worthy.

[Epical]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...nalfantasy.jpg

Wonder what that guy has in his bazaar.

[MF Perm]

Are they pushing off WoW players? If so, that's hilarious. Either way, that's quite sig/win worthy.

People will complain it's too big. Beach Volleyball tournaments in vaginal orifaces will ensue.

[Beckwin]

Keeper Orland over at the gamefaqs ffxi pc board made that btw. Definitely made of win (and I hate saying "made of win" but its appropriate here).