Kirinburn question: Meat or Sushi?

[Demitrius]

I know the whole bit about swapping around bards to get madrigal/march/minuet x2. Know about busting 2-hours, WAR/NIN MNK/WAR, COR resets, etc etc. All I need to know is whether those of you who do this regularly would recommend meat or sushi. LS is pretty well geared, although no E-bodies or ridill wars or kraken drks. All the WARs will either be going axe/axe or axe/joy. Been trying to find out recommendations via search, but to no avail.

Eh? Thanks.

[divisortheory]

Meat. Get 1 THF to use Feint.

[Kirschy]

If you're getting march + mad for the duration of Kirin... Everyone should be fine with using meat. If youre planning on doing more than one run, your setup obviously won't depend on the use of 2hrs. If thats the case, you might not be keeping 6 songs on the whole time and my personal opinion is to stay safe and go Sushi with Minuet x2.

[RKenshin]

I wouldn't really recommend meat unless you're only doing 1-2 runs and/or plan to have a long cycle of THFs using Feint. For us that isn't practical, as we don't use CORs to refresh 2hs and a typical Kirin run is around 4 to 6 sets. In addition, our numbers are usually much lower than a standard LS.

I and the other DDs we've fought with all use sushi each attempt. Even with full accuracy gear (each of us wearing nearly all the best possible acc gear), Madrigal, and Sushi we'd never consistantly hit the accuracy cap (usually average about 3-5% short). Just the absense of Madrigal brought our hit-rates from a steady 85-95% down to 70-80%, and sushi gives around twice the accuracy as Madrigal.

We haven't had Feint active often (if ever?) during the fights either, but even so... Your average fight without 2hs will still take a good 5+ minutes or so depending on your numbers, and that's only assuming there's no mistakes. Unless you're only doing like one or two runs, you won't be able to rely on a fight lasting less than 1-3 minutes. After Aggressor wears your acc drops a decent amount, and sure Feint is great and all but in longer fights it's not practical to rely on. Missing the +60 or so acc from sushi will really hurt, so yeah.. I suppose it depends mostly on your situation.

[Demitrius]

Thanks for the tips. We've never tried it before, so we're going to do a failsafe test run by killing all the mini-gods and buffing up while kiting. Likely scenario is Kirin > minigods/farming > Kirin with two hours in between, so we'll have full access to abilities for the fights. As far as I know we have 1 Feint, maybe 2, so sushi + songs seems most likely.

[SeraphusRagnarok]

Angon is nice for Kirin TP burn \:D/

[Swatt]

Angon is nice for Kirin TP burn \:D/

what is this angon you speak of.

[Demitrius]

8 minutes first try, sleepga hit and aggressor wore then he 2hr'd and all sorts of crap, lol. 30% in about 2 minutes though. 2nd one coming, we didn't all blow 2hrs either. :D

[NynJa]

I'd say sushi...
I've got a pretty decent acc/haste build imo, but with meat I get around 50-60%.

Meat. Get 1 THF to use Feint.

1 Feint isnt gonna cut it, I think a 2hr Kirin run goes around 1 1/2 minutes (unless you're in a linkshell with 12 kraken drks).


Personally, its better safe than sorry, not to mention that if Astral Flow happens to kill you, your 2k sushi is lost instead of a 40k hedgehog pie.

[yrpaine]

most of us used sole+1 on our runs. many ppl didn't have top of the line gear or merrits.

[SeraphusRagnarok]

what is this angon you speak of.

DRG group 2 merit JA. Reduces target's defense by 20% for 60 seconds.

[Swatt]

what is this angon you speak of.

DRG group 2 merit JA. Reduces target's defense by 20% for 60 seconds.

what is this DRG you speak of.

[Keno]

what is this angon you speak of.

DRG group 2 merit JA. Reduces target's defense by 20% for 60 seconds.

what is this DRG you speak of.

win

[Fide]

Off topic:

So if only total of 4 songs & not planning on using 2 hours to kill, what would be best choice of songs? 2x acc + 2x haste?

[Fng]

I would go with Madrigal + Minuette IV and double March (+Sushi)

Or Double mad and double march..

If you are all using two hours I would swap in the minutte IV instead of lower tier ACC

Kinda hard to go over 15 mins with out two hours even... (1 spawn wich can be kited by a couple BLMs in most cases)

Oh and in our past attempts, the SAMs died first... >.>

Something about 4 skillchains in 20 seconds sorta gives them hate..

[Ravenlokk]

Minuetx3, Marchx2, Madrigalx1 ... Bard rotation :D
And Sole Sushi+1 ftw!

(as mentioned before,feint order will make meat viable.. but its a pain in the ass to micromanage swapping all the thieves on top of BRDs )

edit add: could drop the 3rd minuet for ballad 2 if you're short on healers ^^

[NynJa]

I thought we do min min march march mad mad/ballad2 ??

[Demitrius]

Our second one was slower and messier, came in around 12 minutes. Basically, it keeps falling apart once Soul Voice wears. Gotta either rotate the bards faster, or rotate in extra bards to 2-hour once the first set wears.

All logistics, really. Single-digit-minute kills are still way better than what we're used to.

[chiyio]

Sushi is definitely the winner here.

The last kirin run we did, I believe the songs where what nynja mentioned, min min march march mad mad, though I'm not positive.

Anyway, I went mnk/war, first kirin I used sushi, and almost, but not quite all of my accuracy gear. I've got full merits on mnk, faith torque, ect. Basically everything. first kirin, under 65% accuracy.

Over the next few I tried swapping out every possible slot I could for accuracy, and I think I was only able to top out at just over 70%, definitely less then 75%

I'm not seeing a way to make meat viable for kirin. I know everybody here rags on sushi, mostly because they don't have the gear to make it work, but unless you like missing 50% of the time suck it up.

Now I'll wait for some idiot to come tell me he's always getting 90%+ on kirin with meat.

[Dalek]

Sidetracking a little, but would troubadour songs near the end of soul voice give you extra duration for the super-buffed min/mad/marches? You could probably squeeze a bit extra out of soul voice if that worked...

Take what I say with a grain of salt though, don't even have bard unlocked:D