Elemental Obis

[Miltani]

Any idea what jp version says, they are usually more accurate

I'll just use thunder and burst2 as example.

Group 1: 能力値1で雷属性魔法攻撃力を+2します
mab +2 per merit

Group2: 能力値1でバーストIIのマジックバーストダメージボーナスを+3、魔法命中率を+5します。
mb dmg +3 and m.acc +5 per merit

[Suiram]

Nerull you managed to confuse me even more than i had been before... i always thought MAB was a % of damage. like MAB+15 was 15% to your damage. but now your saying its not. everything ive grown to know and love about BLM is being thrown into shambles. what gear actually states +? potency on it. i need a light to shine me in the right direction.

Having, say, MAB of 40 is 40% more damage than say, a DRK would have with no MAB casting the same spell with the same gear and INT. But if you're wearing something with MAB+10, then that's added to your job trait (32 at Lv75) + merits + any gear you already have, so if you already have like 50 MAB, then adding 10 MAB is 1.6/1.5 = 6.7% damage increase.

The mistake you made earlier (well, the principle one among many), was to confuse a generic damage increase (what some people call "potency") with the specific damage increase from MAB. Basically all MAB is additional potency, but not all potency is from MAB. Additional non-MAB 'potency' bonuses come from the stuff you probably already know about, like elemental staves, day/weather, MBing.

[Delekii]

Nerull you managed to confuse me even more than i had been before... i always thought MAB was a % of damage. like MAB+15 was 15% to your damage. but now your saying its not. everything ive grown to know and love about BLM is being thrown into shambles. what gear actually states +? potency on it. i need a light to shine me in the right direction.

Magic Attack Bonus - MAB
Spell Damage Constant - SDC
Elemental Staff Bonus - ESB
Day/Weather Bonus - DWB
Caster INT - cINT
Target INT - tINT
Tier INT Multiplier - TIM

Damage = [(cINT - tINT) x TIM + SDC] x (1+(MAB/100)) x ESB x DWB

Using some falsified numbers, lets say:
SDC=710,TIM=2.0 (AM2)
ESB=1.15
DWB=1.35
cINT-tINT=30
MAB=50

D=(30x2+710)x1.5x1.15x1.35=1793 damage.

If adding another 5MAB was to give a straight 5% damage bonus, we would multiply 1793x1.05=1882

But we dont, we add it to the already exsisting MAB multiplier and recalculate:

D=(30x2+710)x1.55x1.15x1.35=1852 damage.

[Suiram]

Well what Delekii posted isn't exactly correct either, but close enough.

(It'd actually be 1791 and 1850, respectively, but the details of why aren't really pertinent.)

[Nerull]

Your overall value of MAB is indeed a multiplier. However, the difference I am trying to make is that each piece of MAB gear does not multiply your damage individually, but rather is added up linearly to calculate your final MAB multiplier.

If I'm a 75 BLM, with maxed potency merits, wearing a total of MAB+31 in gear, my MAB multiplier would be 1.0+0.32(job trait)+0.10(merits)+0.31(gear) = 1.73, or a 73% increase in damage.

If I then equip another item with MAB+5, my MAB mutliplier increases from 1.73 to 1.78. It has not multiplied damage by +5%! As a matter of fact, 1.78/1.73 = about 1.03. So in this specific case, adding that one MAB+5 item increased damage by about 3%.

On the flip side, if I then equipped Sorcerer's Gloves (for a MB, obviously), that would indeed multiply the overall damage by +5%. It would look like dmg = (other stuff)(1.78)(1.05). This, incidentally, is why Sorcerer's Gloves > Zenith Mitts +1 for MB.

understand what I mean now?

[Suiram]

Nerull, I don't understand why you link the wiki article here and say it's a "pretty good" reference, and then update it to replace verified, correct information with unverified, incorrect information. Do you want it to be a "pretty bad" reference?

[Xfaustx]

i gues what you said makes sense Nerull, slightly confusing and not as straight-forward as i thought MAB originally was. has your formulas and methods been tested out to prove this 100% correct though? im a lil more cleared up about this though, thank you.

[Zalius]

i gues what you said makes sense Nerull, slightly confusing and not as straight-forward as i thought MAB originally was. has your formulas and methods been tested out to prove this 100% correct though? im a lil more cleared up about this though, thank you.

wtf i explained all of this to you like 30 times

[Nerull]

Nerull, I don't understand why you link the wiki article here and say it's a "pretty good" reference, and then update it to replace verified, correct information with unverified, incorrect information. Do you want it to be a "pretty bad" reference?

umm... yes when reading over the wiki article I noticed one thing glaringly incorrect, and I tried to fix it. The double weather bonus is .20, not .25. which is why the max bonus is 0.2+0.1+0.5=0.35, like the article says. I assumed it was just a typo, so I tried correcting it. Who the hell changed it back?

[Suiram]

Nerull, I don't understand why you link the wiki article here and say it's a "pretty good" reference, and then update it to replace verified, correct information with unverified, incorrect information. Do you want it to be a "pretty bad" reference?

umm... yes when reading over the wiki article I noticed one thing glaringly incorrect, and I tried to fix it. The double weather bonus is .20, not .25. which is why the max bonus is 0.2+0.1+0.5=0.35, like the article says. I assumed it was just a typo, so I tried correcting it. Who the hell changed it back?

The double weather bonus is .25, but for whatever reason the max bonus is capped at .35 (when it should be .4 with triple conditions + AF2), which is what the article says, but I see your misunderstanding now.

[Nerull]

Nerull, I don't understand why you link the wiki article here and say it's a "pretty good" reference, and then update it to replace verified, correct information with unverified, incorrect information. Do you want it to be a "pretty bad" reference?

umm... yes when reading over the wiki article I noticed one thing glaringly incorrect, and I tried to fix it. The double weather bonus is .20, not .25. which is why the max bonus is 0.2+0.1+0.5=0.35, like the article says. I assumed it was just a typo, so I tried correcting it. Who the hell changed it back?

The double weather bonus is .25, but for whatever reason the max bonus is capped at .35 (when it should be .4 with triple conditions + AF2), which is what the article says, but I see your misunderstanding now.

hmm... that is very odd, if it is indeed true, going against what I had always assumed, though admittedly never bother to test. I'll have to do some experiments of my own (no offense). I unpretentiously consider myself the resident BLM authority among my LS and friends, with an OCD for minute details like this, so my confusion here troubles me.
Regardless, it would be a good idea to at least make a note of this oddity in the description there. It really didn't make sense when I read it earlier; like I said I thought it was either a typo or someone just goofed their math... both of which are not all that uncommon things to find around the ffxiclopedia. My appologies.

[Suiram]

No problem; just there have been situations in the past where people who are, let's say, "less astute" than you seem to be, who remove things on that page which have been tested and verified and edit them in accordance with their own misconceptions, so that's why I probably overreacted in this case. Anyhow, I changed the the line about the cap so that it's hopefully more clear, and I also posted the data from my own tests regarding this in the discussion section of the page.

[Xfaustx]

i gues what you said makes sense Nerull, slightly confusing and not as straight-forward as i thought MAB originally was. has your formulas and methods been tested out to prove this 100% correct though? im a lil more cleared up about this though, thank you.

wtf i explained all of this to you like 30 times

zallers all you ever said was the staves give MAB. which apparently is false. lol thus my confusion atm.

*edit* damn you and WoW do the FFXI thing again. all the BLM i played with quit. i wanna make a new char. and i cannot bring myself to go to WoW as new and fresh as it might seem.