Odin Avatar Speculation Thread SPOILERS

[Rocl]

But on topic, I highly doubt either Alexander or Odin will be summonable. Alexander is a giant fking ruin that we explore in Nyzul Isle and Salvage, and it appears Odin and Luzaf are the same person >_> I think it would totally destroy the Dark Rider's standing in the game if every summoner could summon him all willy-nilly. IF THEY MAKE ODIN SUMMONABLE I QUIT.

At the very least, Diabolos was actually your ally, whereas the Dark Rider is very debatable at this point. (I've never done Fenrir so I don't know about him lolz)

[Isildur]

It's hilarious to me how many SMNs rather have something fluffly like a new big guy to follow them around.

I don't understand why a SMN wouldn't want SE to do something more impacting, like making it so that they don't only use 4 avatars out of 8 and 5 BPs out of 40. (Numbers are pretty much made up, but you get the point).

Why do you want another avatar? When is the last time you used Ifrit or Shiva? Rolling Thunder? Crimson Howl? Ultimate Terror?

How many spells does BLM have access to? BLU? BRD? How many of them do they actually use? Especially BRD, when's the last time you saw a BRD sing warding round or shining fantasia?

cant really compare BRD to this since they can sing whatever the fuck they want most of the time, then do Minuet when the melees get all frusterated from the CHR etudes and Goblin Gavoittes you keep casting, all the while your sub is WAR14

Anyways i think BPs, like WSs and Magic, are useful in increasing level....how many times do you use Red Lotus Blade when you're at a lower level? Alot. How many times does a SMN use Crimson Howl during a normal setup exp party at a lower level? I dunno personally, but i've had quite a few SMNs use Crimson Howl and Hastega a shitload from what i remember. If you think about it...all these "old" WSs and BPs are used at a lower level, they're there for use on "the trip to 75" and shit.

[LinktheDeme]

[quote="BRP"]
To me, it's like Dragoons asking for double-sided spear weapons with double-sided spear weapon skills. (Don't look too much into this, it isn't a flawless analogy). Dare I say, it's nearly ZAMish.
[quote]

Fuck that shit I want sword chuks.

Also Luzaf summoned dark rider so mebeeeeeeeeee. Not alexander for sure though hes too massive and its a machine not avatar 2148901284901849012 people cant be running around with the same machine that is supposed to be unique and capable of genociding races.

[Septimus]

I'm not going to be happy until I get a rat-flail as a weapon type.

And I think that SMN should get Alexander and Odin as avatars because every job deserves more shinies.

[Silmarwen]

But on topic, I highly doubt either Alexander or Odin will be summonable. Alexander is a giant fking ruin that we explore in Nyzul Isle and Salvage, and it appears Odin and Luzaf are the same person >_> I think it would totally destroy the Dark Rider's standing in the game if every summoner could summon him all willy-nilly. IF THEY MAKE ODIN SUMMONABLE I QUIT.

At the very least, Diabolos was actually your ally, whereas the Dark Rider is very debatable at this point. (I've never done Fenrir so I don't know about him lolz)

/ja "Dark Rider" imo for COR!




jk >.<;

[Jeryhn]

Most of the reason people are butthurt about summoners getting more avatars is that SE has been getting better at implementing them lately.

Case in point: The addition of Diabolos more or less pushed Chiblasting Monks completely out of endgame thanks to the fact that Nether Blast is unresistable magic damage.

[Sagacious Sundi]

When you summon an avatar, you are summoning a portion of their power, it doesn't matter whether they're too big, too small, asleep, half-dead, or something. Since Phoenix is divided, it is safe to assume we can get her in the Far East without too much conflict with the whole Selh'teus thing, assuming we get her at all. Question: I'm guessing Luzaf being the Dark Rider is similar to the whole Phoenix/Selh'teus thing?

Anyway, they should give us Alexander this expansion, Phoenix in the Far Eastern expansion, Bahamut in the Far South or West (yes, even though they gave us that retarded excuse) and Odin in the Far North, assuming they stick to the whole "1 avatar per expansion" people are assuming. And yes, avatars are somewhat more comparable to weapon types, and they should really try to make the less useful avatars more useful.

EDIT: On a side-note, SE shouldn't let summoners summon elementals in certain weather based on the fact that PC necromancers couldn't summon during the day (if that whole necro became PUP because of day/night issues is true).

[Intense]

IF THEY MAKE ODIN SUMMONABLE I QUIT.

Can I hold you to it? ;3

[The Blackrose]

I'm not going to be happy until I get a rat-flail as a weapon type.

Only if we can get a quest for the Rat Morning Star.

It is to be expected. Using the same, very powerful WS for 20 levels can be quite tiring. New things that can rival what we already have keep things fresh. That being said, another WS on all weapons would be nice, since they've already stated they will not add any new weapon types. But it'd be quite difficult to fit them in.

Tachi: Enpi for 61 levels... My god, never again.

[layoneil]

I get the gut feeling if SE asked all the SMNs of the world: "What do you want - Odin or all previous avatar's BPs get changed into something useful?" Majority would pick Odin. And that's what I am talking about.

all previous BPs being useful is impossible. i'd like each avatar to have 1 useful rage and 1 useful ward in different situations at Lv 75. anymore than that and they'd be seriously overpowered or just unnecessary.

Diabolos fit that pretty well (Nether Blast, Dream Shroud/Noctoshield) when they added it.

[LD]

I get the gut feeling if SE asked all the SMNs of the world: "What do you want - Odin or all previous avatar's BPs get changed into something useful?" Majority would pick Odin. And that's what I am talking about.

all previous BPs being useful is impossible. i'd like each avatar to have 1 useful rage and 1 useful ward in different situations at Lv 75. anymore than that and they'd be seriously overpowered or just unnecessary.

Diabolos fit that pretty well (Nether Blast, Dream Shroud/Noctoshield) when they added it.

I think his point is, do we even have that?
Do Ifrit, Ramuh, or Shiva have Rages or Wards as useful as the other 6 avatars? (Incidentally, that's kinda ironic. :/)

[Khamsin]

I get the gut feeling if SE asked all the SMNs of the world: "What do you want - Odin or all previous avatar's BPs get changed into something useful?" Majority would pick Odin. And that's what I am talking about.

all previous BPs being useful is impossible. i'd like each avatar to have 1 useful rage and 1 useful ward in different situations at Lv 75. anymore than that and they'd be seriously overpowered or just unnecessary.

Diabolos fit that pretty well (Nether Blast, Dream Shroud/Noctoshield) when they added it.

I think his point is, do we even have that?
Do Ifrit, Ramuh, or Shiva have Rages or Wards as useful as the other 6 avatars? (Incidentally, that's kinda ironic. :/)

Actually, all the avatars have situationally useful Rages.

Ramuh's Chaotic Strikes does wonders to pots and bones, and seems to spike higher damage than Titan on occasion, otherwise doing damage roughly on par with him (or under if your accuracy sucks). Without merits or +skill, I'd use Titan, and with accuracy merits and +skill, I'd use Ramuh. It's sort of a Predator Claws vs Spinning Dive thing.

Shiva's Double Slap is the best level capped BP (50-60) you will use, and there's no shortage of level capped areas, BCs and ENMs.

Ifrit's Double Punch is the best 30-40 capped BP, and like Double Slap, has some situational use. Flaming Crush is THE best BP you will have in certain situations, as well. It rapes treants (seriously, try it, its funny), and seems to do well on certain other mobs, as well (moreso than predator claws). For example, all the hpemde epeen shots are Flaming Crush it seems, rather than Predator Claws.

As for Wards, some are less useful than others and could use improvement.

Ramuh's Rolling Thunder can lighten up any boring event with amusing pew-pew-pew sounds.

Shiva's sleepga seems to last longer than Nightmare, though I'm not sure about its resist rate in comparison. You don't use sleepga/nightmare often, but if you need to (since we're talking situationally useful BPs afterall), Shiva and Diabolos are the only ones capable of it.

Ifrit's Crimson Howl used to suck pre-skill update and pre-rage/ward split. It's still fairly underused, but its usefulness has increased a lot. With the rage/ward split, you can use it and not sacrifice a rage timer to do it. With the skill update, it actually lasts longer than 10 seconds to the point of being usable. It's fairly potent too, stronger than Warcry and only outmatched by an 11 Chaos Roll (without DRK) or a 9 Chaos Roll (with DRK). However, that is based off the info on wiki which says Warcry is 5% and Crimson Howl is 15% and that an a lucky Chaos Roll is 12% with 11 being 18%.

[Appie]

I think it would totally destroy the Dark Rider's standing in the game if every summoner could summon him all willy-nilly. IF THEY MAKE ODIN SUMMONABLE I QUIT.

At the very least, Diabolos was actually your ally, whereas the Dark Rider is very debatable at this point. (I've never done Fenrir so I don't know about him lolz)

Diabolos sure didn't look like an ally in CoP 3.5. So maybe Odin/Dark Rider turns around too, at least it wouldn't surprise me considering where the ToAU atory is at now. Spoilers? (considering the painting of the "Age of Judgement", I wouldn't be surprised to see the Empire get a hold of the controls for Alexander and you teaming up with Mister Dark Rider for a grand final battle against Alexander, though Alexander would have a harder time fitting on the screen than Promathia, maybe Odin will team up with you against w/e you'll be fighting to stop Alexander /rambles)

And having the creator of Dynamis in a SMN's arsenal (especially like a day after that patch with 100 SMN's in Rolanberry showing it), always seemed odd to me. Odin has more room to be an avatar for a SMN than Diabolos did imo.

As for Fenrir (zomg spoilerz?!), protector of Windurst/Full Moon Fountain was his job iirc? Been a while since I did Windy Missions, but you basically restored him at the end since he was missing for a long time due to a drained Full Moon Fountain iirc. And some time later SMN's got to run around for whispers to call him for a battle.

[Fryte]

Since the SMN magic skill patch, Rush is sorta decent on HNM. Though, I have capped +SMN skill and items to enhance it. Doing AF and other multi-mob spawns is great fun with Shiva now that the timers are separated. Sleepga when they spawn and Rush one to the face.

Leviathan died to me once I capped accuracy merits, though Spring Water still has some use, but rarely am I ever put into a position where I'd need to use it.

Ramuh pwns Bones/Pots SO hard. He averages like 2k+ on em.

Besides Earthen Ward, I've only used Titan on Jailer of Faith and that was a SMN burn.

I've probably used Diabolos the least actually. Even for Tiamat, I usually try to get 3 Garuda BPs on the ground and just sleep/prepare to BP him the second he lands.

Ifrit I use every week on Fire in the Sky, so...I don't know if that counts as an actual use.

Carbuncle/Fenrir obviously get used on a daily basis as SMN.

Before buffing into an uncapped BC solo, I usually use Light Spirit to get a better Prot4/Shell4 too. The other spirits suck balls though.

If a new avatar were added, what abilities would the community like him to have without it being completely gamebreaking? I always cross my fingers for Refreshga, but I don't think it's ever going to happen. I know in FF6 Odin had the +speed attribute. Besides 1shotting everything on screen, what else did Odin do in past FF's?

[governor]

Wasn't the big thing for the windy story line that their great hero died summoning Fenrir...

I demand dead summoners.

But honestly, in most FF's I remember, Alexander was all about the holy and Odin was all about killing stuff. He's probably not evil, just misunderstood and when you save the world from disaster, he'll say thanks for saving the world from said disaster and become summonable.

For Alexander, I'm sure SMN's want a nice light element avatar instead of the blue rat.

Btw, does anyone remember the magicite Odin in FF6 turned into?

[The Blackrose]

Wasn't the big thing for the windy story line that their great hero died summoning Fenrir...

I demand dead summoners.

Supposedly Fenrir shouted something along the lines of "YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG" before telling Karuha-Baruha to get in his belly. Forcefully.

But honestly, in most FF's I remember, Alexander was all about the holy and Odin was all about killing stuff. He's probably not evil, just misunderstood and when you save the world from disaster, he'll say thanks for saving the world from said disaster and become summonable.

For Alexander, I'm sure SMN's want a nice light element avatar instead of the blue rat.

Btw, does anyone remember the magicite Odin in FF6 turned into?

Odin was turned into Raiden if you managed to get further underground.

Also, Odin's circumstances/sides depend on the game. For example, he was the King of Baron before Golbez came along in FFIV. only fighting the party per Summon protocol. Also, FFVI's Odin was protecting a castle from repeated attacks before he was turned to stone. Both of these fall outside the misunderstood category.

[Appie]

Wasn't the big thing for the windy story line that their great hero died summoning Fenrir...

Oh yea forgot that part since he wanted to use Fenrir to win the war and iirc summong magic became forbidden magic after he died.

[poupette]

Odin will never be an avatar simply because he had way too many polygone , plain and simple. Having 10 Odin out at the same time would be equal to have few hundred peoples and it would lag like crazy.

AS Alexander, i think its possible, maybe theyll make 4-5 Fight across the continent to get him.

[governor]

Odin will never be an avatar simply because he had way too many polygone , plain and simple. Having 10 Odin out at the same time would be equal to have few hundred peoples and it would lag like crazy.

hi2u diabolos

[BRP]

Since the title has spoilers, I guess I don't have to hold back.

Karaha summoned Fenrir in a different method than Summoner's normally do. He practically trapped and forced Fenrir into his service. This meant Fenrir was at his full fighting capabilities (which seem to be on scale of Demi-God). This killed Fenrir and the stress was too much for the Summoner himself, so it killed him too. Fenrir is revived in the Windurst Storyline(but remains dead in CoP) and he allows you to sign a pact with him to summon him normally.

I think Alexander is kind of out of the question... because, it appears that Alexander is just about epic in size. I mean like, probably as tall as Jeuno and three times as wide. He is just of stunning size.

Let's say at the end of ToAU, we are confronted with a showdown between Razdahd and Luzaf, who has now almost completely become the Rider. Both sides are bad to a point. We then learn that the Rider's job is to prevent the apocalypse or something similar, which occurs every time Alexander wakes up. Luzaf is able to maintain some type of control over his power and you team up with him to defeat Razdahd. After it is all said and done, Luzaf becomes Odin and starts riding around for all eternity or whatever. Later, as thanks, he allows us to summon him. If we got to summon Odin, this will be how its done.