Need Help: Recruiting Tips

[Deuce]

Like the title states I need help some tips for recruiting members for an edngame. I plan on making one sometime and could use some ideas on how to get good, reliable, and dedicated members. Yeah those types of players are hard to find now, but I've got patience.

Anyways, all linkshells need members and well they somehow have to get those members. Shouting for members is totally out of the question. Also, sending random tells to people is a little bit of a stretch and not very ideal. It's pretty much the same thing as shouting. So would linkshell leaders or former leaders be willing to give me tips for recruiting?

[Kaylia]

1) Make an application format (name/job/craft/mission/why applying/why leaving your old shell/play time). If people can't follow it, it say a lot about their ability to follow order in game.

2) Check grammar (if they are english). Avoid Aol speak, chance is they are dumb

3) Mission: Make sure they have sea and sky completed, people who don't have those are most likely slacker and will have low attendance. You can make an exeption for player who just reached 75 I guess

4) Make sure they weren't loot whore in previous shell, and make sure they understand the lotting rule before joining.



If you are very early in the process of recruiting people, the only real way is to have friend invite friend. It sucks, but you can't avoid that.

[aurik]

make small events to get things done, whatever your LS can handle...things like pop items, sell-split dynamis, etc. have friends invite people they think are good additions to the LS, pick and choose the ones who seem to have it together.

[Deuce]

1) Make an application format (name/job/craft/mission/why applying/why leaving your old shell/play time). If people can't follow it, it say a lot about their ability to follow order in game.

2) Check grammar (if they are english). Avoid Aol speak, chance is they are dumb

3) Mission: Make sure they have sea and sky completed, people who don't have those are most likely slacker and will have low attendance. You can make an exeption for player who just reached 75 I guess

4) Make sure they weren't loot whore in previous shell, and make sure they understand the lotting rule before joining.



If you are very early in the process of recruiting people, the only real way is to have friend invite friend. It sucks, but you can't avoid that.

Yeah I sort of thinking of the application tactic and it sounds pretty good. Thanks for laying out some of the specifics and reasons to possibly reject people.

And friend inviting friend I don't have much objection to. However, if said friend doesn't seem reliable I'd have to say no.

Edit: Just saw your post aurik and that is something I haven't really ever thought of.

Also, this just sort of came to me. Should I try to keep the linkshell in one timezone or two timezones? For example, PST and CST or CST and EST. I'm not really sure if spreading across three timezones would work too well.

[Amadeo]

Timezone depends a lot on individual availability. You may find someone in Europe would apply, because event times suit their work schedule. People that work can get some messed up shifts, sometimes it works to your advantage.

Edit

On that note though, its a good idea to establish when you'll be doing events. People that are applying should only do so after understanding the event times, and confirming that those times are suitable for them.

[Atlasion]

I think when my LS started it was just a combination of 3 EU based social LSs. Then poeple would ask their friends to join and so on.

A few members also had a link to our forums in their bazaar message.

[Deuce]

Timezone depends a lot on individual availability. You may find someone in Europe would apply, because event times suit their work schedule. People that work can get some messed up shifts, sometimes it works to your advantage.

Edit

On that note though, its a good idea to establish when you'll be doing events. People that are applying should only do so after understanding the event times, and confirming that those times are suitable for them.

What you said reminds me of a person in my old Dynamis LS. They worked weird shifts so they'd come to Dynamis tired and fall asleep. This eventually got them kicked after the first time it happened. I guess I'll just have to make sure people can make it to events regularly.

I think when my LS started it was just a combination of 3 EU based social LSs. Then poeple would ask their friends to join and so on.

A few members also had a link to our forums in their bazaar message.

I guess combining LSs would be a quicker solution, but it seems like that may be a disastrous conflict waiting to happen. As for making a forum it appears I'll have to make one for sure.

Other concerns I have are size and also keeping the first few members interested. As for LS size I know there's no real limit to how big a linkshell can be, but what is considered manageable? About 25-35 members or so? Keep in mind I'd like to Dynamis.

My other concern was how to keep members interested when the LS isn't too big or "slow". I feel that'd be a major issue to address and see if anyone would like to suggest ideas.

Thanks again for any suggestions or ideas.

[Amadeo]

Thats why I added the edit.

[Daahan]

My First Treatise was removed from stickies, so here are the pertaining sections.

On the Expansion of Linkshells

It is very important for a Leader to maintain the number of members in a linkshell. If a linkshell finds itself short on members for events, then the linkshell should be open for recruitment. A Leader, however, must be careful not to recruit an unnecessary amount of members.

Recruitment of members in to a linkshell should be carefully thought out and carried through and several steps should be taken.

First, the Leader must establish some sort of application process. It is very helpful for a linkshell to have forums for this reason. If a person wants to apply to a linkshell, then that person should fill out an application and it should be posted on the linkshell’s forums. Next, all the linkshell members should give their input on or list experiences that they have had with the applicant. This information is absolutely important because it necessary for the Leader to make the decision on whether or not to allow the person in to the linkshell. As far as comments posted about the applicant go, the comments about the player’s skill should be weighted the heaviest; however, comments about the applicant’s attitude and personality are still very important and should definitely be taken in to account.

If there is a unanimous vote of confidence for the skill and personality of the applicant, then the Leader should consider enlisting the applicant as a trial recruit (I will discuss this further in the next section).

If the comments on the applicant are mixed, meaning they contain both positive and negative comments, then it is the decision of the Leader on whether or not to trial the applicant.

Lastly, if there is an overwhelming amount of negative comments about the applicant’s skill and personality, then Leader should immediately reject the person’s application.

If your linkshell is successful and is known to be famous, then you will have no trouble finding applicants to your linkshell, because the applicants will come to you. However, if the linkshell is new and has just begun to progress, then the Leader must make an extra effort to find good and skilled members for their linkshell. The Leader, sackholders, and regular members can all take part of the search for new applicants, but each new applicant found must go through the application process, regardless of what jobs they have or their standing with the rest of the linkshell members.

In the next section I will discuss how a person should be inducted in to the linkshell, if inducted at all.

On The Process of Membership in to a Linkshell

When an application is posted on the forums and the leader has decided to consider recruiting the applicant in to the linkshell, then a trial process should begin.

During a trial, the applicant is not given a pearl to the linkshell. Either the Leader or a sackholder should contact the applicant throughout the course of the trial period and inform him/her about events. If the applicant is free, he should show up to these events and demonstrate his skill (I do not mention personality here for a reason and I will discuss it shortly). Trial periods should be as long necessary and the linkshell should not worry about giving the applicant a pearl too late. Every single job of the applicant should be trialed several times and the applicant’s skill should be examined closely and criticized as much as possible. Also, the applicant should be given the toughest role possible in whatever event the linkshell is doing because that is the best way to test a person’s skill; to see how they perform under difficult situations and how they handle pressure. When the linkshell feels that they have obtained enough information about the applicant through the trial period, they should discuss it further (preferably on their forums). It is up to the Leader, through input given by the rest of the linkshell members, to decide on whether or not to give the applicant a pearl to the linkshell.

The reason I did not mention personality during the trial period is because trial applicants tend to be deceptive when it comes to displaying personality during a trial period. Applicants will be extremely courteous, respectful, and even joyful during a trial period to make themselves look good to the linkshell. Thus, during a trial period, the personality of an applicant should be weighted lightly in the recruitment process, because applicants will tend to put on a face that is not really theirs, and now I will discuss how to deal with this issue, among other things.

When an applicant successfully passes the trial period and receives a pearl to the linkshell, it does not mean that that person has become a full fledged and privileged person in the linkshell. There needs to be a probationary period for the new member. Once again, it up to the Leader how long the probationary period should be; however, it should not be very short. If you were to ask me, I would say no less than 1-2 months. During the probationary period, item distribution to the probationary member should be extremely limited, if existent at all. The participation and seniority of existing members (if they have strong participation) always holds more weight than that of probationary members. Probationary periods are also useful in determining the true nature of a recruit’s personality, because once they have received their pearl, they will show their true face, if their face during the trial period happened to be a deception.

After the probationary period is over, the recruit will have gained tenure in the linkshell. When this occurs, the Leader should distribute items to the member based on his participation and seniority like he does with the other members.

On Idiocy: The Destroyer of Linkshells

One of the most destructive things a linkshell can suffer from is idiocy amongst its members. Idiocy will severely hinder the progress and success of a linkshell and will often cause unhealthy divisions. I will try to define what idiocy in a linkshell is to the best of my ability. A true linkshell idiot is one that cannot play any of his/her jobs properly if their lives depended on it. An idiot is the BRD that does not know how to pull in a merit party, the RDM who can’t keep refresh up and doesn’t have all his/her subs leveled, the NIN that takes more hits than a Paladin, the WHM that spams Cure IV endlessly, the BLM that can’t stun ancient magic or –ga 3, the PLD who puts up shadows while the wyrm is in the air, the SMN that BP’s from behind a wyrm, the THF that trick attacks the wrong people, or the person who always DoT’s the mob that needs to be slept. People like the aforementioned are the destroyers of linkshells and have no place in linkshells if the linkshell wants to be productive and successful. It is important to understand that it only counts as idiocy if acts such as these are done in succession. People make mistakes; however, mistakes should be corrected as soon as possible, and now I will discuss on what to do if idiocy is found amongst members.

The Leader of a linkshell should remove idiots from the linkshell. If it has been shown that if the member is incapable of remedying his/her idiocy, then the Leader must kick that person from the linkshell. Being merciful and showing compassion to those who are idiots will not aid in the progression of the linkshell; rather, it will only destroy it.

I can cite a large number of examples from Bahamut where idiocy has destroyed linkshells from their very foundations. If a Leader wants his/her linkshell to survive, endure, and be successful, then he/she should not hesitate at all to remove idiots from their linkshell.

[Atlasion]

When my LS started it was most peoples first HNMLS, so I don't think there was much conflict between members. It was a very long time ago though. A lot of people started using it as a social too (which kind of killed off one or two of the original social LSs xD).


Don't really need huge numbers for Dynamis. We've had successful runs with under 25 people. Obviously need more people for Dynamis Lord, but its not a good idea to flood LS with members for one event. ;p


Edit: I think Dahaan just covered just about everything there xD

[Deuce]

My First Treatise was removed from stickies, so here are the pertaining sections.

Thanks for reposting that portion Daahan. I'll finish re-reading it later.

[Amadeo]

Very true Daahan, very very true.

I just finished up with the HNMLS I built because the sheer amount of idiocy was horrific. A few idiots can be a nightmare, especially if you also have sackholders that are too scared to hurt anyone's feelings by kicking them.

Good times.

[Lordwafik]

Best idea is to have your recruiters either a) in a relationship, or b) can resist the power of e-vagina. I've seen so many items fly to Y chromosome women due to the fact they're e-whoring to people in power.

[Melchiah]

Best idea is to have your recruiters either a) in a relationship, or b) can resist the power of e-vagina. I've seen so many items fly to Y chromosome women due to the fact they're e-whoring to people in power.

Not any different from the physical world Wafik, as bad as it sucks. There is much truth to Wafik's post here, sackholder/pearlholder relationships, especially when its Msackholder/Fpearlholder are abused 100% of the time. You cannot afford this kind of discord, it really pisses the other members off.

[Khalil]

Very true Daahan, very very true.

I just finished up with the HNMLS I built because the sheer amount of idiocy was horrific. A few idiots can be a nightmare, especially if you also have sackholders that are too scared to hurt anyone's feelings by kicking them.

Good times.

I honestly fucking hate leaders who refuse to take action on members who don't raid or do anything relevant to the end-game scene. If you're a leader and you see a member is not participating to an event, ask him why? If he lacks the proper response, give him a few warnings, maybe 2-3 at most. After said warnings, don't hesitate.

Back to the OP; I'd prolly do what Aurik suggested. Make relatively easy raids and begin the process of elimination.

[Deuce]

Best idea is to have your recruiters either a) in a relationship, or b) can resist the power of e-vagina. I've seen so many items fly to Y chromosome women due to the fact they're e-whoring to people in power.

I definitely would not want this. Any sugestions for how to avoid these situations? A strict rule of no e-relationships inside shell perhaps?

[Amadeo]

Yeah Khalil, the shell I made and then left is now stuck with people who "Forget about Dynamis" while camping random shitty NM's, lol

[Sylphet]

Best idea is to have your recruiters either a) in a relationship, or b) can resist the power of e-vagina. I've seen so many items fly to Y chromosome women due to the fact they're e-whoring to people in power.

Perhaps this is why I'm in charge of recruiting

I'm in the fortunate position that I don't actually have to go out and recruit. I've got a very long list of people who want to get in to the shell but ultimately we let very few people in. The shell is the oldest HNMLS on the server and it's never broken or reformed. Here's my $0.02:

We only have 2 absolute requirements: Job at 75 (duh) and full sky and sea access (do not want to do that shit again for anyone).

We don't have a form to fill out. I prefer to speak to all potential applicants in game. It is time consuming but it gives me a better sense of their personality than reading a form.

Check people out! Nobody gets to 75 without interacting with other players. What is their reputation like? Get the opinion of a few people just to make sure you're being fair.

It's our firm belief that you are far better off with a smaller group of skilled, intelligent players than a horde of retards and assholes. This can mean that you'll go for long times without recruiting more people but in the end it really pays off.

Our application process is quite long in comparison to other shells. Here's an outline of how it goes:

1: Talk to me, I decide if the player is worth mentioning to ls leader.
2: If both myself and the shell leader approve of the player, they are proposed to the ls.
3: LS members comment on the player. This is the most important part of the application process.
If even one current member of the linkshell opposes the applicant they can not get in.
We never used to have this strict of a requirement but every time we let someone in when there was an objection we have regretted it and therefore instated this strict rule.
4: The applicant is then allowed to go to events with us where we assess their performance. This process is variable and takes an average of 1-2 months.
5: Before pearling the applicant is discussed among current ls members to make sure everyone is fine with them getting pearled.

It's really not an easy job but it's critical to do it properly if you want your shell to be successful. gl!

[Septimus]

Not any different from the physical world Wafik, as bad as it sucks.

At least in the real world you can check for an Adam's Apple. (Looking at you, Ann Coulter.)

[Celebrindor]

I really liked some of the responses here a TON- especially the comment about not putting too much importance on a recruit's personality during a trial phase....it really hits it 100% on the head. Of course, the opposite can be true as well...an asshat during the trial phase will be an asshat later.

I'm a bit more lax when it comes to new members in the sky/dynamis shells that I belong to, both of which I've been with for over 18 months now. Now, I'm not a sackholder in either because I simply cannot contribute that much time to a game due to wife and daughter and a full time job....but I would say that I'm one of those "old guard" members that every shell has- a little grizzled from experience, versed in tactics, and one who's opinion is taken into consideration, although below the level of sackholder/shellholder.

If someone is completely new to endgame, and they have a clean slate when it comes to drama/bitching, I'm pretty much open to what they have to offer for a good month.

Are they researching the battle strategies/maps/key points of an event on their own, or do they constantly need to be reminded? Examples:
-Is the new BLM bursting Thundaga III on Kirin, or did he know enough to only use Aero based? (even better, do they see that gravity resist and prepare a quake to help resists!)
-Is that WAR in dynamis autoattacking everything in his way, or does he have /assist macros already? Does he know what mobs we melee and what mobs we burn down?
-did I really just see a diaga from that RDM at the BLM house in Dyna-Windy?
-Did they bitch from taking a R1 versus a R3 in a critical moment?
-Are they trying to impose their own tactics/ideas from day one, or waiting to see the how/why we doing things like we do before commenting?
-are they knowledgeable from day frigging one about lotting procedures?

Basically, I expect a person who applies to a shell to understand what the shell does, its policies and its (public) strategies, and its lotting/attendance procedures all from the moment of application. If this information isn't in public forums on your shell's site, then that's an exception, but that's really the only one I can think of.

Now, let's say a person isn't too versed in a particular event but shows the desire to get better- the BLM first fires a Thundaga at Kirin and then is told wind only, and never does it again, goes out and gets that Auster's Staff and takes care of business- good in my book. They've shown they care enough to fix their issues.

That WAR gets yelled at for keeping auto-target on, apologizes in the LS, takes it off and does fine from then on- good by me, people forget stuff like that from time to time.

That RDM keeps using DoT every chance they get, even when told not to? Blindly melees in penitent's rope and full AF with a gold sword and ice shield while his party is dying? Sorry, off ya go. Dead weight, no thanks.

I'm not in the crazy good high-tier endgame shells- but I'm in very capable ones that have a solid trackrecord of sky and other things on ground (the basic stuff, hakutaku, amalethia, BQ, SoboroNM, Sim/Serk/Roc, NQ behemoth and adamanatoise are basically all my Sky LS will do outside of Tu'Lia), and my Dynamis shell has a DL kill to its credit along with 2/3 of CoP zone clears (we're once a week, can't commit too much to CoP with members still clamouring for City AF). We take what we do seriously, but we see a lot of first job to 75 newbies to endgame (myself included when I joined a year and a half ago). And I think the above is acceptable to ask of members. Know what the shell does, know its policies, know its basic strats, know its times. Listen, learn, and you'll be fine. Show you can't listen or be respectful, and byebye.