Re-Hashing the AV Theories [Now about cats]

[LLK]

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y10...alo/godcat.jpg

[Nagamaki]

People will say the weapons were fully tried and all, but unless you actually tried everything yourself, that doesn't mean much of anything. AV fights are pretty messy at best. There's plenty of rumors and false beliefs about all kinds of things in the game, and most are easy to prove wrong but still persist.

Weapons are the logical answer based on what AV says when he pops and based on plain logic. They are the only thing you are 100% guaranteed to have before managing to pop AV, since you could very well end up gathering a set of 4th-5th-6th before seeing any torques. The problem is what the hell you're supposed to actually do with them.

And that's why if someone, anyone actually saw an "absorbed by" message but didn't take a screenshot/photo of it by any means necessary, they deserve the Biggest Retard Ever prize. A few people have asked where in dat files one would find battle text, the lack of an answer so far seems to indicate nobody knows? I'm not very hopeful about that message actually existing, but knowing 100% would be great.

[Tajin]

http://www.montclair.edu/orgs/CC/Siberian%20Tiger.jpg


>____>




Oh yeah um AV... Eliminate all mobs in 3 consecutive LVL7 Besiegeds, while a lvl72 DRK with Octave/Kraken keeps popping Bubbly Bernie, and use Shumeyo salt and mismelts on AV/Wynavs

[Obev]

To be honest, I'm really just sticking to that theory because it'll mean that my bard meleeling with a hope staff will have some use.

[Sixtail]

People will say the weapons were fully tried and all, but unless you actually tried everything yourself, that doesn't mean much of anything. AV fights are pretty messy at best. There's plenty of rumors and false beliefs about all kinds of things in the game, and most are easy to prove wrong but still persist.

Weapons are the logical answer based on what AV says when he pops and based on plain logic. They are the only thing you are 100% guaranteed to have before managing to pop AV, since you could very well end up gathering a set of 4th-5th-6th before seeing any torques. The problem is what the hell you're supposed to actually do with them.

SE has put dozens on dozens of items in the game that have no real use, so trying to say that they must be the logical answer is just silly. And second, why does every LS who ever pops a AV need to pull out lol jailer weapons and wack at it? How many LS's reported jailer weapons don't work, 10? 15? Why would they be wrong, it's akin to saying "It's not fully proven jumping in hot lava will kill you, we need more proof."

[Dakana]

Well SE said about elemental SC on the corresponding day weakening AV right? We have also theorized that each of the weapons is linked to one of AV's Abilities several pages earlier. So what if closing a SC with with a jailer weapon with the ele of the corresponding day locks that ability?

[Nagamaki]

Well there's 3 theories to explain AV, it depends which you believe.

A: It is meant to be impossible

B: It is bugged and SE somehow hasn't noticed that it is impossible after a year and a half, despite clearly being aware of things like the wall or the full lock, and blocking those methods

C: There's something people missed somewhere

I think everyone is aware that SE employs a lot of retards, but they have proven that they aren't ALL retards. Options A or B both rule out the presence of a single thinking being within SE.

There's more to fully testing out something than engaging for 20s and hitting the mob a few times with one of the weapons, followed immediately by AoE horrible rape death. I like to test things myself, just because a lot of people believe something doesn't make it true.

Did people really try out absolutely everything you could do with the weapons, or just plain absolutely everything? I'm a little doubtful there.

[fallenleaf]

Well SE said about elemental SC on the corresponding day weakening AV right? We have also theorized that each of the weapons is linked to one of AV's Abilities several pages earlier. So what if closing a SC with with a jailer weapon with the ele of the corresponding day locks that ability?

I like that way of thinking. I mean sea gave us the gorgets, that are dependent on using a WS with the corresponding elements. Closing a SC with the element of the current day with a jailer weapon, with a MB of the currrent day sounds pretty hot to me.

And I won't believe SE thinks we should be able to survive insta-cast meteors for 5k+ damage. There simply must(or is supposed to be) a way to lock his ass up quick from using benediction for infinity hp, or manafont/chainspell and smiting everything within a distance of 50 from him.

[Stinky]

I personally am hesitant to believe that it is meant to be impossible. I say this because of the stats on the drops. Though some are very powerful, they also show some degree of balance consistent with other powerful items. Bellona's Ring, for instance, has RATT+8 and RACC+8 but also EVA-8 and DEF-8. Minerva's ring has magic damage taken -8% but is balanced by physical damage taken +8%.

I think the fact that they balanced positive stats on these items with negatives is some indication that they didn't intend for them to be unobtainable, since they did make some attempt to prevent the wearer from becoming game breakingly powerful (some of them are obviously very good and there are items in circulation already that have no negative stats and could be considered game breaking but you get my point). If the items were to be no more than a tease why not make them damage taken -8% for both physical and magical? Why even exert the effort and spend time coming up with the stats to put them in the game at all?

[Damane]

maybe there is some corresponding elemental order you have to do. Like at the endboss of Chrono cross. Maybe the torques and virtue stone drops indicate which elemental order you have to go for.

[Elien]

Sorry i dont really participate in the theorizing methods of killing AV discussions. I fought him a few times, and killed him when he was lockable. I think the Jailer Weapons idea has a lot of logic too it but one other idea, and im curious if anyone ever suggested/tried something like this but-

The Quasiliums in al-taieu. a lot of them seem to be talking about a very powerful force up there- AV? i cant remember all the messages anymore, but if you go up there and talk to them now (the more out of the way ones) youll see what i mean. Perhaps the quasilium messages have a hint? maybe the messages change when AV is popped? maybe talking to quasi's locks his abilities or 2 hours? who knows, needs to get figured out though so that ppl can start killing AV and not worrying so much about dragon's aery...

[Stinky]

Does it ever run out of MP? I remember a few years back when people were first learning how to fight Kirin we used to just let it beat the shit out of us for an hour untill it ran out of MP, might that work here? My LS has popped AV a few times but never engaged it so I don't have any first hand experience with it.

[Demetrius*]

so uh sorry if this has been mentioned, but what about killing wyverns with jailer weapons? It seems odd that SE would make 2 big flaws like a) making AV's abilities lockable and b) doing so by killing his wyverns. why in the world would doing something as random as killing wyverns lock his abilities as a bug? AV has 3 lockable abilities, 2 hours, magic, and TP moves. 3 wyverns. Its all too interconnected imo to be just a coincidence. i think they just changed the schematics around the wyverns death.

edit: can you imagine them bugging vrtra so that by killing his summons you lock his magic and TP moves? theres no way, it doesn't work like that without reason.

[megabyte]

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37...0cde609490.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37...9c8c2cbcd4.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37...2/drugcats.jpg

[Rocl]

The hell is a foyer

[Suiram]

so uh sorry if this has been mentioned, but what about killing wyverns with jailer weapons? It seems odd that SE would make 2 big flaws like a) making AV's abilities lockable and b) doing so by killing his wyverns. why in the world would doing something as random as killing wyverns lock his abilities as a bug? AV has 3 lockable abilities, 2 hours, magic, and TP moves. 3 wyverns. Its all too interconnected imo to be just a coincidence. i think they just changed the schematics around the wyverns death.

edit: can you imagine them bugging vrtra so that by killing his summons you lock his magic and TP moves? theres no way, it doesn't work like that without reason.

Normal AV (non-lockable) has certain 2Hs he can't use unless his wynavs are alive. My personal guess as to why he was lockable in the past was that he would attempt to use an unavailable 2H when his wynavs were dead and glitch. This also accounts for why he would lock right away for some groups and it would take several sets of wynavs for others. Now he doesn't even attempt to use those unless at least one wyvern is up. That being said, more cats plz.

[Nystul]

I know this would never happen but part of me thinks we should boycot AV. Go out, pop your JOL, and if AV pops, just walk away. Ignore it. Nothing to see here, no sir. Don't discuss it on forums, don't complain about it to SE in interviews.

Sundi: You...ummm...you have any more questions?
interviewer: Nope, thats it. Thanks.
Sundi: You sure...no questions about anything? How's sea going for the playerbase?
Interviewer: Oh just fine thanks.
Sundi: How's AV? Figure that out yet? HAH!
Interviewer: The what?
Sundi: Absolute virtue...you know the...boss of sea. Really hard mob?
Interviewer: Not familiar with it, sorry.
Sundi: Never...WHAT? Never heard of it?? It's like the last frontier! The unbeatable monster! Drops this sash thats, well...ok I guess, nothing really that special but...you've never heard of it?
Interviewer: Yea, sorry sundi...I just don't know.

Part of me still thinks that AV is a joke on the players. I just imagine the whole office gatehring around computers when someone pops it- all work stops. They take turns pressing the meteor button "OHH!! You took out 2 dragoons that time Sundi! ICHIBAN!!!" Thats why the GM's jailed people for stalling, all the people in the SE office was tired of waiting for the carnage to begin.


Fight back! Ignore the stupid thing! Let SE know that this shit is just lame as all fuck.

I can dream can't I?

[megabyte]

The hell is a foyer

Foyer
[foi-er, foi-ey; Fr. fwa-yey] Noun

1. the lobby of a theater, hotel, or apartment house.
2. a vestibule or entrance hall in a house or apartment.
3. a large entrance or reception room or area (see: brain)

[Demetrius*]

so uh sorry if this has been mentioned, but what about killing wyverns with jailer weapons? It seems odd that SE would make 2 big flaws like a) making AV's abilities lockable and b) doing so by killing his wyverns. why in the world would doing something as random as killing wyverns lock his abilities as a bug? AV has 3 lockable abilities, 2 hours, magic, and TP moves. 3 wyverns. Its all too interconnected imo to be just a coincidence. i think they just changed the schematics around the wyverns death.

edit: can you imagine them bugging vrtra so that by killing his summons you lock his magic and TP moves? theres no way, it doesn't work like that without reason.

Normal AV (non-lockable) has certain 2Hs he can't use unless his wynavs are alive. My personal guess as to why he was lockable in the past was that he would attempt to use an unavailable 2H when his wynavs were dead and glitch. This also accounts for why he would lock right away for some groups and it would take several sets of wynavs for others. Now he doesn't even attempt to use those unless at least one wyvern is up. That being said, more cats plz.

are you saying his inability to use a specific 2hr caused a snowball effect and locked up his magic and TP as well? You could lock up his magic and TP while he was still using 2hrs couldn't you?

[megabyte]

o_O
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Megabyte2/o_O.jpg

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37...ouseHunter.jpg

And to mix things up a bit:
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37...mailjokes2.jpg