PLD vs WAR vs Stainslav vs Aurik vs Ryko

[aurik]

Multi-attack A+ weapon in both hands and meat+bard pretty much makes Berserk irrelevant, not completly no, but Just ask a mnk/nin, it's more about double attack than berserk.

Uh, no, berserk is a big deal, and aggressor would be an even bigger deal, if it could be subbed. Double-attack is icing.

[Halcyon]

LOL Why is this even up for debate?

WAR JT: Attack Bonus, Double Attack
WAR JA: Berserk, Aggressor, Warcry

The -only- way, I can see, a PLD DD would outparse a WAR DD is if the PLD DD had MUCH, MUCH better gear than the WAR DD. (Which has already been stated, numerous times before in this thread).

None of this posturing answers the ORIGINAL question which was "at what point does a PLD DD become better than a WAR DD"? (As paraphrased from Aurik on page 2).

If you're matching up WAR DD v. PLD DD in similar gear, the WAR DD will always come out on top. Why? Higher natural attack, higher WS dmg and more overall flexibility with EQ and JAs.

PLD DD would have to stack on a LOT of gear to make up for its natural deficiences as it is primarily built to be a defensive job, not an offensive one while WAR can go either way.

Now, unless someone is willing to run a trial test with a PLD v. WAR in comparable equipment this argument is completely pointless.

Now saying specifically that PLD -may-, under certain conditions, be able to outparse WAR is more feasible than making a broad generalized statement that PLD DD > WAR.

The only advantage, that -I- can see, a PLD DD has over WAR DD is attack speed dual-wielding swords, but HEY GUESS WHAT unless you're testing on VT mobs or mobs with low evasion that won't mean much. And even then the difference is what? 2-3 seconds? (Without a Bard) You'll swing faster but your accuracy will still be the same, while a WAR (theoretically) will still have an advantage in Accuracy AND attack regardless if he's using Sword or Axe, connecting more often (percentage-wise) and for higher average dmg per swing.

[Vedder]

50% consumption, 50% joyeuse, 3 attacks a round average, do the math.

25% 4 attack/avg, 50% 3 attack/avg, 25% 2 attack/avg

What do I win?

[Faxanadu]

Try it on greater colbri:

pld/nin
pld/nin
pld/nin
pld/nin
brd/nin-whatever
brd/whm-ballad/march

joytoy and well equiped plds of course.


what you guys are forgetting:
pld/war with justice is a swinging fool, and has berserk.

either way though, a pld will take a war to school in ballista.

[aurik]

what you guys are forgetting:
pld/war with justice is a swinging fool, and has berserk.

either way though, a pld will take a war to school in ballista.

still doesn't have aggressor nor 20% bonus to attack speed from dual weild nor for that matter shadows.

nobody gives a fuck about ballista.

[Faxanadu]

no, pld dosen't have aggressor, but A+ sword, +8 sword merits, +suppa(+5sword), +fort torque(+7 sword) does a fair job of making up for it, and there is never any down time from it.


pld won't have duel weild like that, your right, but they can boost atk by 12 or Str by 5 with a shield.

your also right about shadows, but flash is like having :Ni, plus a pld brings mp and cures to the table. this takes stress off of the rdm, and might even extend your chains.

nobody gives a fuck about ballista.

lol, thats all i got to say.



Im not saying pld is a better DD than a war, im just merley stating that a pld can have a place in a merit pt, i don't see why this is such a hard concept to grasp.

[aurik]

no, pld dosen't have aggressor, but A+ sword, +8 sword merits, +suppa(+5sword), +fort torque(+7 sword) does a fair job of making up for it, and there is never any down time from it.


pld won't have duel weild like that, your right, but they can boost atk by 12 or Str by 5 with a shield.

your also right about shadows, but flash is like having :Ni, plus a pld brings mp and cures to the table. this takes stress off of the rdm, and might even extend your chains.

nobody gives a fuck about ballista.

lol, thats all i got to say.



Im not saying pld is a better DD than a war, im just merley stating that a pld can have a place in a merit pt, i don't see why this is such a hard concept to grasp.

I don't even know where to start.

[jerkbox]

if you can't get a second brd, pld/nin with sanction is pretty pwn too. ddx3, pld, rdm, brd. ok damage + another pool of curing mp is pretty hot. plus flash is nice if you get lucky and flash a mob that's about to do a multi-hit ws (fang rush) :D

[Isildur]

pld won't have duel weild like that, your right, but they can boost atk by 12 or Str by 5 with a shield.

uhh....are you seriously trying to say PLD/WAR can even come close to PLD/NIN DD in merit parties? oh and +12 attack or +5 STR doesnt even come close to joy/justice DoT, sorry

[cassiraa]

+12 attack or +5 STR doesn't come close to Company/Joy DoT.

[Isildur]

+12 attack or +5 STR doesn't come close to Company/Joy DoT.

joy/justice is probably the better choice, you're sacrificing maybe +200 damage on vorpal for a higher attack speed, but then again i dont have the WS gear to make comp/joy or comp/justice efficient in WS damage

[Faxanadu]

i was just throwing that out there since it hasn't been mentioned before, your trading 20% haste for berserk and double attack (which is added onto jailer weapons for 3 attacks in 1 round)

I don't have a parser (PS2 user) so i honestly didin't know which 1 parses better.

[cassiraa]

+12 attack or +5 STR doesn't come close to Company/Joy DoT.

joy/justice is probably the better choice, you're sacrificing maybe +200 damage on vorpal for a higher attack speed, but then again i dont have the WS gear to make comp/joy or comp/justice efficient in WS damage

I know, and I agree. I was just taking it one step further.

I was intending "Not only did Isildur say that it doesn't compare to Joy/Justice, That wouldn't even compare to Compay/Joy"

albeit the post was admittedly vague.