Discuss the second amendment here.

[Devek]

Enjoy

[Misterjingles]

Whats the 2nd amendment?

I'm kidding!

[Devek]

It allows people to buy clunky and expensive guns but they don't work near as well as a few karate classes and well aimed strikes at the thumb.

[Prismatics]

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

[GRT]

you'd be surprised how many people don't know this but

the 2nd amendment has never been interpreted in any u.s. court to mean that individuals have the right to own guns

[Raineer]

It doesn't have anything to do with today's shootings, that's for damn sure.

Rescind the damn amendment, feel free. Let me know how fewer guns are in the hands of criminals.

Weed is highly illegal, I'm sure no one on this board can acquire any either...and alot of you fall into the "i live in a college dorm and enjoy fafenirs and have no job" category. You can get weed no problem.

What the fuck do you think is going to stop a career criminal with money, connections, and no morals. Hmmm?

[BIGSTIC]

It allows people to buy clunky and expensive guns but they don't work near as well as a few karate classes and well aimed strikes at the thumb.

LMFAO OMG

Anyways i am a hunter that gets close to 70% of his meat through hunting. Idiots are everywhere and weather they use a gun, car, knife, or plane(hi2u 9-11) they will harm others. And unless you live in lala land you will never be 100% safe. My newborn son will be learning how to use a gun as soon as i feel he is old enough to understand the consequences of using one. I still remeber the first time i shot a gun at the age of 5 and OMG my dad didnt even have a gun safe and HOLY SHIT i never stole a gun to kill one of my friends on accident. So mabey we should look at parenting or lack there of. Guns kill YES but last time i looked hands can Kill too so guess they need to be banned too.

[GRT]

It doesn't have anything to do with today's shootings, that's for damn sure.

Rescind the damn amendment, feel free. Let me know how fewer guns are in the hands of criminals.

Weed is highly illegal, I'm sure no one on this board can acquire any either...and alot of you fall into the "i live in a college dorm and enjoy fafenirs and have no job" category. You can get weed no problem.

What the fuck do you think is going to stop a career criminal with money, connections, and no morals. Hmmm?

while i disagree with stricter gun control, note that prohibition did decrease domestic violence by a great portion, so i wouldn't say so bluntly that stricter gun control wouldn't decrease the number of gun violences as one of the results

[zoobernut]

Maybe before people start getting into the discussion can the OP put the exact wording of the second amendment in the original post? that way there is no arguement about what it says the arguement is about how to interpret it. I have seen the second amendment misquoted so many times in discussions like this.

[Kazen]

It allows people to buy clunky and expensive guns but they don't work near as well as a few karate classes and well aimed strikes at the thumb.

no lik lik you train and you can catch bullets!

[Mifaco]

greatest amendment ever

[Keno]

My post from the other thread:

You realize that without the second ammendment the crime rate would skyrocket, right? 90%+ of weapons used in crimes resulting in a death are not weapons that are purchased or obtained legally. So even if we outlaw carrying or owning weapons, the criminals are still going to be able to obtain their guns illegally. Couple that with all law-abiding citizens not being able to own weapons and you have yourself a spike in the crime rate.

[Enkidu]

googled: http://www.gunowners.org/sk0802.htm

Site is biased, sources look pretty clean. I'm sure there are counter stats, I'll let people against the right to bear arms post those up, if they find some.

[Raineer]

It allows people to buy clunky and expensive guns but they don't work near as well as a few karate classes and well aimed strikes at the thumb.

LMFAO OMG

Anyways i am a hunter that gets close to 70% of his meat through hunting. Idiots are everywhere and weather they use a gun, car, knife, or plane(hi2u 9-11) they will harm others. And unless you live in lala land you will never be 100% safe. My newborn son will be learning how to use a gun as soon as i feel he is old enough to understand the consequences of using one. I still remeber the first time i shot a gun at the age of 5 and OMG my dad didnt even have a gun safe and HOLY SHIT i never stole a gun to kill one of my friends on accident. So mabey we should look at parenting or lack there of. Guns kill YES but last time i looked hands can Kill too so guess they need to be banned too.

This was pretty much the same approach my Dad took with me. Once you've "been around" guns at a young age it's surprising how you don't grow up with that OMG ITS A GUN attitude. We also never had a gun safe and I had full knowledge of where they all were + all the ammo.

This approach doesn't work so well in the city obviously, and to that extent I'm not sure what to tell people. If a person is a hunter or grew up in a family of hunters, I can promise you they aren't like the Ted Nugent/Unibomber style of cowboy with AK47's blazing into the woods for no apparent reason.

Guns are something that are able to be treated respectfully and used correctly (as per the actual intent of the 2nd amendment), if this concept is lost on you then you yourself are too naive to handle a gun in the first place. (Referencing the other thread) when someone mentions "if you own a gun or want one you are a fucked-up human being", that person is displacing their own reality that they could never handle the responsibility of a gun in the first place.

I don't like the whole cliche of "guns dont kill people, people kill people" because with a cliche people don't necessarily think it through and absorb the meaning. There's only so many laws a government can make to keep it's own people safe and it has to be within reason. If you ban all guns and they went away I promise you the crazies will find the next-best-thing to kill people with, and so on.

[Khamsin]

Well, aside from the "then only criminals will own guns" argument, I guess the side effect is that less guns are produced. If, for example, they outlaw the manufacture of any new firearms other than sport hunting rifles (military excluded), but allow people to keep their current legally owned firearms, then it won't do much now but in the future, firearms will become increasingly rare even for criminals since no new guns are being produced unless they come from abroad.

[Keno]

Well, aside from the "then only criminals will own guns" argument, I guess the side effect is that less guns are produced. If, for example, they outlaw the manufacture of any new firearms other than sport hunting rifles (military excluded), but allow people to keep their current legally owned firearms, then it won't do much now but in the future, firearms will become increasingly rare even for criminals since no new guns are being produced unless they come from abroad.

Which will happen with 100% certainty. There is a golden rule of life: it doesn't matter if it's illegal or not, if you want it badly enough, you can get it.

[Raineer]

Well, aside from the "then only criminals will own guns" argument, I guess the side effect is that less guns are produced. If, for example, they outlaw the manufacture of any new firearms other than sport hunting rifles (military excluded), but allow people to keep their current legally owned firearms, then it won't do much now but in the future, firearms will become increasingly rare even for criminals since no new guns are being produced unless they come from abroad.

In that case I'd bring up my weed argument again.

I mean, your statement does look good on paper...i agree. However the fact remains that where there is a demand there will be a supply.

[Keno]

Well, aside from the "then only criminals will own guns" argument, I guess the side effect is that less guns are produced. If, for example, they outlaw the manufacture of any new firearms other than sport hunting rifles (military excluded), but allow people to keep their current legally owned firearms, then it won't do much now but in the future, firearms will become increasingly rare even for criminals since no new guns are being produced unless they come from abroad.

In that case I'd bring up my weed argument again.

I mean, your statement does look good on paper...i agree. However the fact remains that where there is a demand there will be a supply.

See above.

[zoobernut]

A question I have, this is a question because I do not know the statistics of it, Of all the guns obtained illegally by the criminal themselves how many of those were originally legally owned guns?

for instance guy buys handgun legally, criminal breaks into his house and steals said gun.

or guy buys gun legally then illegally sells it on the black market to a criminal or trades it for something.

I don't know for sure but I bet there is a lot of "illegal guns" being used by criminals that were initially put out there legally.

Also I heard one time that for the average person who owns a gun for the purpose of self defense in their home (not for hunting) that gun is statistically more likely to hurt a friend or family member than help fend off a criminal. I heard that quite a long time ago so I do not remember where I heard it, that statement just stuck in my mind for some reason.

[MikedeeFenrir]

http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/7229/8312bk1.png

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