Question about AMII

[Janeru]

I still burst 2 hope because he is my bitch. >:3

>.>

[Suiram]

Hope isn't strong to Thunder, at least not that I've ever noticed. Nothing in CoP seems to be like it was in Zilart where things that cast some element were strong to that element and the element below it, and weak to the element above it. Thunder works fine on Hope and Faith, Fire works fine (I think) on Bahamut, even stuff like Tiamat, Thunder works almost as well as Water, contrast to Suzaku where you pretty much have to cast water if you don't want to do double-digit damage.

[yrpaine]

I have the same set up and I love it. I only ever MB with Burst and the rest are really good for situational stuff, flare and quake just blow for the most part.

but... but... quake2 on earthsday + double earth weather on puddys with obi and af2 legs = super e-peen in blm parties!

[Kerberoz]

I have the same set up and I love it. I only ever MB with Burst and the rest are really good for situational stuff, flare and quake just blow for the most part.

but... but... quake2 on earthsday + double earth weather on puddys with obi and af2 legs = super e-peen in blm parties!

BLM pts should pull 6-10 wamouras and ga3 them <,< puddings ftl!!

[Martinius]

im at this same stage... right now i have burst upgradedx1, freezex1, floodx1. im trying to decide with my three remaining merits in that category.

my linkshell does primarily HNM actvities, ToAU hnms, ground kings, sea, etc, so some mobs are not burst on > kb, khimaira, cerb, whereas aspi and fafhogg are.

that whole little background is to explain that basically, my flood2s are pretty much owning the shit out of anything i do on fafhogg. (question for the random thread... does a relic weapon add any bonus damage to the bursts of the skillchain? we do mercy stroke > tachi: gekko for darkness, and then kasha > sharkbite or spinning slash for light, normally soon after. anways, my flood2 owns the hell out of faf to the point where it'll pull hate off of non-roared tanks... i seldom die, no im not overnuking, but i find it peculiar, to the point that im tempted to go burst x2, freeze x2, flood x2, and leave tornado out of it. or have freeze only get unlocked(which it is now) because it's boosted by the tier 1 merit ice potency, and use the second upgrade instead to unlock tornado II.

thoughts?

[yrpaine]

I have the same set up and I love it. I only ever MB with Burst and the rest are really good for situational stuff, flare and quake just blow for the most part.

but... but... quake2 on earthsday + double earth weather on puddys with obi and af2 legs = super e-peen in blm parties!

BLM pts should pull 6-10 wamouras and ga3 them <,< puddings ftl!!

but then you'd need to /whm to erase burn, and still double earth weather there.

[Spekkio]

(question for the random thread... does a relic weapon add any bonus damage to the bursts of the skillchain? we do mercy stroke > tachi: gekko for darkness, and then kasha > sharkbite or spinning slash for light, normally soon after.

all of what i say below is what i can derive from what i know. i think it's all correct, but do not take it as fact.
magic burst damage is applied in the magic damage calculation as a multiplier. the base added damage you can get to a nuke that's mbed is 30% for a 2 ws skillchain. adding more ws into the skillchain increases the damage dealt by the mbs by 5% more each time. so, for example if i did 2 ws to make distortion, then a third to make darkness, i'd gain 35% damage on it. if you continued the darkness ws with a dark relic ws, then you could get another 5% making the burst add 40% damage. sorcerer's gloves, as well as the static earring add a 5% bonus to magic burst damage each as well.

just as a random aside while i'm thinking about it, a fun idea for a blm who needs a little ego booster might be to grab a handfull of sam to pop sewer syrup. when it pops just cycle through lvl 2 skillchains over and over using meikyo shisui to build the skillchain count to obscene numbers. magic burst burst2 on the extended skillchain for some extreme numbers. (if the blm has somehow managed to survive the barrage of fluid spreads this has caused that is. ^^) practical? no. does it even have a point? probably not. it does amuse me to think about when i'm painfully bored though.

[Nagamaki]

The skillchain multiplier and the magic burst bonus go up when you increase the level of a SC, not just by adding more WS.

I'm going to call the Skillchain/MB level "M" since calling it level causes confusion between it and the actualy skillchain levels.

SCs themselves have these properties:

Lv1 = Unresisted SC does 50% of the closing WS dmg, MB bonus 30%
Lv2 = Unresisted SC does 60% of the closing WS dmg, MB bonus 30%
Lv3 = Unresisted SC does 100% of the closing WS dmg, MB bonus 30%

M has 3 possible values.

M0 = SC does 100% of its normal dmg, MB bonus unchanged
M1 = SC does 150% of its normal dmg, MB bonus +5%
M2 = SC does 200% of its normal dmg, MB bonus +10%

(I'm not really certain on the MB bonus exact % actually, I believe those are at least roughly accurate though. I've extensively tested the SC part so no uncertainty there)

When doing any skillchain, M always starts at 0. It will stay at 0 regardless of how many WS are used in the skillchain as long as the SC level does not go up. When the SC level does go up, M will go up by 1. Extending a Lv3 SC with a relic WS will increase M by 1 unless M already has its max value of 2.

There is a max number of WS you can string while staying on the same level, I tested that awhile back but sadly I forgot to note the exact number, I think it was something around 5. This is easy enough to test with a bunch of THFs, just do Dancing Edge 1 at a time until it stops skillchaining. Since staying on the same level doesn't increase M, this is kinda pointless to do anyway.

That pretty much sums it up, if its not clear I can give applied examples. The main point is, a relic SC extension will increase the SC and MB bonus but only if the SC isn't already a full three stepped SC from level 1.

[Suiram]

When doing any skillchain, M always starts at 0. It will stay at 0 regardless of how many WS are used in the skillchain as long as the SC level does not go up. When the SC level does go up, M will go up by 1. Extending a Lv3 SC with a relic WS will increase M by 1 unless M already has its max value of 2.

I know nothing of the SC damage information you posted above, but this is false of the MB information. When we tested this we got a 40% bonus (30% is base for a 2-WS SC btw) from both Induration > Fragmentation > Light and Transfixion > Reverbaration > Impaction chains.

[Nagamaki]

Hmm, for MB I generally assumed it followed the pattern of the SC damage, didn't actually test it directly.

The example you give stops at 3 SCs though, did you try adding more to see if you could get the bonus past 40? That's the part that would matter mainly.

[Suiram]

Hmm, for MB I generally assumed it followed the pattern of the SC damage, didn't actually test it directly.

The example you give stops at 3 SCs though, did you try adding more to see if you could get the bonus past 40? That's the part that would matter mainly.

No, although it is something I've wanted to go back and do. At the time we were mostly concerned with ascertaining if the bonus from AF2 hands/Static was additive or multiplicative.

[Nagamaki]

I went and did a quick test, looks like your correction is accurate. I also noted a very slight (6-7%) dmg increase on the SC itself too without increasing level, but testing this with dual boxing is kind of a pain in the ass.

I'll see if I can test it further tonight with a little help and correct the errors in what I posted, looks like time distorted my memory of the tests we did a long time ago, it was around CoP release so I guess its been awhile.

[aurik]

See the information on Wiki about SC damage.

[Ichthyos]

And in case anyone doesn't see it, there's info that's been on the talk page forever but hasn't been integrated into the Skillchain or Magic Burst pages yet:

http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/Talk:Skillchain#Max_Damage

[Nagamaki]

The actual wiki entry definitely needs to get overhauled, the stuff on the discussion page is a lot more detailed.

Based on the entry itself, one would think Lv1 > Lv1 causes the second Lv1 to do 75% of the WS's damage, since the info there says the 2nd SC does 50% more than it would by itself, while the chart in the discussion says 60%. Same type of problem with Lv1 > Lv2, the entry would indicate a 90% dmg, but the discussion chart shows 75%. In both cases the correct info is what's on the chart, not what the entry implies.

At least for the low WS counts the chart on the discussion page looks accurate, although I think the numbers might be off for high WS count SCs. I'll try to do some testing when I can get a few helpers to see if I can confirm all those numbers, and test the MB part at the same time.

[Nagamaki]

OK so some test results on various aspects of the SC/MBs.

First, the chart on the Discussion page of the Skillchain wiki is accurate as far as I could test so far, I couldn't test past 6 WS yet though. Overall the pattern is pretty simple though so chances are the rest of it is also correct, I'll just need to get 2 helpers some time to confirm that part.

Second, the MB bonus does keep stacking, but unlike SC damage the MB bonus is exclusively increased by the number of WS, SC level itself doesn't change anything. The bonus is 30% for 1st SC and goes up 5% per SC in the chain, up to 6 at least. That means 2man 30%, 3 35%, 4 40%, 5 45%, 6 50%...

On the SCs themselves, it was proviously tested that a Lv2 or Lv3 SC will pick the element within itself that the target mob type is least resistant to when it comes to checking for resist. What actually seems to happen is that the SC itself becomes exclusively of that element for resist and damage modifier purposes, and that is probably why many people believed that Al'taieu obis didn't work for skillchains, as well as why natural weather/day bonus is possible on SCs but not as common as one might expect. If you do Full Swing > Full Swing (Fusion) on a Greater Bird (resistant to light), Fusion will act as a Fire damage source, and will only be susceptible by fire weather/firesday or closing with a Fire Staff. If you do the exact same skillchain on a Bat (weak to light), Fusion will act as a Light damage source, and be susceptible to light weather/lightsday/Light Staff only. That behavior makes the usefulness of obis (for SCs) pretty damn situationnal even if you rely skillchains frequently.


None of this is particularly practical since even if you do use SCs they probably don't go past 2-3man outside of Meikyo Shisui, but oh well.