Salvage - Silver Sea Remnants - thread 2

[Clynt]

Well, we always give abilities to MNKs first so they can WS and Counterstance and that speeds it up a ton. With Destroyers, I think that would add more dmg than a THF that probably can't WS or SA/TA yet. Destroyers make a pretty big difference... and I'm sure Blau Dolch makes a HUGE difference compared to the tHF using H2H. I still think it would be better to give to the MNK though seeing as how they have WS. THF can at least still do some dmg with Hand-to-Hand... I mean it's not much, but it helps until they get weapons.

[Wizerd]

We always give all other melees weapon before THF. A mnk with Destroyers or a SAM with their GKT will speed it up a lot, far outweighing the little TH that THF Knife gives. Only way I could see it being beneficial to give to THF before some melees is maybe if they had a Mandau.

Hmmm.. I'm usually thief and usually get weapons before the monks. Its kinda foolish for thieves to be using TK when not on a NM (though on Arrapago ill switch to it before the qutrub is dead if i don't have abilities). Do you really think giving a mnk +20ish base damage is better than giving a thief + 30ish base damage, + 90ish attack, and accuracy? Sincere question, not sarcasm. Since the mnks tend to usually get all the other gear first , I can see that weapons might be best on them. We tend to always give mnks weapons last though if there are other melee that need.

Yes, I really think giving a MNK +20 Base DMG is better than giving a THF +30 Base DMG and 90ish Attack. Without gear, that THF isn't hitting very hard, regardless of the weapon he has on. He's inflicted with all stats down, so he can't SA or TA for very much.

Your MNK is already getting Haste, already has Abilities, and is already getting the first pieces of equipment (the only job I give all this to first is WAR if we have one come as a main tank), so by giving him weapons you're simply amplifying their damage. Having hate on a MNK is also very beneficial due to counterstance, as that speeds things up by at least a few minutes on 1F. The collective damage done by counters alone shaves off a good chunk of time.

What I do now, if I bring other non-MNK melees (not incl THF) is give the first weapon/equip/abilities to MNK, and the second of each to the melee. We typically don't have more than 1 non-MNK melee. (Often MNK MNK THF [SAM / DRK / WAR])

[Lyramion]

But Destroyers also make MNK hit slower than bare hand :-"

Not like +48 Delay really matter

[Sidanoir]

MNKs are pretty much last on my list for giving out weapon cells...thats the beauty of monks to me really only need abilities to be useful on early floors.....and even if they dont have abilities bare handed punching is still nice damage on those weak ass mobs..

I get THF weapon asap for zones like arrapago where even with TH4 x2 like we had last night (had radiatius in first chest too >.>)you can get royally screwed on cells....

For zones like zhayolm and silver sea with mostly static loot pools THF having thf knife and such don't matter too much.....Bhaflau thf kinda helps on bombs but lolwamouracampa drop spam

[Amele]

[quote=Wizerd]

Hmm, must be very small line of sight then because I've pulled 1 that had 2-3 basically looking at it, and 0 links. Done plenty of runs here and never experienced a link from that room and I've never been careful pulling lol.

I haven't done East side in a while, but I have to ask, why do East? Ever since the starting chest was added, West takes the same amount of time as East with about the same amount of cells, perhaps only one or two less magic cells on average, AND you get to kill an NM. 25 minutes tops.

with six this is closer to 30~32 minutes than 25.

going east is only smart if you're planning to skip directly to floor 4 with fewer than 8 people (since you'll basically be totally geared up) but you're still skipping an NM for what would basically be about 5-10 minutes of extra work tops (between popping the nm and farming the 'missed' cells)

1F is not 30-32 min with 6, it's like 20min... are you clearing the entire floor? No reason to do that at all. With 6 I clear 1 room, with 7-9 I clear 2, with more I usually clear 3, then fight end room.

what's your setup? we generally take about 28-30 minutes whether we clear 1 room and the 6 or 0 rooms and the 6. I've been pushing for faster but it's been difficult to get much faster without risking deaths to low mp (I can only carry so many hi-ethers going in lol)

(we're typically: mnk/nin mnk/nin thf rng whm brd)

RNG -> RDM, and melee all bring Hi-Potions. Weapons to MNK > MNK > THF, don't give THF one at start, abilities same order, all equipment to 1 MNK first, other MNK second, then THF, and THF "sac" pulls towards the start or the room you killed first while you pull 2-3 Fomors off the final room, he should lose aggro and come back to help fight by the time those are dead, then just kill the rest. No need for hi-ethers. SJ to RDM, first Ranged to THF if only 1 drops and only 1 magic drops, otherwise give the ranged from chest to the BRD so he can do two songs for 5mp/tick more (Storm Fife).

I miss anything? All makes for an easy 20 or less minute clear with 6.[/quote:fa637]

bolded is what we weren't doing. I'll make my monks bring more pots next time and we'll see if we can't get it faster. (everything else is exactly what we're doing, only thing thief gets over monk is hands for TH4 since we don't usually get two on 1F)

rng only has ranger and cor, could switch him to cor probably though. (third ability? probably)

[Uzor]

I, too, used to give weapons to melees first. But since a few months back, I've given it to MNK's first, and it really is better then giving it to melees first.

I'd recommend you try it out, at least once, to see what you think. Worst case scenario, you lose out a few min on first floor, and know that your group gain more out of giving it to melees first. Best case scenario, you gain a few min on first floor, and know that your group benefits more out of giving MNK's weapons first.

[Arthars]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

they used to hit me(NIN w/o defender) for 80-100+ damage but yesterday they only hit me for 20-22 LOL

huge difference because i somehow dont have to spam hi-pos on the MNK for the first time (only rdm is magic unlock usually and MP always an issue)

ninja fixed?

[Wizerd]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

they used to hit me(NIN w/o defender) for 80-100+ damage but yesterday they only hit me for 20-22 LOL

huge difference because i somehow dont have to spam hi-pos on the MNK for the first time (only rdm is magic unlock usually and MP always an issue)

ninja fixed?

The 1F West ones never, ever hit for 80-100. Perhaps you had defense down on and it wasn't erased before. 20-40 sounds normal with Phalanx II up, when tanking with my MNK. It's the 1F East ones that hit for 80-100.

[mdkuser]

They always have hit very hard, especially rdm and ranger ones ( more than 100/hit). Unless you got VIT already.

[Lordwafik]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

You really need to stop posting things as pure fact.

The fomors hit me tonight for 80-100 still.

[alphacat]

Quick question, would Hammerbow->2F skip->3F Gear NM + slot NM doable? On a usual boss run, I like to do Hammberbow>Powderkeg>Boss, that usually leaves 40min for boss. Or when I do slot, I do Hammberblow->Dekka->Gear->Frog, and usually left with little to no time after frog is dead. So for those who've done it, is it possible to do slot and also leave enough time for boss?

[Wizerd]

Quick question, would Hammerbow->2F skip->3F Gear NM + slot NM doable? On a usual boss run, I like to do Hammberbow>Powderkeg>Boss, that usually leaves 40min for boss. Or when I do slot, I do Hammberblow->Dekka->Gear->Frog, and usually left with little to no time after frog is dead. So for those who've done it, is it possible to do slot and also leave enough time for boss?

I have 35-45min left after North route including slot NM, typically. 20 minutes after 3F East if we do that, which is enough time to run to and kill boss if we're on top of our game that night.

[Siatdiat]

My Salvage group has only been going about 3 months, on friday, saturday and sunday each week, plus a few extra runs thrown in. We have gotten 17 35 drops, and about 14 of those we got in about 6-8 weeks after we had a thf, we always give her one of the first 2 weapons. But sure call it a placebo if you want. 8) Maybe we're just lucky.

Edit: Not totally on topic but a response to the mnk or thf weapon first debate.

[Arthars]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

You really need to stop posting things as pure fact.

The fomors hit me tonight for 80-100 still.

then thats wierd. it hit me lesser for sure and thats why i posted changed so you guys can compare

but its ok even it hits you 80-100 still

just dont be a bitch.

nvm you always are

[Sidanoir]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

You really need to stop posting things as pure fact.

The fomors hit me tonight for 80-100 still.

then thats wierd. it hit me lesser for sure and thats why i posted changed so you guys can compare

but its ok even it hits you 80-100 still

just dont be a bitch.

nvm you always are

They do hit for 80-100 on a WAR/NIN without Phalanx II and stuff..

However! Through on some defense gear, defender a terras staff and phalanx II (Level 3 of course) and they hit for 0 -20....

Our strat for pulling these is send in a WAR geared like above (hell could be a MNK w/e), and let the mobs pound on him for near zero damage while we pick em one off at a time...works like a charm..

Just aggro them like you would for the commonly used strat typically done in Omega/Ultima COP BC mammets so you can be cured occasionaly if needed without losing hate.

[NynJa]

What I do for the Hammerblow PH's is this:
If I have ranged, I pull one from max distance and run back to the group which is waiting in the hallway. By the time you reach the hallway with the stairs, the fomor will deaggro in the big square room. Durring this time, you have a 5-6 second window of opportunity to pop another ranged attack and get it link free. If you are not confident in your ability to do this, or luck doesnt favor you (deaggro in a spot you cant get a good pull from), have someone wait in the big square room where you enter from on the left side of it and have them claim one, while you run to the right side and deaggro them as usual. The person pulling hate on it will then run it to the group and everyone beats on it.

[Munkey]

just posting incase anyone havent notice:

THE 6 FOMOR IN 1F WEST NM ROOM HITS LIKE A PUSSY NOW

You really need to stop posting things as pure fact.

The fomors hit me tonight for 80-100 still.

then thats wierd. it hit me lesser for sure and thats why i posted changed so you guys can compare

but its ok even it hits you 80-100 still

just dont be a bitch.

nvm you always are

Yes, but he's a bitch that types english very well. And I much rather enjoy reading from a bitchy dude that i can understand, thn 2 read after sumone who dsnt use any vowels.

[Amele]

My Salvage group has only been going about 3 months, on friday, saturday and sunday each week, plus a few extra runs thrown in. We have gotten 17 35 drops, and about 14 of those we got in about 6-8 weeks after we had a thf, we always give her one of the first 2 weapons. But sure call it a placebo if you want. 8) Maybe we're just lucky.

Edit: Not totally on topic but a response to the mnk or thf weapon first debate.

you don't give thief first weapon in SSR because by the time you hit something that is affected by TH, you have 5 guaranteed weapon cells.

so generally, thief gets the fifth weapon cell in my group in SSR.

[Odd]

My Salvage group has only been going about 3 months, on friday, saturday and sunday each week, plus a few extra runs thrown in. We have gotten 17 35 drops, and about 14 of those we got in about 6-8 weeks after we had a thf, we always give her one of the first 2 weapons. But sure call it a placebo if you want. 8) Maybe we're just lucky.

Edit: Not totally on topic but a response to the mnk or thf weapon first debate.

you don't give thief first weapon in SSR because by the time you hit something that is affected by TH, you have 5 guaranteed weapon cells.

so generally, thief gets the fifth weapon cell in my group in SSR.

although there are 3 guaranteed cell drops per mob, you can get 4 cells with some help from TH

[Amele]

My Salvage group has only been going about 3 months, on friday, saturday and sunday each week, plus a few extra runs thrown in. We have gotten 17 35 drops, and about 14 of those we got in about 6-8 weeks after we had a thf, we always give her one of the first 2 weapons. But sure call it a placebo if you want. 8) Maybe we're just lucky.

Edit: Not totally on topic but a response to the mnk or thf weapon first debate.

you don't give thief first weapon in SSR because by the time you hit something that is affected by TH, you have 5 guaranteed weapon cells.

so generally, thief gets the fifth weapon cell in my group in SSR.

although there are 3 guaranteed cell drops per mob, you can get 4 cells with some help from TH

TH2 is plenty. most groups only farm 1-8 extra anyway before they go fight the fixed drop fomors in the south room; so you're talking an opportunity of .. what. +1% on 8 cells? not worth the time it adds in not giving monks the first two weapon cells and the next guaranteed one is the south room anyway.