Salvage - Silver Sea Remnants - thread 2

[Fridell]

No one get my sarcasm note even after I explained it, ok stupid ppl:

It was sarcasm, since we all should know already that things in Salvage works different depending on what group you ask, with this whole RDM vs BRD puller, BRD & COR, and 2 DD vs whatever and what the fuck not, I thought the whole discussion went in the direction I could mess around.
Didn't we already cover, in tons of tons of posts, that some groups do things in certains ways different then others, get same results or better ? Ok good.
Now gtfo again!

[fishstix]

I 2boxed pulling at the same time with both rdm and brd, so ha!

[Kuky the Byky]

phat skills.

we always have BRD pull but if he links i (RDM) grav/bind the fomor until imp dies

he sometimes struggles to keep buffs up in time to pull again but if that happens i try to pick up on it and pull for him. a combination of both RDM and BRD pulling works well as long as both dont pull @ same time

[pchan]

Had some fun today on 1F, tossed phalanx II on everyone and proceeded to "supertank" the central room for a few minutes ; that's really easy and a good solution for those that like to bring 5 DDs.

[Darkhelmet]

Are you talking about Hammerblow's room? If so, it's really much more time efficient to supertank those fomors, although we always had a RDM, WHM, and BRD on our runs.

Our DDs were MNK, SAM, THF... and if we ever brought 7, we'd have a lone BLM in a separate alliance. Granted, I was a Galka, but my HP didn't ever dip into the red. Phalanx II really is the shit in this spot, but it's not completely necessary.

I'd just run up to the group of 6, use Boost (they aggro job abilities), and have everyone /assist me.

[pchan]

Nope, talking about the room that leads to the teleporter. The fomors are superweak, we basically had our 5 ppl unocked 5 min after hammerblow.

[Uzor]

Speaking of which, could you do it before you do Hammerblow? They might be too hard for that, would be nie to know though. Skip the earlier fomors entirely and just supertank that room then move to Hammerblow. Have everyone unlocked and down to next floor within 10 min. Never tried 'em.

[Wolfknight]

Speaking of which, could you do it before you do Hammerblow? They might be too hard for that, would be nie to know though. Skip the earlier fomors entirely and just supertank that room then move to Hammerblow. Have everyone unlocked and down to next floor within 10 min. Never tried 'em.

door locked til hammer is dead.

[pchan]

door locked til hammer is dead.

not dead, but it needs to be poped.

[Darkhelmet]

What would happen if you just had one person drop alliance, link the entire center room with sneak on (so they just follow you, not attack), and have your main alliance just pluck them off 1 by 1?

Does this work?

[Kuky the Byky]

wondering if i could get some advice for my group.

basically our situation is we were 2/4 on ares legs 35 and dont want to do it anymore, at least not for a while so we can focus on other NMs (CC and mega), is there any good way of skipping killing that entire room to get to the next floor? we tried having a THF flee aggro all the gears and run back whilst we killed rampart but gears deaggroed too soon and came back and aggroed us. any other groups managed to do it?

[pchan]

wondering if i could get some advice for my group.

basically our situation is we were 2/4 on ares legs 35 and dont want to do it anymore, at least not for a while so we can focus on other NMs (CC and mega), is there any good way of skipping killing that entire room to get to the next floor? we tried having a THF flee aggro all the gears and run back whilst we killed rampart but gears deaggroed too soon and came back and aggroed us. any other groups managed to do it?

Fastest solution is THF aggro and other people zerg but it's only efficient if the correct rampart is not at entrance, so I'll suggest to kill 4 gears then the rampart ; keeping 4 gears slept is doable. You lose ~ 5 minutes killing those 4 gears but it's 100% safe. Another solution is to camp around the rampart and sleep aggro paying attention about magic/Ja aggro etc. Rarely more than 4 link.

[mdkuser]

if the thf knows what he is doing (= knows when they lose aggro), and has a pair of powder poots, he can kite them even if the rampart is not on the back. w/o use of perfect dodge.

[Valyana]

One thing I've been noticing: an easy way to tell whether a gear pull in G3G room will link a rampart is to look at the lines on the floor: if the gear is outside the box, it won't link.

[Deemos]

Which lines you talking about? The Square under the rampart?

[Fridell]

Yeap, the square lines under the ramparts plateau or what to say.

[Limlight]

I dont want to sound like an ass here but your 4/5 Usu MNK should be able to give you all advice you need. . . ?
Maybe he isnt that Salvage experienced after all and maybe just been a follower w/o knowing wtf is going on?
Just asking, you can ask your questions here though, just pointed that out!

Everyone does everything differently. I'm trying to maximize our runs and hit as many nms as we can every single time. Yes my mnk outlined all his strats his old group used and now I"m trying to perfect them here on bg with people who have been doing salvage since its inception. My bro's old group was fine with sorta half assing things and not milking every second out of a run. I'm not taking what you said personally or anything, but it did come off making you sound a bit like an ass lol.

Still we're getting things down, and I appreciate all the responses. They've really helped.

[Wolfknight]

So did turtle floor last night and something odd happened, we pulled all ramparts avoiding gear train as normal with thf sac pull, well we start fighting in the first room as normal and out of no where the gear train comes in kills me like I had aggro somehow but I didn't see them at all before that and had been 2~5 minutes after we started killing ramparts. Then it leaves w/o linking to any of the ramparts or aggroing anyone else. So I am trying to figure out wtf happened for the record was on sam/war so no magic aggro. Is it glitched maybe?

[Neosutra]

So did turtle floor last night and something odd happened, we pulled all ramparts avoiding gear train as normal with thf sac pull, well we start fighting in the first room as normal and out of no where the gear train comes in kills me like I had aggro somehow but I didn't see them at all before that and had been 2~5 minutes after we started killing ramparts. Then it leaves w/o linking to any of the ramparts or aggroing anyone else. So I am trying to figure out wtf happened for the record was on sam/war so no magic aggro. Is it glitched maybe?

If the rampart you were fighting was close enough to the gear room for them to link, they will all link to that rampart and attack the one person that had primary hate on the rampart, then continue back on their path.

[Shassira]

So did turtle floor last night and something odd happened, we pulled all ramparts avoiding gear train as normal with thf sac pull, well we start fighting in the first room as normal and out of no where the gear train comes in kills me like I had aggro somehow but I didn't see them at all before that and had been 2~5 minutes after we started killing ramparts. Then it leaves w/o linking to any of the ramparts or aggroing anyone else. So I am trying to figure out wtf happened for the record was on sam/war so no magic aggro. Is it glitched maybe?

This has happened to me before, in fact, at least three times. I relate this to other hate bugs you can find in other instances. In general, I believe this is just a bug in the hate system which I can see most of the time on pet jobs but it's likely found on other jobs. I also believe it's related to the use of JAs. Let me explain the two most common cases i've found:

First is doing this pull in SS. My group takes six people to SS and I go as BST/WAR because we use it for LAC (it's a fun way of doing it!). Normaly our thf would sac pull the room then I, as well as others, would pull a door each. I normaly would use provoke and inmediately snarl. I've noticed that when doing this there is a slight chance that the gear train later comes back to me as if I had done anything on it. This doesn't happen all the time, seems somewhat random, likely based on proximity or who knows what. So after this i've just been using provoke and keeping my distance, obviously.

Second case, which i have seen repeated many many many times is when doing mob trains. Back before smn burn was popular and my group was experimenting on how to pull, we were using a job without enfeebling (didn't hve access to one) to pull the mobs. To keep such job alive, i would just stay in party with it as SMN and would phalanxga now and then.
If you try it out normaly, you will see that doing AoE enhancing pacts will draw no hate to you from someone that has a couple links hitting her. Releasing the avatar will draw no hate either since the mobs are just links which you haven't touched. It's easy to reproduce.
The problem was that, at some points when the mob train was getting seriously big, rules would randomly change: releaseing an avatar would actualy draw hate on you from a random number of mobs on the train. Sometimes it was none, one, sometimes more, it was never all.

My personal theory was at first that the system was messing up with snarl and release because both abilities are related to enmity reduction (release is supossed to reduce your enmity by -10 according to Kaeko). Now that shouldn't normaly mean anything, but I figured maybe a bug was adding you to the hate list of such monsters somehow.

I've observed this problem with other jobs sometimes, also in SS's door room, and I've debunked this theory for a more general "this is buggy" one.
Just as a final note, and i'm aware this could be actualy something intended, the imps at Powderkeg's room present a random aggro pattern like this too. Once you link an imp to a fomor, sometimes the imp will switch target instead of just following the original linker. Seen this quite a number of times to know that it happens, i'm just not sure I can see a pattern on how.