Salvage - Arrapago Remnants - thread 2

[mdkuser]

the shrooms drop heads too if you didn't get much on 1f. And MND!

[Shassira]

I see no reason to waste a slot on a BLM in arrapago, i'd much rather bring a blu. With 5 or 6 people, cells should be no problem and time should be enough to hit every NM and boss, assuming no big mistakes. With a blu you don't need anyone else to look for blizzaga or perdition as the blu can check on both, even if back to back (please, load temporal shift and head butt at least <.<). This leaves your mnk free to WS as she pleases.

If you have no blu available, then just trust your melee with the job. Make one always stun only perdition and the other stun both -ga and perdition. Always take a minute to farm the three gears in the room (or less if that is enough) as they drop SJ and leg pieces, pretty valuable for this. You don't need two tanks, just people paying attention and I guess some practice.

For reference, our usual group here is: MNK, THF, BLU, RDM, BRD. Last can be anything or nothing, depending on the day. (We do bosses with mnk and thf as tanks often)

[mdkuser]

Pb is that you need 2 stunners kinda. I've seen shoulder tackle or tachi: hobaku miss on perdition. I've never seen two stunn WS miss though. So we generally eat blizzaga with barblizzard up and only focus on perdition. If you have 2 monks, have them merit formless strike and its a cake NM.

[Darkhelmet]

People stress over that NM bhoot too much :D

BLM isn't a waste in any salvage as long as you have your other roles filled. We typically go with 7, and a lone BLM in the 2nd party works perfectly since BLMs don't need BRD buffs, erasing, curagas, etc. I wouldn't, however, bring a BLM with only 6. I always prefer to have the 2 DD, THF, WHM, RDM, BRD in the main party.

Starting the QQA and QQTH fights off with a Freeze II or Burst II speeds things up pretty well. Being able to stay out of AoE range, and having a high damage output for very low mob TP gain also make them handy for boss fights.

[Raelz]

People stress over that NM bhoot too much :D

BLM isn't a waste in any salvage as long as you have your other roles filled. We typically go with 7, and a lone BLM in the 2nd party works perfectly since BLMs don't need BRD buffs, erasing, curagas, etc. I wouldn't, however, bring a BLM with only 6. I always prefer to have the 2 DD, THF, WHM, RDM, BRD in the main party.

Starting the QQA and QQTH fights off with a Freeze II or Burst II speeds things up pretty well. Being able to stay out of AoE range, and having a high damage output for very low mob TP gain also make them handy for boss fights.

I think you're right, but on the whole a BLM stun seems to land with greater frequency and accuracy than BLU or WS-based stuns. I mean, I'm sure a very well-equipped BLU or accuracy-laden DD should have no problem (I don't, normally), but I'd rather maximize my chances at success.

That Bhoot can either be a deuchegrenade, or a simple ghost fight. Anyone who's done it has seen it wipe the team after ripping the tanks apart. It's really about timing and trying to maximize your chances at victory with that guy.

[Valyana]

If you have 2 monks, have them merit formless strike and its a cake NM.

Or toss Banish 3 on it every 90 sec if you have WHM, Banish 2 every 60 sec otherwise.

[Sifer]

does anyone here know the drop rate from gears and ramparts on 4th floor from experience? I've been wondering if I could use them to reduce the time we take to kill 4th-5th floor NMs (and possibly not farm any gears on 5th floor).

EDIT: mainly interested in subjobs and gear cells.

[Sifer]

ok, just to make things clearer. my group usually kills the QQTH and deviate bhoot then ports up. on 5th floor we just kill the gears blocking our way, pop the NMs, kill the QQA, then the chariot. after that we farm some gear to help us pop 6th floor QQTHs (we get really few SJs using this strat).

What I'm asking here is would it be worth it if we farm the lower level gears on 4th floor to have the armor and subjobs unlocked alittle earlier in the run?

thanks in advance

[Killkenny]

If currently you are able to kill everything why would you farm more mobs to get cells that drop on the next floor and have to be killed due to the fact they block the path.

[Dremir]

you have to dispel/steal the QQ ( astrolger for DUPLI and TH for Cumulus) at floor 2-3-4 to get other important cells

[Sifer]

If currently you are able to kill everything why would you farm more mobs to get cells that drop on the next floor and have to be killed due to the fact they block the path.

atm we have a few new members and we have to skip a few NMs to fight the boss so, I wondered if having the gear earlier would help. besides that if ramparts reinforcements droped cells in sets of 3 like mandragoras and treants then it might be better to farm those than other mobs that have low drop rates in this zone.

Thanks for the input anyway.

[ringthree]

ok, just to make things clearer. my group usually kills the QQTH and deviate bhoot then ports up. on 5th floor we just kill the gears blocking our way, pop the NMs, kill the QQA, then the chariot. after that we farm some gear to help us pop 6th floor QQTHs (we get really few SJs using this strat).

What I'm asking here is would it be worth it if we farm the lower level gears on 4th floor to have the armor and subjobs unlocked alittle earlier in the run?

thanks in advance

Yes, not only for the subjobs but the ramparts on the fourth floor drop hands which is good if you have TH4.

The subjob and legs help with Bhoot and Soulflayer a whole lot.

[ringthree]

If currently you are able to kill everything why would you farm more mobs to get cells that drop on the next floor and have to be killed due to the fact they block the path.

Why should people sub DRK for NIN instead of WAR?

Just because something works doesn't mean you can't improve it.

And honestly for Salvage you should do what is best for your group and what they can handle. I would suggest that my group is pretty good at Salvage, and we could do Bhoot and Soulflayer without subs or legs, but we choose to decrease the risks involved and be more prepared for fights, than just running on luck. This is especially true considering the TP moves that both of them can do.

[Neosutra]

atm we have a few new members and we have to skip a few NMs to fight the boss so, I wondered if having the gear earlier would help. besides that if ramparts reinforcements droped cells in sets of 3 like mandragoras and treants then it might be better to farm those than other mobs that have low drop rates in this zone.

Thanks for the input anyway.

What is your setup?

Arrapoga is a zone that you should be able to full clear all NMs and boss with 10-30 minutes to spare >.> (29 minutes to spare being our record with 8 people after a full clear).

[Uzor]

I would suggest that my group is pretty good at Salvage, and we could do Bhoot and Soulflayer without subs or legs, but we choose to decrease the risks involved and be more prepared for fights, than just running on luck. This is especially true considering the TP moves that both of them can do.

I agree. imo there's not really a point to do it without legs or sub. There's always a sub in the start chest, and as you say, it makes it more safe. Just because you CAN doesn't mean you SHOULD. While the NM's themselves are easy, there's no reason to take an unnecessary risk. Some day a mistake might happen that cause you to lose unnecessary time or even wipe.

Sure, SJ's and legs drop later, but you don't lose enough time farming a SJ/leg or two to potentially screw up the run time wise.

If you can kill everything in Salvage with time left, there's other ways of improving the runs other then skip mobs. Sure, you might end up skipping mobs later, but there's no need to take unnecessary risks to speed up the runs.

[Sifer]

What is your setup?

Arrapoga is a zone that you should be able to full clear all NMs and boss with 10-30 minutes to spare >.> (29 minutes to spare being our record with 8 people after a full clear).

WHM
RDM
BRD
MNK
WAR
THF

BLM
RDM
DRK

like i said some of our members are new (including the puller) so things are a bit slow atm. Mind to explain what mobs you farm in your runs?

Thanks for the input Ringthree and Uzor.

[Darkhelmet]

There are 6 or 7 gears on the 4th floor that drop legs, sub, and magic. These cells should rarely be a problem to get before you fight either 4th floor NM.

[Killkenny]

I don't understand how legs/feet slot going to make any difference except in kill speed, if you are really trying to find something then getting tp faster to have stun WS ready again.

I can see the need for 1 SJ but as you already get one in chest and likely another from f2 rat.

Flayer isn't dangerous at all if your mages rebuff fast and bhoot can be a pain but more often than not he goes down easier than flayer.

Based on Sifer's post it looks like he is asking whether getting legs/feet and SJ on bhoot/flayer floor will speed up the run overall, which if you aren't killing bhoot/flayer (I would expect these are most groups lowest priority targets as both drops are mediocore and generally only used to complete sets) it won't do as you get them immediately after you zone up anyway from mobs you have to kill as they are in the way. If you are killing bhoot/flayer all it does is give a little more buffer against tp moves and bad spells.

[Neosutra]

First, to Killkenny above: They were talking more about SJ potentially saving you more time than legs. Legs cells just drop off the same mobs, so they were included. And an ectosmash w/o SJ on just about any job = death. Add that to perdition and the general fact that the bhoot hits pretty fucking hard makes it really silly to not spend 3 minutes farming SJ.

My group zones up and cleared the 5 gears in about 2-3 minutes, netting us usually 2-3 SJs and legs and making the bhoot/flayer infintely more easy (just becomes a matter of stunning perdition then).

WHM
RDM
BRD
MNK
WAR
THF

BLM
RDM
DRK

like i said some of our members are new (including the puller) so things are a bit slow atm. Mind to explain what mobs you farm in your runs?

Thanks for the input Ringthree and Uzor.

As for you, that's alot of people for AR tbh. I wouldnt go with more than 8, especially that many melees that need weapons.

However if you cant limit your people: Swap the thf and the drk (centralize your damage), and the whm for another brd (if you can).

Farm the first wing when you enter for weapons/ja/ma/mp, then head to the NE or SE wing and clear that wing for ma/ja/hp/back (farm NE if you still need magic but are good on ja, farm SE if you need both).

Zone up SE or NE wing (with your group, should be able to zone up by the 25 or 30 min mark at most.

Clear the 2 lamia in the room and a skele or 2 if you still need hp, then hit the QQA.

Steal a SJ from QQA.

Zone up, and move to the south or north most room and kill the 2 lamia/ghosts/flayers there for rings/ja/ma (if you even need any more ja/ma). Then store tp and move to the QQTH room.

Open with a nuke then DoT and everyone move to the wall that is closest to the room on the other side. The QQTH will run away, then come back to you. Kill it each time it comes back.

Zone up to the 4th floor and head to the gear room, pull and kill the 3 gears in this room and the 3 gears in the other room. By now at least your healer (if just a rdm) should have SJ and at least one tank.

Buff up and pull the bhoost/flayer. If you have a stun, focus on perdition, if not, store tp for shoulder tackle or another method.

Kill bhoot, then head over and kill the QQTH..

Zone up and start killing the gears in the first room while one person heads to the portal to pop the QQA and chariot. Kill QQA when it pops, then head to chariot and kill it. Store tp at the end and SV songs.

Zone up once SV songs are up and have your puller start pulling like mad. Rdm/blm should be focusing on sleeping links ONTOP of melee, and other healers should be keeping melees erased of gravity. Always have 1-2 gears waiting and use 2 hours on this floor to clear it in < 7 minutes. Kill the QQTHs once they pop, then zone up and finish boss.

There are several variations to this you can add as you get comfortable (kill the first floor rampart for TH hands, kill other rampart pets for str, etc etc). But you can get the jist from this. Less is typically more in AR, dont bring so many people if you can help it.

[Sifer]

First, to Killkenny above: They were talking more about SJ potentially saving you more time than legs. Legs cells just drop off the same mobs, so they were included. And an ectosmash w/o SJ on just about any job = death. Add that to perdition and the general fact that the bhoot hits pretty fucking hard makes it really silly to not spend 3 minutes farming SJ.

My group zones up and cleared the 5 gears in about 2-3 minutes, netting us usually 2-3 SJs and legs and making the bhoot/flayer infintely more easy (just becomes a matter of stunning perdition then).



As for you, that's alot of people for AR tbh. I wouldnt go with more than 8, especially that many melees that need weapons.

However if you cant limit your people: Swap the thf and the drk (centralize your damage), and the whm for another brd (if you can).

Farm the first wing when you enter for weapons/ja/ma/mp, then head to the NE or SE wing and clear that wing for ma/ja/hp/back (farm NE if you still need magic but are good on ja, farm SE if you need both).

Zone up SE or NE wing (with your group, should be able to zone up by the 25 or 30 min mark at most.

Clear the 2 lamia in the room and a skele or 2 if you still need hp, then hit the QQA.

Steal a SJ from QQA.

Zone up, and move to the south or north most room and kill the 2 lamia/ghosts/flayers there for rings/ja/ma (if you even need any more ja/ma). Then store tp and move to the QQTH room.

Open with a nuke then DoT and everyone move to the wall that is closest to the room on the other side. The QQTH will run away, then come back to you. Kill it each time it comes back.

Zone up to the 4th floor and head to the gear room, pull and kill the 3 gears in this room and the 3 gears in the other room. By now at least your healer (if just a rdm) should have SJ and at least one tank.

Buff up and pull the bhoost/flayer. If you have a stun, focus on perdition, if not, store tp for shoulder tackle or another method.

Kill bhoot, then head over and kill the QQTH..

Zone up and start killing the gears in the first room while one person heads to the portal to pop the QQA and chariot. Kill QQA when it pops, then head to chariot and kill it. Store tp at the end and SV songs.

Zone up once SV songs are up and have your puller start pulling like mad. Rdm/blm should be focusing on sleeping links ONTOP of melee, and other healers should be keeping melees erased of gravity. Always have 1-2 gears waiting and use 2 hours on this floor to clear it in < 7 minutes. Kill the QQTHs once they pop, then zone up and finish boss.

There are several variations to this you can add as you get comfortable (kill the first floor rampart for TH hands, kill other rampart pets for str, etc etc). But you can get the jist from this. Less is typically more in AR, dont bring so many people if you can help it.

This is basically what I've been thinking if doing. thanks for the info