Absolute Virtue Theory

[Yutuyu]

I've always wondered if maybe he "reflects" elements. For example he can't use moves which're light elemental unless someone uses a light-elemental type move on him. What he can and can't do is locked based on what is done to him?

I know Meteor is non-elemental (as is comet) but so are melee attacks. Someone mentioned that around 79% he starts spamming meteor, so maybe you're not supposed to melee him in that 20% phase.

This would be extremely easy to test by just having a PLD hold him with flash at start and wait until he does something that isn't light-based.

[Hapernack]

Ok probably a stupid idea just throwing it out there...

Anyone ever thought maybe his 2hrs are triggered by us?

I mean look at the Mamool Boss. His deadliest ability is triggered/spammed by something we can control.

Maybe doing anything WS or Spell-wise outside of a proper skillchain>>MB on the right element of day triggers 2hrs?

We'll try this next time... probably really dumb but at the least we'll get a laugh out of it.

kthxforreadingbai

[Demosthenes11]

there is no getting lucky. He either uses magic, or he doesn't.

Wouldn't it be considered lucky if he doesn't? Kind of contradicting yourself I think.

I mean you do something to trigger locked magic. He said that feather could have "gotten lucky" with spells, but there really is no lucky with them.

[Wulfgang]

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z...F/img_0243.png

Must have forgotten to equip my Fortitude Axe and Temperance Torque.

[riddaraan]

That's a pretty discouraging number there Wulf. What job/level were you on that?

Ninja editted out a question after re-reading the log.

[Wulfgang]

75 WAR/THF from a JoL ages ago, now we just melee / SMN burn it. Point was that while maybe 1-2 people will survive the meteor if they're lucky to have 2k+ HP, you can see in the log that he's already casting it again. The jailer weapon / ebon panel / etc strategies are amusing and all; but it's tough to test anything outside the box like that when you're eating 6k meteors.

[Kaylia]

I got hit for 5700 dmg on BLM no buff solo, probably because of high int. I forgot what's the damage reduction formula for AoE spell, but I doubt you could bring meteor down to something you could survive

[riddaraan]

Well, in some screenshots I've seen, the average damage people take sits around 2600. I ate a Meteor back when LimitBreak LS, on Odin, got AV down to 50% in 36 hours. At that point, I think it was the second lowest anyone had gotten it, and I was there raising people. I don't think I still have any screenshots or I'd take a look at them.

[Aldaris]

I've always wondered if maybe he "reflects" elements. For example he can't use moves which're light elemental unless someone uses a light-elemental type move on him. What he can and can't do is locked based on what is done to him?

I know Meteor is non-elemental (as is comet) but so are melee attacks. Someone mentioned that around 79% he starts spamming meteor, so maybe you're not supposed to melee him in that 20% phase.

This would be extremely easy to test by just having a PLD hold him with flash at start and wait until he does something that isn't light-based.

Correct on Meteor (Elemant - Special)(Skill - Elemental Magic) but Comet is (Element - Dark) ( Skill - Dark Magic)

[Kaylia]

Well, in some screenshots I've seen, the average damage people take sits around 2600. I ate a Meteor back when LimitBreak LS, on Odin, got AV down to 50% in 36 hours. At that point, I think it was the second lowest anyone had gotten it, and I was there raising people. I don't think I still have any screenshots or I'd take a look at them.

Average meteor when it hit over 10 peoples will be 2600. However, I dont see how it is possible to tank it like that. Even if you tank survive, you still have a bunch of people to raise

[riddaraan]

A formula was mentioned above which talked about calculating AoE damage, and how it reduced for more people included. Perhaps someone could post what that formula is?

[Demosthenes11]

A formula was mentioned above which talked about calculating AoE damage, and how it reduced for more people included. Perhaps someone could post what that formula is?

Won't mean shit because it likely caps at a certain amount aka like 30 people, and even then it would still do like 1500+...meaning only tanks would survive. You can't kill AV when he spams magic

[Kaylia]

Multiple-Target Damage Reduction
single-target spells = 1.0
-ga spells with one target = 1.0
-ga spells with 2 through 9 targets = 0.9 - 0.05T where T is the number of targets
-ga spells with 10 or more targets = 0.4

That's around 2400 damage on 10 people. With shell, barspell and the some magic damage reduction gears, you can bring it to something you would survive, but I don't see the group being able to eat more than 2 meteor.

..not to mention AV isn't inactive in between.

[riddaraan]

I'm just concerned with how many tanks it would take to squeeze into AoE radius as to reduce the damage so that they would live. Everyone else... we'll worry about that later.

After adjusting for 6000 damage, in order to reduce the damage to about 2600, which is the survivable limit needed to have Shell & other magic damage reduction gear/spells/rolls take into play and leave an acceptable amount of HP afterwards, I'm guessing that, as stated above, 10 is the minimum number of people that need to get hit. Is my math right?

2600 = 6000*(0.9 - 0.05T)
0.4333 = 0.9 - 0.05T
0.4666 = 0.05T
9.333 = T

LOL

Oh, you did the math for me. Well ... I'm taking baby steps into the school of thought of just trying to survive bits & pieces. Once understanding how to control each aspect is possible, then I can start figuring out how to put it all together.

And, really, this is all just to hold it so people can test stuff.

[Wulfgang]

During Manafront and CS it's constant Meteor casts, everyone would die even with 20 WHMs just somehow out of range.

[Kaylia]

I'm just concerned with how many tanks it would take to squeeze into AoE radius as to reduce the damage so that they would live. Everyone else... we'll worry about that later.

After adjusting for 6000 damage, in order to reduce the damage to about 2600, which is the survivable limit needed to have Shell & other magic damage reduction gear/spells/rolls take into play and leave an acceptable amount of HP afterwards, I'm guessing that, as stated above, 10 is the minimum number of people that need to get hit. Is my math right?

2600 = 6000*(0.9 - 0.05T)
0.4333 = 0.9 - 0.05T
0.4666 = 0.05T
9.333 = T

LOL

Oh, you did the math for me. Well ... I'm taking baby steps into the school of thought of just trying to survive bits & pieces. Once understanding how to control each aspect is possible, then I can start figuring out how to put it all together.

And, really, this is all just to hold it so people can test stuff.

Like I said above, there is a difference between having a single person get hit for 2400damages (Ultima), and 10 people getting hit for that much. There is no chance in hell your healer survive unless they get a lucky resist, and you will have a ton of melee other DD get hit as well, since meteor is fast and AoE range is huge.

After landing that spell, AV is probably going to double attack your tank for an additional 600dmg, and there wont be anyone left alive but both tank. You just can't control that aspect of the fight.

[Hapernack]

Even if you survive a meteor by pure freakin luck, I don't think I've ever seen AV just use it once. He'll be spamming it like Faust does his spinning move. The issue isn't getting tanks to survive 1 (you'll survive 1 but you'll never survive 2 no matter how awesome you are), its getting the spam to stop. Unless of course you can figure out a way to eat unlimited Meteors every 1.5 seconds for infinite hours.

[riddaraan]

Well, the only time I saw him use Meteor back on that fateful day was when he activated Chainspell. I couldn't help but acknowledge the genious nature of SE, in regards to their NM, which seemed to tie together the most perfect 2-hours. For example, as stated above, I saw him Manafont, then Chainspell Meteor. Then after I got back up, he decided to go ahead & Mighty Strikes, Blood Weapon, and then finale with Hundred Fists.

It was a thing of beauty. Sheer terror and beauty.

[Khamsin]

Even if you survive a meteor by pure freakin luck, I don't think I've ever seen AV just use it once. He'll be spamming it like Faust does his spinning move. The issue isn't getting tanks to survive 1 (you'll survive 1 but you'll never survive 2 no matter how awesome you are), its getting the spam to stop. Unless of course you can figure out a way to eat unlimited Meteors every 1.5 seconds for infinite hours.

I was always under the impression that he'd only spam Meteor just for the duration of Chainspell, not continually for infinite hours.

[BRP]

Things I think need to be tested(just tested, not going for the win) :

-Killing tons of Aerns near AV. (maybe a good idea to note what jobs)
-Killing tons of everything near AV. (maybe a good idea to note what monsters)
-Having Torque + Weapon equiped. WS may be required. (The more people with different combos the better, as it might not use the 2hr to prove or disprove. BLM(Prudence) and RDM(Justice) would be nice to test)

These would be pretty easy to test in my opinion. If these get proven wrong, we would know more than we did before and dispel some of the more likely theories. From there crazier ones can be tested. Most importantly: PICTURES DAMN IT.