Whats better?

[Cream Soda]

Soboro or other GKT at 60?

Couse

[el_tio]

Mandalic Stab, definitely Cuch. Attack does little-nothing for that WS. Shark Bite, most of the time Cuchulain will do more though not always.

I thought Mandalic Stab had a 1 and 2/3rds multiplier for attack on it? Hence attack would be even better.

[Raen Ryong]

That plus critical bonus since you'd only use it with SA and TA means you'll be capped or dangerously close to

[Marcicus]

Mirage Shalwar vs Magus Shalwar for Cannonball?

Magus has 2 more defense over Mirage; Magus has +3 VIT and Mirage has +3 STR.

[ad3285]

Mirage Shalwar vs Magus Shalwar for Cannonball?

Magus has 2 more defense over Mirage; Magus has +3 VIT and Mirage has +3 STR.

I would go for Magus to save a slot for me.
Currently using Magus legs for TP.

[Suiram]

You mean you're currently using Mirage for TP?

[Marcicus]

I am cause I don't have Homam yet. But yeah, I'm trying to figure out after I hit 60+ish strength if I should focus on vitality or keep piling strength. With Magus Shalwar I have +63 str and +38(?) vit with food on.

[Rocl]

You mean you're currently using Mirage for TP?

I really hope that's what he means >_>

[lolwut]

For drk and war:

I enjoy aurum feet for the inventory+1 between the two jobs, but how do aurum stack up against homam / dusk +1 /unicorn? Better, equal? Or am I gimping myself?

I don't do kings, what's the next best ws option after n.head for multihits? I'm assuming turtle kabuto for sc, what about the rest of the ga/scythe/gs ws?

I also want to move on from my lolsubduer, what's the best Drk gsword : Naglering / Algol ? Are they close enough that you can do either one and be fine?

[Callisto]

Homam pretty much blows away the other 2 options for DRK, if you own them you should be using them. Aurum should slightly outperform Dusk+1 for WAR unless your accuracy is pretty much capped, I would think both would rate over Unicorn just for being full time bonuses and not HP-dependant.

For headgear I'm not 100% sure, there's always Optical Hat if focusing mainly on Acc, but there's also Askar and that newer Orc SCNM one.

For GSword, Naglering is the hotness.

[ubermonkey]

Drk AF +1 head isn't bad if you have acc elsewhere. Ares mask is ohat +2. I use ohat currently for guillo, I'd use ares mask if I had it.

[lolwut]

>>Homam pretty much blows away the other 2 options for DRK, if you own them you should be using them.<<

I don't own them yet, I've been prioritizing my mage items over dd stuff in Limbus.

Someone told me the same thing yesterday in exp, but I'm not sure why they them away?

6 acc 3 haste vs 3 dex 5 acc 5 atk 2 haste

Since it's two hand the dex adds another 2ish acc, so balancing out we get

1 haste vs 3 dex 1 acc 5 atk

Does the 1 haste always add that much value?

I was reading through the thread while waiting for responses and found:

"pound for pound, melee stats are equivalent in about these ways (note to real theorists; this is a really rough estimate guide so fewer 'obvious questions' are asked, not meant to be exhaustive) at level 75. excluding haste.

1 EP = 1% TA = 2% DA = 4 acc = 6 attack = 6 str = 6 dex(tp mode only)

store TP and haste are harder; so here's an easier rule for haste: 1 haste is about as good as 2 acc if you aren't getting much haste; if you have merit party haste levels, it's about as good as 3 acc."

From that we'd get roughly 1 haste = 5 atk 1 acc, plus the extra dex on top? Or was the simplified formula inaccurate?

Not trying to be argumentative, just trying to get a better grasp of the mechanics so I can make better gear choices in the future.

[Raen Ryong]

Well, the DEX listed there is assuming you get accuracy from it too; the critical hit rate increase from it is generally negligable, and 1acc is less than 1haste in terms of power most of the time. 5atk only consolidates existing hits (and on drk, attack is VERY high anyway), whereas haste creates more hits for more TP for more WSs etc etc.

I wouldn't say they "blow them out of the water", but I would say Homam Gambieras are the better choice. Aurum Sabatons are easily better than Dusk Feet +1/Unicorn Feet etc though.

[Aux]

I did this math some time ago, weighting Aurum vs Homam for feet slot during TP.

Here's the rundown, quid pro quo

Ok, Just went ahead and did some simple math. This isn't going to calculate what's better, but just rather the difference of 1% haste for a DRK using the following gear set(s):

Example 1:
DRK/non-sam non-drg SJ to make this easier

Tredecim Scythe: Delay 528
Homam G/L/F = 9%
Swift Belt = 4%
Ace's = 4%
Total haste = 17%

To calculate the net delay, I divide the base weapon delay by 60 and then I multiply the haste percentage.
: (Wdelay/60) - [(WDelay/60) * (Haste%)]
Result: 8.8 - 1.496 = 7.304 seconds per swing.

So in 100 Scythe hits, which in a capped accuracy situation, 95 will actually hit, so to get 100 real hits it will be 106 swings.
7.304 * 106 = 774.224 seconds for 100 hits in a capped accuracy situation.
This equates to in modern terms, 12 minutes and ~54 seconds roughly to hit 100(106) times.

Should we take the above calculations and tab down the haste 1% less (16% total haste), changing it to:
8.8 - 1.408 = 7.392 seconds per swing.

100(106) Scythe swings is equivalent to:
7.392 * 106 = 783.552 seconds, thus equaling to 13 minutes and ~3 seconds

So, in the user using the setup above, in 100 actual hits, having 1% haste means that you get to finish to 100 actual hits at 9 seconds quicker with 1% more haste.
Note that this obviously isn't favorable in a merit situation, because you never complete the full hit cycle due to the interferences of merit mechanics.


Example 2
Now if we did this above for someone using Perdu with 17% total haste:
8.35 - 1.4195 = 6.9305 seconds per swing.

100 real hits = 734.633 seconds roughly translating into, 12 minutes, 14 seconds

16% Haste:
8.35 - 1.336 = 7.014 seconds per swing.
100 real hits = 743.484 seconds/equivalent to 12 minutes, 23 seconds


Now with these 4 results we have:
Tredecim, 17% - 12min 54 seconds
Tredecim, 16% - 13min 03 seconds
9 seconds difference
Perdu, 17% - 12min 14 seconds
Perdu, 16% - 12min 23 seconds
9 seconds difference

In these factors we never took into account that Aurum has +5 Attack, which is the answer I'm still trying to find out:
How much will +5 Attack have an impact on 106 swings over another case with 0 attack and 106 swings?

If you ask me, this almost sounds like a fire bomblet vs bomb core argument.

The result? You decide. If you think that extra hit you can get from 1% haste in ~13mins will outdo +5 attack in each of 100 hits/ .01% Critical rate, then choose homam. If you don't, then choose Aurum.

However, Aurum's a great substitute for Guillotine WS material.

[ZhanAsura]

Speaking of Guillo WS feet, Heca or Ares?

[Redshift]

Unicorn Leggings +1 vs Aurum.

[Aurara]

Leggings+1 i'd think
Also, that regen neck from hydra crap, or morgana choker for blm idle?

[Hyriu]

Leggings+1 i'd think
Also, that regen neck from hydra crap, or morgana choker for blm idle?

Choker for... more mp? I'd use the regen neck probably.

[Aurara]

well was wondering if its worth the 125k for the neck

[Maaglin]

I also want to move on from my lolsubduer, what's the best Drk gsword : Naglering / Algol ? Are they close enough that you can do either one and be fine?

Generally my opinion of GS has been lolGS. However, with the addition of Naglering, I'm re-thinking that.

With Raja's, Brutal, /SAM, and Carbonara, you can keep a 6 hit build with Naglering. Subduer can't do that. Algol barely can.

The +20 ATK on it also helps make up the difference from not being able to eat something like hedgehog pie or bison steak (both give +90 atk). You get 65 atk (and +4 STR) from carbonara + 20 on the GS = 85atk.

The biggest problem will be the loss of base accuracy going from scythe to GS. For me I'm going from 297 scythe skill, to 269 GS skill; so about a 21 acc loss (considering the +4 from Naglering).

That's not a huge deal, but consider that you aren't capped at any camp (although you can get close) w/o madrigal or sushi, and it does hurt a little bit.

The real catch in my mind is that spamming carbonara isn't really feasible for most at bird camp so you'll want to use this build at mamools however they have a higher acc cap so you'll feel that loss a little bit more. You could adjust your tp build and use atillia's earring and chiv chain so you don't have to use carbonara and could spam kabobs at birds. Not sure at that point if it's worth the tradeoff.

Overall you're going to probably perfrom worse than just using scythe. But I don't think it'll be terribly gimp either. Bascially, Naglering gives you something to use on drk for a change of pace that isn't horrible.