Public opinion: Is dynamis too expensive?

[darkamulet]

Maybe not lower the cost of the glass, but add some kinda ra/ex item that drops off the boss of the zone. After you collect a few you trade them to a trail marking and it functions as a glass? Say 4-6 of them and you get a free glass? Prevents the small groups that snipe zones on weekends during primetime (ya i'm talking to you guys that shafted shells 3 saturdays in a row!) from taking advantage of them?

[LD]

The only point I'm trying to make is if you can really walk out with that much, what's 200k or so less on the bill? Will that really flood the market any more than it already is? The only reason I sold all my currency was because I was lucky enough to see someone shouting for them. LSs generally (or at least mostly) just make their own.

[Spider-Dan]

I find it amazing that so many people have used the logic of, "well if glass cost is halved, then it'll be easier to pay for dynamis with currency drops."

Hello, basic economics?

Halve the cost of glasses and you will drive down the price of all currency (or, to be more precise, accelerate it). Any solution that mates current currency prices with decreased glass costs is fundamentally and irrevocably broken. Such a "fix" only works as long as you don't look more than 5 minutes into the future.

[Eaglestrike]

CoP Dynamis boss = 1 100 currency drop 100%, another 100 currency drop 25%. I fixed CoP Dynamis, yay.

Exactly how many times have you done CoP Dynamis? Just out of curiosity.

Once,

I can't convince anyone to go again.

OK, as someone who has done a fair amount of CoP Dynamis, it would take a LOT more than a single hundred piece to make it not a waste of gil.

When I've gone we've normally gotten 50-70 coins and 3-15 pieces of -1 or gear, +100 coins on top of that would pretty much make it "worth it", imo.

[Yutuyu]

My Dynamis LS has been around for about 16 months now and we've never had to make members pay for an hourglass. When we started 100 piece drops during free-runs (days no one would sponsor) were enough to pay for everything, but that was before we started doing Northlands/CoP and the deflation.

Recently the bank is getting strained, though. The linkshell has started to sponsor runs every now and then to refill the coffers. The city runs are perfectly priced, we pull off 300ish currency every city run pretty much without any difficulty. It's the Northlands/CoP runs that suck us dry. You can pretty much break even on Beauc without any difficulty though, the real problem is Xarc/CoP, especially when we make an attemp at the Dynamis Lord.

The worst is when you do a CoP run, gunning for the boss, and fail to beat him. Then you get an hour of sac pulls, clearing a couple of mobs here and there, and killing NMs, only to wipe after using a bunch of meds.

At the same time, I don't think lowering the hourglass fee is really the way to fix this problem. With how easy it really is to get at least an hour worth of ToDs in Xarc, it wouldn't be hard at all for a small group to tie up the zone for awhile. And Xarc is as hard as it gets for farming. We've already had problems with small groups tying up zones before, a lowered fee would only make it worse (and they've disappeared now that the deflation occured).

The solution to the problem is really quite simple.

Xarc: Deal with the fee. The drops there are almost all incredibly awesome, if not stat-wise, visually or simply for the sake of accomplishment. It won't kill you to pay to attend a Xarcabard run 1-2 times a month. Like others have said, 1 city run will pay for 1-2 Northlands runs in a month, you shouldn't have any trouble financing this.

CoP: Use a different item which costs less or up droprates to something much higher. Maybe give a guaranteed 100 piece drop on the boss completion or something?



In short: The only thing that's really SUPER broken is the CoP-Dynamises, but everyone knows that.

That and up the drop rate in Beaucedine. What the hell, I mean really.

[orson]

Well despite the nay sayers the obvious consensus is that Dynamis needs to be changed because people aren't overly happy with it at the moment. Obviously it's a small sample but the majority people seem to want to see some change to dynamis.

[alph]

lurker here

This thread is funny to me because some of the people making such good points go on to say some really stupid things.

Talk about foresight all you want but when you don't consider the fact that most 'top tier' players are playing on borrowed time then you're just as shortsighted as the people you ridicule. If this game shuts out newer players from evolving into higher roles then it's nailing it's own coffin. Whether these players just bought the game yesterday or have had it since release and didn't want to join dynamis/kings/sky/whatever until today doesn't matter.

We either promote grow or we promote deterioration. If the game is locked down into an elitist diagram using the most successful situations as the normal measuring bar then guess what... I hope you like deleted data cause that's where all your efforts and elitism will get you. Sometimes I think certain members of this board would rather see FFXI choked to death than allow others to enjoy the same activities that they once did to extend the game's lifespan.

Not everyone is a professional FFXI player, infact most aren't... deal with it. Just because we strive for perfection and have more time to play XI doesn't mean people who don't should be left out of everything except exp grinding. It's a _game_, maybe you need to relearn what that word means.


P.S.- BRP, you are the cancer that is killing the site, stop it. Remember the rules(1&2) or moot will eat your genitals.

[Septimus]

lurker here

This thread is funny to me because some of the people making such good points go on to say some really stupid things.

Talk about foresight all you want but when you don't consider the fact that most 'top tier' players are playing on borrowed time then you're just as shortsighted as the people you ridicule. If this game shuts out newer players from evolving into higher roles then it's nailing it's own coffin. Whether these players just bought the game yesterday or have had it since release and didn't want to join dynamis/kings/sky/whatever until today doesn't matter.

We either promote grow or we promote deterioration. If the game is locked down into an elitist diagram using the most successful situations as the normal measuring bar then guess what... I hope you like deleted data cause that's where all your efforts and elitism will get you. Sometimes I think certain members of this board would rather see FFXI choked to death than allow others to enjoy the same activities that they once did to extend the game's lifespan.

Not everyone is a professional FFXI player, infact most aren't... deal with it. Just because we strive for perfection and have more time to play XI doesn't mean people who don't should be left out of everything except exp grinding. It's a _game_, maybe you need to relearn what that word means.


P.S.- BRP, you are the cancer that is killing the site, stop it. Remember the rules(1&2) or moot will eat your genitals.

I like this guy.

[Sendra]

I think Dynamis is fine. The shell I do Dynamis with goes twice a week, and whores out three-four cities per month for cash. Dynamis entry is free, and the LS fund pays for and recieves all currency from each run. So no, we can't do Northlands/CoP every single run and make a profit, but I think that provides the balance in the amount of gear recieved that SE was originally looking for through difficulty.

Maybe I'm ignorant to exactly how well our LS funds are doing, though.

[Afrohatch]

Hey, if SE doesn't lower glass cost, less shells will be able to do dynamis, thus lowering the amount of zones taken, and ultimately eliminating the need to instance zones! Win-win!

[Not Kuno]

lurker here

This thread is funny to me because some of the people making such good points go on to say some really stupid things.

Talk about foresight all you want but when you don't consider the fact that most 'top tier' players are playing on borrowed time then you're just as shortsighted as the people you ridicule. If this game shuts out newer players from evolving into higher roles then it's nailing it's own coffin. Whether these players just bought the game yesterday or have had it since release and didn't want to join dynamis/kings/sky/whatever until today doesn't matter.

We either promote grow or we promote deterioration. If the game is locked down into an elitist diagram using the most successful situations as the normal measuring bar then guess what... I hope you like deleted data cause that's where all your efforts and elitism will get you. Sometimes I think certain members of this board would rather see FFXI choked to death than allow others to enjoy the same activities that they once did to extend the game's lifespan.

Not everyone is a professional FFXI player, infact most aren't... deal with it. Just because we strive for perfection and have more time to play XI doesn't mean people who don't should be left out of everything except exp grinding. It's a _game_, maybe you need to relearn what that word means.


P.S.- BRP, you are the cancer that is killing the site, stop it. Remember the rules(1&2) or moot will eat your genitals.

You win the Kuno award of awesome.

[Demosthenes11]

I find it amazing that so many people have used the logic of, "well if glass cost is halved, then it'll be easier to pay for dynamis with currency drops."

Hello, basic economics?

Halve the cost of glasses and you will drive down the price of all currency (or, to be more precise, accelerate it). Any solution that mates current currency prices with decreased glass costs is fundamentally and irrevocably broken. Such a "fix" only works as long as you don't look more than 5 minutes into the future.

That is only assuming more people do dynamis because of a price drop, which I don't see happening.

[Cadena]

I find it amazing that so many people have used the logic of, "well if glass cost is halved, then it'll be easier to pay for dynamis with currency drops."

Hello, basic economics?

Halve the cost of glasses and you will drive down the price of all currency (or, to be more precise, accelerate it). Any solution that mates current currency prices with decreased glass costs is fundamentally and irrevocably broken. Such a "fix" only works as long as you don't look more than 5 minutes into the future.

That is only assuming more people do dynamis because of a price drop, which I don't see happening.

That's not true.

[Yutuyu]

I find it amazing that so many people have used the logic of, "well if glass cost is halved, then it'll be easier to pay for dynamis with currency drops."

Hello, basic economics?

Halve the cost of glasses and you will drive down the price of all currency (or, to be more precise, accelerate it). Any solution that mates current currency prices with decreased glass costs is fundamentally and irrevocably broken. Such a "fix" only works as long as you don't look more than 5 minutes into the future.

That is only assuming more people do dynamis because of a price drop, which I don't see happening.

That's not true.

It's...not true that he doesn't see it happening?

WHY WEREN'T YOU HONEST WITH US ABOUT YOUR OPINIONS Demosthenes11. And more importantly, how can Cadena see into your psyche

[Cadena]

If the cost of Dynamis is lowered, the price of currency will lower for at least one reason; people would be willing to sell currency quickly at a lower price while still breaking even or profiting.

[BRP]

Talk about foresight all you want but when you don't consider the fact that most 'top tier' players are playing on borrowed time then you're just as shortsighted as the people you ridicule. If this game shuts out newer players from evolving into higher roles then it's nailing it's own coffin. Whether these players just bought the game yesterday or have had it since release and didn't want to join dynamis/kings/sky/whatever until today doesn't matter.

Except I think the points of several people is that new end-game players can still and do Dynamis. Perhaps new shells are blocked by the price, but new players are not. Doing Dynamis is as simple as joining a Dynamis LS or an end-game LS that does Dynamis. Those LSes probably have the resources online to see great routes and strategies. If they are unable to complete those routes then it's more a problem with the LS than the game(as it's easy to farm just about any town with an alliance of 18 and Dynamis has a limit of 64). Even the newest of Sky LSes can run Dynamis if they are willing to part with a few gil from some type of LS bank.

Now concerning new LSes, as said previously, it's a good that the price scares them away. Considering SE has no plans to fix the Dynamis overcrowding situation(aside from adding more areas with CoP), more LSes = more problems. Let's not even get into the fact that it would mean even more "/sh NEW SKY AND DYNAMIS LS - LFM! ^^" and even more retards/scum(the type that would team up for GS) making LSes to take advantages to new players. Despite it all, it's not impossible to make a new LS. You just need a good amount of friends and actual end-game experience(from a previous LS). I think those are quite decent requirements that everyone could live with.

P.S.- BRP, you are the cancer that is killing the site, stop it. Remember the rules(1&2) or moot will eat your genitals.

I'm not breaking rules 1&2. (And Moot will eat genitals anyway)

[Yutuyu]

What you fail to take into account is that lowering the hourglass fee would make CoP Dynamis less ridiculous. This would give the average person a reason to spend money on coins, in order to buy the upgrades to their armor with the AF-1 drops. Thus increasing demand with supply.

Every time the price on coins fall, relic reaches into more people's pricerange, which causes them to BUY coins, and in turn the price is somewhat counterbalanced.

I also think lowering the hourglass fee would result in a higher frequency of zones which give shitty currency, lowering the supply pool that way.

Either way, I don't think worrying about the price of coins is the real problem here, it's the effect it would have on the schedulign system.

[aurik]

What you fail to take into account is that lowering the hourglass fee would make CoP Dynamis less ridiculous. This would give the average person a reason to spend money on coins, in order to buy the upgrades to their armor with the AF-1 drops. Thus increasing demand with supply.

Every time the price on coins fall, relic reaches into more people's pricerange, which causes them to BUY coins, and in turn the price is somewhat counterbalanced.

I also think lowering the hourglass fee would result in a higher frequency of zones which give shitty currency, lowering the supply pool that way.

Either way, I don't think worrying about the price of coins is the real problem here, it's the effect it would have on the schedulign system.

Lower the glass price -> coin price falls -> CoP dynamis would still suck for the return rate.

They either need to give you a refund for doing CoP dynamis, or give you a coupon to do a 2nd one so that you can get 2 CoP dynamis for 1 hourglass, or increase the coin reward in the zone.

[Yutuyu]

Lower the glass price -> coin price falls -> CoP dynamis would still suck for the return rate.

They either need to give you a refund for doing CoP dynamis, or give you a coupon to do a 2nd one so that you can get 2 CoP dynamis for 1 hourglass, or increase the coin reward in the zone.

You would lose less, though. Even if coin price fell 50% with entry price.

Say you get 500k in coins now. 500k loss.

And then they lower to 500k entry, 250k in coins. 250k loss.

The amount of loss goes down hugely. So halving the cost, even with coins depreciating equally, you can still do 2 CoP Dynamises for the same loss as 1 would've been.

[Dammerung]

Why is nobody factoring the AF reward into their prices? Why does Dynamis have to be a self-sustaining activity? It already is, but that's not the point