Battle System Adjustments (08/14/2007)

[Toth]

Actually its not inefficient, especially with the huge MP pool SMN has. You should keep in mind that almost all mage jobs are limited by MP in some way. For example, a BLM can not just nuke nuke nuke, they will run out of MP and will need to rest. What a good SMN does is what any good mage does, and that is to learn how manage their MP pool.

BLMs recover MP faster than SMN (better Clear Mind and Aspir. Conserve MP, etc) and BLUs can chain forever without resting thanks to their smaller MP pool, MP drainkiss and Magic Hammer, auto-refresh trait + refresh spell, and smaller MP costs for their spells (not to mentioned Conserve MP). SMN takes quite a while to refill that huge MP pool with no natural ways to do so w/o resting.

[Beckwin]

....and SMN spends that MP to do hateless, TP-less damage.

Shit comes full-circle alright.

[Nirokun!]

....and SMN spends that MP to do hateless, TP-less damage.

Shit comes full-circle alright.

its not enough

yup, full circle

[Beckwin]

auto refresh and easy to obtain refresh piece?

[Nirokun!]

steal and an assault jerkin, THF IS FUCKING COMPLETE

no, its not enough

[theo]

Guys guys its ok, Ramuh is getting buffed with the 2-handed weapon update cause he uses a staff. SMN IS FIXED YAY! :D

Sorry, I'm just amused by where this thread ended up.

[evilpaul]

auto refresh and easy to obtain refresh piece?

Vermillion Cloak?

It would make little to no difference if BP: Rages gave 150 TP in EXP, which is what we're talking about atm. And, no, you won't be able to sustain MP usage if you're keeping up several Wards, doing Rages, and Curing people without more Refresh sources than a typical party has.

[Kaslo]

Watch the update correspond to the Blue Dragon release in hopes by SE that we will go buy it during the update, of course it will fail cause we will all be hitting the refresh button here to see new equipment ;p

[Remyo]

why is everyone having a shitstorm over some people wanting things for SMN? how greedy of a player to you have to be to only want things for your job and not for other jobs you don't play? Just because people want SMN to be used more is no reason to shit on them about it. You know full well there won't be any game breaking additions (that last it might be bugged on release but it'll be tamed later).

I don't play BST and I'd like to see them get changes, same for drg, and all the other jobs that aren't given as much attention.

[Beckwin]

RDMs don't nuke in merits, why should a SMN BP Rage in the same situation? Auto-Refresh + YYR/Vermy + Sanction Refresh + (insert whatever rdm/cor/brd refresh the party can supply) then do hastega, cure as needed, and sit down to rest when you can. It's not as efficient as rdm or whm healing, but I'd be damned if it couldn't support a few DDs with moderate defenses at colibri camp. PLD isn't as efficient of a DD as MNK or WAR, but you can still get the job done- wait... oh noes, we need to buff pld DD! They're master swordsmen and it's not fair we can't play to that strength at a level comparable to all other DDs! And why does Holy suck so much? Paladins are warriors dedicated to extinguishing undead from the land; and nuking Holy and other Divine spells seems important to the job. Why are they only good at tanking endgame? Ugh ugh so not fair.

[LD]

Watch the update correspond to the Blue Dragon release in hopes by SE that we will go buy it during the update, of course it will fail cause we will all be hitting the refresh button here to see new equipment ;p

That would make sense if Blue Dragon were designed, published, or otherwise controled by SE, and it isn't.

[Remyo]

Ugh ugh so not fair.

just tell me why is it not a good thing to have SMN be just a little better than excelling at a small percentage of things? people don't always have a use for SMN, what would be wrong for them to be well rounded enough so people who lvl it could get use from it? noone shit on PLDs when they added auto refresh and made shield a little better plus the new merits that made them just a bit better.

[Beckwin]

That really doesn't change that paladins only really excel at HNM tanking.

[Remyo]

That really doesn't change that paladins only really excel at HNM tanking.

pld do well in dynamis somewhat. still opens the window for PLDs to request changes to make them a bit better. I'm not envoking that any job get game breaking uber changes just changes to aid the job be a better more well round than just situational things. almost every job has needed a bone thrown to them at some point in the game, so why get pissed about it as long as it doesnt make it worse? hell if it shaves 10 minutes off completing the next event(or w/e) I'm all for it no matter what job gets a change.

[LD]

why is everyone having a shitstorm over some people wanting things for SMN? how greedy of a player to you have to be to only want things for your job and not for other jobs you don't play? Just because people want SMN to be used more is no reason to shit on them about it. You know full well there won't be any game breaking additions (that last it might be bugged on release but it'll be tamed later).

I don't play BST and I'd like to see them get changes, same for drg, and all the other jobs that aren't given as much attention.

SMN, unlike BST, is fine the way it is. BST had their main selling point pretty much stolen from them with the MPK patch, and that has yet to be resolved. SMN had most of their major problems fixed in the Oct. update. This shitstorm was created by SMNs who fail to realize how good they actually have it. Wanna be better at exp? Fine, but don't argue that you somehow deserve it when there are jobs who don't have any advantage anywhere. I'd like for Guard's proc rate to be vastly improved and for Chakra to be made targetable. It might not even be that broken, but I'm able to acknowledge the potential problems and imbalances that it might cause. Plus, I play one of the strongest jobs in the game. They may be solid, innocuous improvements, but I am not entitled to it considering the power my job already wields.

This topic is about an aspect of the game that actually needed to be improved. SAMs & Ridill WARs wont change much, but it allows DRK to actually use their A weapons and it might make DRG into something more than a joke. This could make it so you wont need one of 2 intensely rare items (or be a MNK) to be considered worthy of having around, and that's something we absolutely need.

[evilpaul]

I don't see anybody saying they want SMN to make BB MNKs and RidillAdaberk WARs into lolBB MNKs and lolRidillAdaberk WAR, and also be able to replace a BRD+RDM in merit parties as buffer/healer extraordinaire, so that they can solo 25k+/hr on Greater Colibri.

But maybe, the casting time on avatars could be reduced just a little (without subbing RDM)? Maybe avatars could have a martial arts-like trait so that their DoT increases somewhat along the way to 75? Maybe a JA that gives them an Enspell effect some % of the time? Maybe lower perpetuation cost by 1-2 or add some more gear for that?

Something to make the job useful on things besides 4 HNMs that wouldn't even effect it there much/at all.

Nobody's saying they want SMN made better at the expense of other jobs or calling for PLD, WAR, or whatever other job to be nerfed. I have no desire to play DRG at all, and I'm glad SE is talking about giving them some boosts (and 2-handers in general).

[BRP]

PLD is more versatile than SMN really. You are right they only excel at tanking, but it's pretty obvious they are the posterboy tank of FFXI. Their changes really helped with PLD tanking in exp(pre-70). I actually prefer a PLD on anything that isn't absurdly higher level(like people like to do on Colibri) as long he isn't stupid and neither are the mages.

Now you see SE is adjusting 2-hand weapons. That's great. While I admit that it effects more jobs, SMN is probably more displaced than 2-hand weapons are. This gives me hope SE will one day give SMN what it really needs and not just "HAY LOL ODIN, NOW YOU GET AOE BOOST, SEE YOU NEXT YEAR".

[Beckwin]

Being good at a specialty = versatility?

ok.

[BRP]

Being good at a specialty = versatility?

ok.

They are decent to good on multiple things, but only excel at one thing.

[Naygor]

Smns are decent to good at multiple things too! Buffs for everyone!