Battle Adjustments (08/23/2007) (BST, PUP, COR adjustments)

[solsovly]

I'd rather SE would have kept their paws off BST after the MPK update. SE didn't understand BST when they implemented it, and they let it become it's own identity when they ignored it for so many years. It's a different job and community, and that's hard for most of you to grasp, because you haven't been part of the BST community for going on four years now. You have to come to understand that as much as we solo, we also have gotten used to being the black sheeps of FFXI. Back when we could MPK, we could and would do it just because we were above the law of SE, and their rules didn't apply to us back in the day when we were the only solo job. GMs were and still are worthless when it comes to MPK, and I know at least I kept daily kill counts on RMT and players who annoyed me alike.

SE lets us steam for years and years without doing anything about it, and we get into this mindset that things will never change, and we'll always fly under the radar. Then they go and take away our MPK ability. That'll be sorely missed, but despawn is beneficial to BST, because we can work it to our advantage for only a slight increase in difficulty. Now, instead of nerfing us again, which they seem allergic to do outright after the RNG fervor, they nerf our community by allowing people to get BST to 75 who weren't going to cut it in previous installments.

But most of you are not BSTs. I'm sure your BRDs, RDM and WARs at 75 weep for job changes you didn't get, but your jobs are dime-a-dozen, and I wouldn't expect you to have any special point of pride for them. Being xenophobic loners in a party-oriented game is just what BSTs were about. This game's nearing the end of it's lifespan, anyways. Over 5 years, they're just doing crap to appease it's player base to keep resubscribing. I really hate to say good-bye to my Horns, after all the frustrations and stress went into earning and fighting with them, but if some of the trash that walks around Whitegate is indication of kind of BSTs were produced after the Call Beast XP removal; I don't care to stick around to see 43/21 BST/WAR LFG(!) in my /search. End of a fine era...

Yeah because now you certainly can't experience what it is to be a BST without an xp penalty. Truly, the xp penalty is the job defining ability of being a BST. Your opinion is worthless and if your BST is anything like that, it is equally as worthless.

[Delekii]

Venture, speaking as a BST, stfu.

If you used your BST for mpking, you are not part of the BST community that you talk so dearly about. The vast majority of BSTs on most of the BST-related forums around the place were and are adamantly against MPKing except in extreme circumstances, no less so than the rest of the FFXI userbase.

Unless you are playing for the sake of other people, nothing is stopping you from playing your bst the same way you play it today.

Anyone who's opinion you care about probably knows that you leveled BST pre-patch. If you care that much about BST/WAR's seeking party, don't invite them.

You get a patch that is ONLY positive to your gameplay, or at the very worst, doesn't remotely change it, and all you can concentrate on is the fact that there will be more BSTs around? Personally I couldn't be more thrilled that I can heal my pets without returning to their spawn points. But then, I care more about my own gameplay than what other people are doing.

[epigram]

I leveled bst, pre-CoP, pre-ExP update and without light staff most of the time because it was too damn expensive back when you were a zomg blm to have an ice staff.

I have guttler, 5/5 af2 and have seen countless noob bsts hit 75. There will always be noob bsts, but there won't be droves of them because it still remains a near-worhtless job at end game. Just like why you don't see countless pups at 75.

Anyway I'm leveling cor, rng, and thief right now. So being able to get fast and easy exp as thief/bst seems just shy of brilliant.

[Tomino]

id like to get feedback from endgame cors not relating to merit parties. i go to endgame events like sky, dyna, sea, hnm, wyrms almost 100 percent /whm. maybe certain limbus or city dyna ill go /rng.

personally, any allianced HNM is usually /WHM while any Dynamis/Limbus/farm event done with the proper number of ppl suits /RNG perfectly and turns into fun. Xarcabard, KS99 and the ProtoNMs are kinda offlimits to /RNG tho.
only times I see COR really falling behind are low-ppl events like 6 men limbus run or anything like that; those cases i prefer another job as even cor/whm tends to be crappy.

ToAU events (Nyzul, Salvage, Eihen) are so often based on T-VT mobs subbing RNG is sweet.

[LD]

I'd rather SE would have kept their paws off BST after the MPK update. SE didn't understand BST when they implemented it, and they let it become it's own identity when they ignored it for so many years. It's a different job and community, and that's hard for most of you to grasp, because you haven't been part of the BST community for going on four years now. You have to come to understand that as much as we solo, we also have gotten used to being the black sheeps of FFXI. Back when we could MPK, we could and would do it just because we were above the law of SE, and their rules didn't apply to us back in the day when we were the only solo job. GMs were and still are worthless when it comes to MPK, and I know at least I kept daily kill counts on RMT and players who annoyed me alike.

SE lets us steam for years and years without doing anything about it, and we get into this mindset that things will never change, and we'll always fly under the radar. Then they go and take away our MPK ability. That'll be sorely missed, but despawn is beneficial to BST, because we can work it to our advantage for only a slight increase in difficulty. Now, instead of nerfing us again, which they seem allergic to do outright after the RNG fervor, they nerf our community by allowing people to get BST to 75 who weren't going to cut it in previous installments.

But most of you are not BSTs. I'm sure your BRDs, RDM and WARs at 75 weep for job changes you didn't get, but your jobs are dime-a-dozen, and I wouldn't expect you to have any special point of pride for them. Being xenophobic loners in a party-oriented game is just what BSTs were about. This game's nearing the end of it's lifespan, anyways. Over 5 years, they're just doing crap to appease it's player base to keep resubscribing. I really hate to say good-bye to my Horns, after all the frustrations and stress went into earning and fighting with them, but if some of the trash that walks around Whitegate is indication of kind of BSTs were produced after the Call Beast XP removal; I don't care to stick around to see 43/21 BST/WAR LFG(!) in my /search. End of a fine era...

hmmm....."Our own culture"......"Black sheep"............"You don't understand"..............

HAY GUYES, I THINK THERE'S A WORD FOR THIS! :x

[Dreampainter]

I believe there is a word for that. There is no need to make the bst community look so emo because its not. I also distinctly remember many very old discussions on mpk and how we bsts should not make asses of ourselves in the eyes of a playerbase which already has a very shaky perception of us. As if nobody understands, I don't play a single "popular" or "bandwagon" job. Do us a favor and leave Negative Nancy and Pessemistic Patty at home.

[evilpaul]

I'm sooooo going to level my 20 BST to 75 solo after this patch. It's going to be the new bandwagon job, right?

[Theraven]

I'd rather SE would have kept their paws off BST after the MPK update. SE didn't understand BST when they implemented it, and they let it become it's own identity when they ignored it for so many years. It's a different job and community, and that's hard for most of you to grasp, because you haven't been part of the BST community for going on four years now. You have to come to understand that as much as we solo, we also have gotten used to being the black sheeps of FFXI. Back when we could MPK, we could and would do it just because we were above the law of SE, and their rules didn't apply to us back in the day when we were the only solo job. GMs were and still are worthless when it comes to MPK, and I know at least I kept daily kill counts on RMT and players who annoyed me alike.

SE lets us steam for years and years without doing anything about it, and we get into this mindset that things will never change, and we'll always fly under the radar. Then they go and take away our MPK ability. That'll be sorely missed, but despawn is beneficial to BST, because we can work it to our advantage for only a slight increase in difficulty. Now, instead of nerfing us again, which they seem allergic to do outright after the RNG fervor, they nerf our community by allowing people to get BST to 75 who weren't going to cut it in previous installments.

But most of you are not BSTs. I'm sure your BRDs, RDM and WARs at 75 weep for job changes you didn't get, but your jobs are dime-a-dozen, and I wouldn't expect you to have any special point of pride for them. Being xenophobic loners in a party-oriented game is just what BSTs were about. This game's nearing the end of it's lifespan, anyways. Over 5 years, they're just doing crap to appease it's player base to keep resubscribing. I really hate to say good-bye to my Horns, after all the frustrations and stress went into earning and fighting with them, but if some of the trash that walks around Whitegate is indication of kind of BSTs were produced after the Call Beast XP removal; I don't care to stick around to see 43/21 BST/WAR LFG(!) in my /search. End of a fine era...

Jesus Christ, you act like after this update people will be able to just switch their main job to BSt and BAM! level 75. There were already people who partied on BST and the only place this change will make a difference is pre-35 and if you happen to be in a camp with a party where there are some decent pets around. Dumb players won't all of a sudden be able to play BST any better than they were before, it will still be just as much of a challenge from 35-75 as it has always been. And the road 1-35 has only been made slightly easier... These changes are not changing BST drastically in any way. There are some small improvements, like the jug pets lasting longer thing, but overall the impact it will have on the job is minimal at best. If you think the community is going to be ruined you're sorely mistaken, but just go ahead and quit so we don't have to listen to you crying any more.

[FinalJustice]

I'd rather SE would have kept their paws off BST after the MPK update. SE didn't understand BST when they implemented it, and they let it become it's own identity when they ignored it for so many years. It's a different job and community, and that's hard for most of you to grasp, because you haven't been part of the BST community for going on four years now. You have to come to understand that as much as we solo, we also have gotten used to being the black sheeps of FFXI. Back when we could MPK, we could and would do it just because we were above the law of SE, and their rules didn't apply to us back in the day when we were the only solo job. GMs were and still are worthless when it comes to MPK, and I know at least I kept daily kill counts on RMT and players who annoyed me alike.

SE lets us steam for years and years without doing anything about it, and we get into this mindset that things will never change, and we'll always fly under the radar. Then they go and take away our MPK ability. That'll be sorely missed, but despawn is beneficial to BST, because we can work it to our advantage for only a slight increase in difficulty. Now, instead of nerfing us again, which they seem allergic to do outright after the RNG fervor, they nerf our community by allowing people to get BST to 75 who weren't going to cut it in previous installments.

But most of you are not BSTs. I'm sure your BRDs, RDM and WARs at 75 weep for job changes you didn't get, but your jobs are dime-a-dozen, and I wouldn't expect you to have any special point of pride for them. Being xenophobic loners in a party-oriented game is just what BSTs were about. This game's nearing the end of it's lifespan, anyways. Over 5 years, they're just doing crap to appease it's player base to keep resubscribing. I really hate to say good-bye to my Horns, after all the frustrations and stress went into earning and fighting with them, but if some of the trash that walks around Whitegate is indication of kind of BSTs were produced after the Call Beast XP removal; I don't care to stick around to see 43/21 BST/WAR LFG(!) in my /search. End of a fine era...

hmmm....."Our own culture"......"Black sheep"............"You don't understand"..............

HAY GUYES, I THINK THERE'S A WORD FOR THIS!

http://ohsquee.net/flash/Emo%20Duck.swf

THE DEPTHS OF MY SUFFERING

[Eratosthenes]

All this patch is gonna do for BSTs is save some level 75s some money. It doesn't make BST easier just because there's no XP penalty from a pet. None of the gameplay changes because of that, since it's still gonna be faster to swap to a new pet for each kill than it will be to stop and heal your pet through /stay. I see it mainly as a positive change for /BST. I may actually play around on NIN/BST or WHM/BST again after this update.

I never found BST or /BST to be hard; just repetitive. Getting BST to 75 is really just about repeating the same process over and over again, just like every other job in the game.

[HAcoreRD]

All this patch is gonna do for BSTs is save some level 75s some money. It doesn't make BST easier just because there's no XP penalty from a pet. None of the gameplay changes because of that, since it's still gonna be faster to swap to a new pet for each kill than it will be to stop and heal your pet through /stay. I see it mainly as a positive change for /BST. I may actually play around on NIN/BST or WHM/BST again after this update.

I never found BST or /BST to be hard; just repetitive. Getting BST to 75 is really just about repeating the same process over and over again, just like every other job in the game.

but...didnt you read the guy's thread? you're a black sheep, IT MUST BE HARDER

Shit this is like when SE nerfed the cop BC's difficulties! Anyone who beat COP after that are unworthy of the ring!

That's his mentality anyways. If he and others before him suffered, everyone else should. how sad

[Sho]

I think Venture has pissed off every residential BST that posts on BG, lol. lolBlackSheep.

[deivi]

he should just loot at it as any other job that gets buffed; the bad ones will still suck while the good just get better.

[SephYuyX]

I kinda know where Venture is coming from, but yeah, hes taking it way too far.

[Priran]

BSTs are karakuls

[Damane]

All this patch is gonna do for BSTs is save some level 75s some money. It doesn't make BST easier just because there's no XP penalty from a pet. None of the gameplay changes because of that, since it's still gonna be faster to swap to a new pet for each kill than it will be to stop and heal your pet through /stay. I see it mainly as a positive change for /BST. I may actually play around on NIN/BST or WHM/BST again after this update.

I never found BST or /BST to be hard; just repetitive. Getting BST to 75 is really just about repeating the same process over and over again, just like every other job in the game.

yeah. but with this change getting Aynthing/bst to 75 is much easier^^. I love it no more seeking in a city and not beeing able to do anything, I can just go fucking solo all my jobs up to lvl 75 without ghetto leave

[Theraven]

All this patch is gonna do for BSTs is save some level 75s some money. It doesn't make BST easier just because there's no XP penalty from a pet. None of the gameplay changes because of that, since it's still gonna be faster to swap to a new pet for each kill than it will be to stop and heal your pet through /stay. I see it mainly as a positive change for /BST. I may actually play around on NIN/BST or WHM/BST again after this update.

I never found BST or /BST to be hard; just repetitive. Getting BST to 75 is really just about repeating the same process over and over again, just like every other job in the game.

yeah. but with this change getting Aynthing/bst to 75 is much easier^^. I love it no more seeking in a city and not beeing able to do anything, I can just go fucking solo all my jobs up to lvl 75 without ghetto leave

It's not even gonna be that much easier for /BST to be honest. If you think about it, by not using ghetto leave you're leaving yourself with a mostly dead pet after the fight, which means it's just about guaranteed you'll have to go find another pet mid-fight. As a job that can sleep this won't be such a big deal, because if you do mischarm you can just sleep one (or both) mobs until your charm is successful, but this is wasted time, since it means you can't melee from the start of the fight (or you'll have built too much hate when it comes time for the pet swap) and you also can't cast dia/dia 2 because you'll want to be able to sleep the mob in case something goes wrong. If you aren't on a job that can sleep then you run into the possibility of mischarming once your first pet dies and then you have 2 mobs beating on you that you can't do anything about. Whereas the way it is now, you're guaranteed a fresh pet every fight and if you mischarm you'll only have 1 mob beating on you. I predict marginally better xp/hr at best and more deaths/more downtime/worse xp per hour at worst.

[Kyreth]

BSTs are karakuls

So in other words, I've been doing that Sanctum Assault to liberate BST's for the Aht Urghan war effort?

I know what we need for the next uncapped jugpet...

[Bakthi]

so back to first point i guess but are cors really going to kirin and gods, jailers, hnms, wyrms, ice dyna as /rng?

No, and I pretty much agree with what Tomino said. Merits are great as /RNG; if I'm going to go COR, I just make sure someone else will be pulling. If there isn't someone else to pull, then I'm probably going BRD in the first place. City dynamis is cool as /RNG, although Joyeuse starts to hit for 0 (for me) on a few of the NMs, so that let me know before I even tried not to take it to icy places.

But for anything "big", where a bunch of people are gonna stand around wailing on a single chunky mob for at least several minutes, then /WHM it is (assuming I went as COR in the first place, which may happen more often after Monday).

The BST changes are all positive. I'm not sure they're enough, but I'll take them happily, especially for my up-and-coming /BST jobs to 37. I'm in no way inclined to cry about things getting easier; what other people do with BST is pretty much the least of my concerns, unless they're right next to me or in my party.

[Ploid]

I never found BST or /BST to be hard; just repetitive. Getting BST to 75 is really just about repeating the same process over and over again, just like every other job in the game.

Each time I grew out of a camp on bst and moved to a new location, it was like a whole new world/level to learn and conquer. It's repeating the same things as far as commanding your pet (sometimes), but the experience is far different camp to camp compared to exp groups moving from camp to camp. I will try leveling blu/bst to see if the experience is the same but yea, it's going to be crazy to try to level solo now. Maybe new camps will be found.