Will They Fix It?

[LD]

oooooooooooooh, I get it.

Then why even bother giving any job an A rank skill when they're just going to use what is unquestionablly known as the best weapon type?

Heard of Kclub? We drks being using C weapon to maximize what we can do on HNM level. We made our sacrifice, can you?

STOP MAKING ME REPEAT MYSELF, YOU ILLITERATE CHUD.
Can't you read one page back?!


NO ONE SHOULD HAVE TO MAKE ANY FUCKING SACRIFICES!

[Rena]

Heard of Kclub? We drks being using C weapon to maximize what we can do on HNM level. We made our sacrifice, can you?

I've yet to understand why anybody should have to make such a "sacrifice" just because you had to in the past.

[epigram]

Nerfing won't fix much of anything. I'd just like to see the other jobs enhanced. But I do find it funny how many people bitch like this is the end of the world, while bst has been eatting shit forever and the usual response was lolbst. Hell, we've been out of end game so long we don't know what the hell it is anymore.

If anything this remind me of early on where most DD'ers used 2h, ridill was a fee lot toy, and thief was just a TH bitch. I'm sure rangers, monks, thieves and whoever else will get a tweak. Hell, maybe there will be new KRT in the new expansion and monks won't care anyway. Since I have 8 weapon merits I might as well dump them into GA and leave guttler in my inventory or something.

Still, things in FFXI have never been even, it's just a state of what jobs are over powered and which ones aren't. The only job that hasn't been over powered is bst. Maybe next tweak pet dmg/acc will be buffed to insanity level

[Eaglestrike]

I think 1H jobs should use 2H weapons for HNM if they have access to good WS for those weapons. For EXP it doesn't matter whether they use 1H or 2H.

So are you saying 2H jobs should use 1H weapons? If you want to make an arguement, then do something that doesn't make YOU a hypocrit. I say this because you are the one that brought up the example and I am countering YOUR example to show how conflicting it is.

And what about the job that has no access to 2H weapons at all? THF has no skill in any 2H weapon.

Perhaps THF shouldn't be doing much damage to start with. When do you ever see a thf in real life being able to do more damage than let's say a knight.

Everyjob has its purpose, and THF's being shifting hate between tanks, sneaky little shit like that, and help drop rate and benefit himself by stealing items from the mob that everyone else is killing.

Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

Ok sure, then:

1) Make it so SAM can't /thf and transfer at damn near our accuracy and MORE hate onto the tank because of their super strong WS's just as often as we can.
2) Make us really increase drop rates (not going to happen)
3) Make steal worth a damn. Yes, we can get up to a 20% chance at stealing gold coins, but the majority of mobs have nothing to steal or some shitty item you'll end up selling to a vendor.
4) Make Mug do something. Isn't the act of mugging usually involving violence of some kind? It does no damage, doesn't work on the vast majority of mobs and when it works it hardly is useful in any way.
5) Make our ability to pick locks worth something. It costs almost as much to pick a lock than what you get out of it (sometimes it costs more to pick!) and nothing special is gotten out of it. Do I need to post my SS of failing to open a simple door in Arrapaggo Reef like 7-8 times in a row?

If you want to make an argument that we're a utility class and not a damage class, at least propose some ideas that make us an ACTUAL utility class. Currently the only "special" part of THF is TH2+1/2, everything we offer can be done by some other job. That's not why I chose this job, we need more utility before that is even a viable argument for THF.

[Nagamaki]

Sit back, look at what you're saying, then die asphyxiated because you concentrated so much you forgot to breathe.

Staff MNK isn't a solution because staves are not damage dealing weapons and MNK attributes/traits are all about HTH. Bringing up Full Swing and "decent DD Staffs" shows how profoundly clueless you are.

MNK isn't broken, the non-crit pdif cap is seriously unnecessary but its effect in terms of damage reduction (when in the affect cRatio range around 1.6 to 2.4) is certainly there, but not monstrously large.

Some aspects of the patch are very much open to arguments, but people spouting this sort of mind boggling anti-truth... no.

Holy shit now THF isn't a DD and that's justified because BRD isn't a DD and because an assassin doesn't do as much as a knight? And people are considering DRK's C club skill a sacrifice made? Is there no end to the deluge of Stupid?

I'm going to fucking cry.

[Siniroth]

Logically, I'd be more afraid of an assassin than a knight

"Hey, I'm a knight, I'm gonna fight you head on so there's no disadvantage to you and it's my skill that beats you"

or

"Hey, I'm an assassin, you're already dead because I killed you in the most efficient way possible"

Edit: clarification, the two things, assassin and knight, have different advantages, assassins wouldnt be stronger than knights because their skills don't require them to be, think the same should go with thf and other DD jobs

[Sepuku]

...
Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

To compensate for the hate that 2handers take away from the tank, nowadays, and plant hate back on the tank?

Nah any 2h/thf can do that now.

Seriously Nameless you dont understand thf.
Therefore:
http://home.arcor.de/sepuku/stfu6.jpg

[Nameless]

Logically, I'd be more afraid of an assassin than a knight

"Hey, I'm a knight, I'm gonna fight you head on so there's no disadvantage to you and it's my skill that beats you"

or

"Hey, I'm an assassin, you're already dead because I killed you in the most efficient way possible"

You are a thf, not a nin. Don't let your AF2 name fool you. Also, you do get the assasin attribute as being able to sneak behind a mob and do burst damage. It is just that your DoT is just too bad that even the best burst damage won't help you get in a fight.

[Yutuyu]

Sit back, look at what you're saying, then die asphyxiated because you concentrated so much you forgot to breathe.

Staff MNK isn't a solution because staves are not damage dealing weapons and MNK attributes/traits are all about HTH. Bringing up Full Swing and "decent DD Staffs" shows how profoundly clueless you are.

Perdu Staff 73 60 399 9.02 Latent Effect: DMG: 66 MNK/WHM/PLD/DRG

MNK isn't broken, the non-crit pdif cap is seriously unnecessary but its effect in terms of damage reduction (when in the affect cRatio range around 1.6 to 2.4) is certainly there, but not monstrously large.

Some aspects of the patch are very much open to arguments, but people spouting this sort of mind boggling anti-truth... no.

Holy shit now THF isn't a DD and that's justified because BRD isn't a DD and because an assassin doesn't do as much as a knight? And people are considering DRK's C club skill a sacrifice made? Is there no end to the deluge of Stupid?

I'm going to fucking cry.

Could you take a picture for me?

[Nameless]

...
Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

To compensate for the hate that 2handers take away from the tank, nowadays, and plant hate back on the tank?

Nah any 2h/thf can do that now.

Seriously Nameless you dont understand thf.
Therefore:
http://home.arcor.de/sepuku/stfu6.jpg

That is pretty funny i will say.

So you are saying if one job can do something that the other job can also do. Then that original job should be taken out or boost? Then I don't see why we have so many different class of melee, should just be one that is called Melee, and description, do damage.

Any job with /thf can sneak attack and shaft hate yes. Any job with /sam can meditate. So does that mean Sam is not needed? It's about do the best of what you can do. Thf is still considering the best at shafting hate. No one wants to /thf anymore now a day especially on HNM after the update. So you thf ppl should find yourself more useful no?

I don't think you understand any job other than thf.

[ringthree]

I really hope they leave it. Let the RNG's and THF's sit out for a change. Lord forbid we let other jobs shine for awhile.

Attitudes like this is the cancer that is killing FFXI.

Oh, you mean the attitude that existed in 99% of NIN, MNK and WAR before 9/27/07?

[Siniroth]

Logically, I'd be more afraid of an assassin than a knight

"Hey, I'm a knight, I'm gonna fight you head on so there's no disadvantage to you and it's my skill that beats you"

or

"Hey, I'm an assassin, you're already dead because I killed you in the most efficient way possible"

You are a thf, not a nin. Don't let your AF2 name fool you. Also, you do get the assasin attribute as being able to sneak behind a mob and do burst damage. It is just that your DoT is just too bad that even the best burst damage won't help you get in a fight.

See clarification, the difference in damage shouldn't be so giant that thfs are now useless in xp, when compared to other jobs, they should be weaker than other jobs for melee damage, I agree completely, but when their SA(TA) can't make up for it enough to get them invites, it's too much

[Nagamaki]

Wow a Perdu weapon for Full Swing? That's nice how the latent will be off from 100% to 300%, the requisite TP for Full Swing to not be shit (and really, its still pretty much shit because staff damage sucks and FS WSC sucks, DK for /THF is better). Not only that, but with the latent on its a 66/399 weapon, vs Spharai at 58/192, it clearly wins hands down. That's awesome. I'm totally put in my place by your amazing logic.

[Eaglestrike]

Logically, I'd be more afraid of an assassin than a knight

"Hey, I'm a knight, I'm gonna fight you head on so there's no disadvantage to you and it's my skill that beats you"

or

"Hey, I'm an assassin, you're already dead because I killed you in the most efficient way possible"

You are a thf, not a nin. Don't let your AF2 name fool you. Also, you do get the assasin attribute as being able to sneak behind a mob and do burst damage. It is just that your DoT is just too bad that even the best burst damage won't help you get in a fight.

A THF is an assassin who has a main goal of money in mind. A NIN is a trained assassin that can be used in a military or mafia. The way I see it the jobs are mostly THF = Western assassin, NIN = Eastern Assassin.

Unless SE is going to completely rewrite mob information and make it so we're more like FFT thieves and can remove gear from enemies (and thus making them weaker) I doubt we're ever going to be very high in utility, so our focus is going to be DD.

Semi-edit: THF is still considered the best at shifting hate? By who? After this patch I in no way believe myself to be the best at shifting hate. A SAM will be able to have 100% tp for every TA even on HNM's, I may not be able to guarentee that. I'll have 100% accuracy, SAM will have 90%, but he'll also do 1.5x my damage, thus shifting 1.5x as much hate. THF is NOT the best at shifting hate, and just if you didn't realize this, but SHIFTING HATE DEPENDS ON DAMAGE DONE. If we can't do awesome damage, we can't shift hate well.

[Izzy]

WHY ARE YOU ALL FORGETTING THE CLUB _________QQQQQQQQ__________QQQQQQQQQ_Q

[Vistani]

I think 1H jobs should use 2H weapons for HNM if they have access to good WS for those weapons. For EXP it doesn't matter whether they use 1H or 2H.

So are you saying 2H jobs should use 1H weapons? If you want to make an arguement, then do something that doesn't make YOU a hypocrit. I say this because you are the one that brought up the example and I am countering YOUR example to show how conflicting it is.

And what about the job that has no access to 2H weapons at all? THF has no skill in any 2H weapon.

Perhaps THF shouldn't be doing much damage to start with. When do you ever see a thf in real life being able to do more damage than let's say a knight.

Everyjob has its purpose, and THF's being shifting hate between tanks, sneaky little shit like that, and help drop rate and benefit himself by stealing items from the mob that everyone else is killing.

Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

As the real life weapons expert you clearly are, would you be able to do some testing? I am extremely interested in what would happen if you stabbed yourself with a large dagger. Then, afterwards, take a huge sword and ram it through your chest. Please report back on which hurt more so we can make a judgement on a video game.

Hint: FFXI is not real life, your comparison is retarded.

[Siniroth]

WHY ARE YOU ALL FORGETTING THE CLUB _________QQQQQQQQ__________QQQQQQQQQ_Q

haha, I'm sorry izzy D: as a fellow I love club, I really do, but I haven't done anything with club in so long I can't say anything about it vs other things at this point

Perhaps THF shouldn't be doing much damage to start with. When do you ever see a thf in real life being able to do more damage than let's say a knight.

Everyjob has its purpose, and THF's being shifting hate between tanks, sneaky little shit like that, and help drop rate and benefit himself by stealing items from the mob that everyone else is killing.

Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

As the real life weapons expert you clearly are, would you be able to do some testing? I am extremely interested in what would happen if you stabbed yourself with a large dagger. Then, afterwards, take a huge sword and ram it through your chest. Please report back on which hurt more so we can make a judgement on a video game.

Hint: FFXI is not real life, your comparison is retarded.

When do you ever see thieves (the kind we're talking about here, not 'people who steal') or knights in real life anyway, for that matter >_>

[Eaglestrike]

I think 1H jobs should use 2H weapons for HNM if they have access to good WS for those weapons. For EXP it doesn't matter whether they use 1H or 2H.

So are you saying 2H jobs should use 1H weapons? If you want to make an arguement, then do something that doesn't make YOU a hypocrit. I say this because you are the one that brought up the example and I am countering YOUR example to show how conflicting it is.

And what about the job that has no access to 2H weapons at all? THF has no skill in any 2H weapon.

Perhaps THF shouldn't be doing much damage to start with. When do you ever see a thf in real life being able to do more damage than let's say a knight.

Everyjob has its purpose, and THF's being shifting hate between tanks, sneaky little shit like that, and help drop rate and benefit himself by stealing items from the mob that everyone else is killing.

Sorry to say, but THF just probably don't mean to do much damage, they have other purpose. Like bard, you don't see them do DD.

As the real life weapons expert you clearly are, would you be able to do some testing? I am extremely interested in what would happen if you stabbed yourself with a large dagger. Then, afterwards, take a huge sword and ram it through your chest. Please report back on which hurt more so we can make a judgement on a video game.

Hint: FFXI is not real life, your comparison is retarded.

I'd prefer to counter with the argument that mobs/enemies in an RPG have some form of armor, whether it's like a Troll with actual armor similar to a human or just tough skin. The point of a dagger is to strike at a weak point, with the heightened quickness of a dagger wielder and the ease of mobility of the dagger it's a lot easier to strike at weak points in armor than with other weapons.

Another comparison would be that big weapons make you bruise (since with strong armor a weapon hitting you is more of an impact and will throw you back and bruise) and daggers make you bleed. In terms of you approaching death, usually bleeding will get you there more efficiently (or in a more certain manner).

[Tensaiji]

The "I love club... club"?

[Vedder]

I really hope they leave it. Let the RNG's and THF's sit out for a change. Lord forbid we let other jobs shine for awhile.

Attitudes like this is the cancer that is killing FFXI.

Oh, you mean the attitude that existed in 99% of NIN, MNK and WAR before 9/27/07?

08/27/07 >.>

On another note, all these people who keep spouting crap about "How does it feel now?" and "Maybe you'll like sitting on the sidelines" and "DRG had this coming for so long!!!111" are being so stupid and petty it makes my head hurt.

It's like if minorities all the sudden instituted white-slavery or something. Would that be right? Hell no.

"Why can't we all just get along?" - Rodney King