Parses after the patch

[Amele]

when particular mobs come into play, the (popular) reference mob is a level 81 or 82 merit target, usually either a greater colibri or a mamool ja, because their defensive stats are highly understood.
edit: quizno clarified what he was talking about, so I trimmed a ton:

accuracy can be calculated exactly from a known hit rate.

attack can be calculated exactly from a known attack and defense.

dex/str are similar from a known weapon D, and mob agi/vit.

haste vs. DA/TA is the easiest case to handle yes

it just takes increasingly difficult math.

@demetrius : close, each additional point of DA actually gives a little bit less (because they aren't recursive).

@bothari : 18% haste is hugely conservative, you forgot to include haste from spells/marches. (unless you routinely run around with ~3% haste on dragoon?) but you got the conclusion I had just the same.

I guess it seemed more obvious to some of us because of how much work we had done already comparing other similar gear in the past in other slots. I don't know.

[Quizno]

Then do it and post the formula here for everyone to look at and go over as a group.

[Amele]

Then do it and post the formula here for everyone to look at and go over as a group.

ok. here's the formula. for attack, accuracy, strength, haste, and dual wield. (I excluded criticals because I don't have a reference for an exact formula, the works' been done but it may have been lost in the rollback)

this is for perswing dps only. you can add it to the ws calculation (which is similar to this but a little different) if you need total damage.

you can also do this with jumps etc. if you have the exact damage formulas for those JA's.

(D+?D1 + min((STR+?STR1+4-VIT)/4),(floor(D/9)+8)*2) * 1.2*(ATT + ?ATT1 / DEF - 0.05 * dLVL ) - 0.4 * min((75 + ACC + ?ACC1 - EVA - dLVL*4 )/2,95) * (1+DA+?DA1)† / (delay * (1-haste-?haste1) * (1 - DW - ?DW1)

base damage
pDIF mean, if > 2.0 and 1h, cap to 2.0, if > 3.0 and 2h cap to 3.0
hit rate
Double/Triple attack
delay calculation

where, ?VAR is the change in that stat.
D is your weapon damage
STR is your strength
VIT is the mob's VIT
ATT is your attack (including attack from strength)
DEF is the mob's DEF
dLVL is the difference in your level and the mob's level. if you are higher level than the mob, this is 0.
ACC is your accuracy (including accuracy from dex)
EVA is the mob's evasion
DA is your combined double and triple attack

min(value1,value2) is the minimum of value 1 and 2
floor(expression) is the largest integer less than the value of "expression".


†treat triple attacks as TA*2 = DA for this part of the formula.
all gear that is not being compared goes in the non ?VAR in the function,
run for set with ?VAR = 0; this will give you a baseline damage/delay calculation. (multiply by 60 for approximate dps)

run with ?VAR's = set 1. this is your damage/delay for the first set of gear.

run with ?VAR's = set 2. this is your damage/delay for the second set of gear.

compare the % difference of ?VAR1 with ?VAR2 to the ?VAR0 value to get approximate dot difference.

edit: forgot wrank cap on FSTR.
edit2: added colors, changed cRatio to (pdif_max+pdif_min)/2 (accurate for cRatio > 1.5 and the presumed average median for pre update weapons and post update 2h weapons.) presumed mode of current 1h weapons.

[Trime]

Regarding Ryko's parse:

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/3...2twojpgxd0.jpg

You all seem to have similar acc, melee dmg, and WS averages.

You seem to have parsed significantly higher than the Ace's/Haidate sam, granted your WS dmg is higher but you also seem to have done a lot more WS than him. Im sure hate was on you more than ither of the other sams, so where was all your extra WSs coming from as I am preparing to level sam and want to use it to its full potential.

Also what food were you all using?

[Judai]

blablabla rants about 2.5%TA vs 5% Haste

The funny thing is, I didn't compare 2.5% TA to 5% Haste. You made the stupid comparision with Byakko's Haidate and Homam Corazza. Now you are just trying to save face.

then with 299 skill he could take off Corazza with no impact on accuracy whatsoever, or replace other things, effectively improving other stats while losing absolutely no accuracy.

Question.. would you replace Byakko hidate if you had too much accuracy? (hint: the only reason for a 3.3k penta on a fly is a triple attack)

Haidate has 15DEX toward crits and 5%haste, bad comparison. Corazza is pure Acc and a meh Triple Attack addition.

Haidate and Corraza don't compare, stop trying to save face like this is 2.5% TA vs 5% Haste. This is about you making a stupid comparision and then making up bullshit to try to prove a point that was never disputed until you brought in stupid facts and leaving out other conditions.

In your now shitty comparisions you fail to bring into account the improved Crits from the added Dex and the now worthless +15Acc on the Corazza because the point was, why use Corazza if you have capped Acc. The hadiate offers more then just Acc or the Haste, which you used to compare it to the Corazza. Not to mention you can't even wear the Haidate on DRG so your rants are pointless and mean nothing. Now please, shut up.

[Quizno]

Amele: Could you please label and explain each section along with the numbers.

(yes, I know people can do this themselves, but most will not.)

This will get more people involved in critiquing and make finding out any changes that need to be made more efficient.

[HadesBothari]

Haidate and Corraza don't compare, stop trying to save face like this is 2.5% TA vs 5% Haste. This is about you making a stupid comparision and then making up bullshit to try to prove a point that was never disputed until you brought in stupid facts and leaving out other conditions.

In your now shitty comparisions you fail to bring into account the improved Crits from the added Dex and the now worthless +15Acc on the Corazza because the point was, why use Corazza if you have capped Acc. The hadiate offers more then just Acc or the Haste, which you used to compare it to the Corazza. Not to mention you can't even wear the Haidate on DRG so your rants are pointless and mean nothing. Now please, shut up.

Was i talking to you? Was i even saying 5% haste > 2.5 TA? I believe what I said was

2.5% triple attack. When a triple attacked weaponskill can add 1k dmg, then I'd think it outdoes 5% haste.

So, you can stfu. Or, add something more constructive. I don't see you posting any numbers on how much the critical hit from 15 dex added.. I don't see you posting proof that TA can only proc on the first hit of a 5 hit penta. And where the fuck did I rant? All you are is a blind arrogant ass. All you can do.. is troll .. so have fun. Good day to you kind sir.

Edit: and to others, Yes i know/understand the broad statement that 2.5 > 5 would be wrong.

[Judai]

Your entire 5%Haste vs 2.5%TA started because of my comment about your idiotic comparision of Haidate vs Corazza. I don't need to put out numbers, DEX and crits has been proven plenty of times. Depending on how much you have and how much you add. Most people see 2-3% more crits I believe with Haidate. Not to mention your comparisions mean nothing because there is no 5% Haste body on DRg and you can't wear Haidate. Your comparisions are retarded.

[Nagamaki]

Why would you possibly compare any amount of Triple Attack or Double Attack with any amount of Haste for WS or for Jumps?

[Arthars]

is this parse less than an hr?

because theres only like 30+ WSs made for each person

[HadesBothari]

Why would you possibly compare any amount of Triple Attack or Double Attack with any amount of Haste for WS or for Jumps?

Grips? .. (And I know what you're getting at.. agree.)

[Rocl]

Please don't report people who are simply arguing against you. There is a difference between disagreeing and trolling.

[Amele]

Amele: Could you please label and explain each section along with the numbers.

(yes, I know people can do this themselves, but most will not.)

This will get more people involved in critiquing and make finding out any changes that need to be made more efficient.

I'll edit and color-code the classical base damage, PDIF, and 'modified delay' sections in the original post.

none of what I put up is particularly ground breaking btw, everything in there is either in the wiki directly or a mathematical rendering of simple english in the wiki (i.e. 10% haste reduces your delay by 10%) so rather than do 100% markup, I'll direct people to type: "pdif" into the wiki and go from there.

[Ryko]

Camp was lower colibri while chaining wivres.

Setup was MNK/WAR (Tumbleweed), DRK/WAR (Beckwin), SAM/WAR, COR, BRD, RDM

Songs were Double march, Rolls were Chaos and Fighter's

TP gear setups

I wore askar body full time.

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/2561/setupcq1.jpg

http://img112.imageshack.us/img112/9427/parse3ng7.jpg

A madrigal or a hunter's roll would have boosted the monk by quite a bit.

[Remyo]

your WS avg is 1337.24

[Beckwin]

I was fucking around with Gsword for probably a third of that parse and went easy on SE, but yeah, SAM is just broken atm- and Ryko's sam is stacked as hell on top of it. Also I'm pretty confident /sam would ended up with more damage for me overall, but wanted to try /war out post-patch. Something I've noticed between /sam and /war is that SS is slightly stronger /sam and guillo wins as /war. I'm guessing when they fix pdif that could change.

[archibaldcrane]

Ryko - I'm surprised by your accuracy of only 88% - so many people are talking about ITs checking low eva naked - how much acc+ and dex+ is in your TP gear?

[Beckwin]

25 dex + aces + tiphia + divisor + pcc is all the acc he has. Don't think he has gkt merits either.

[archibaldcrane]

25 dex + aces + tiphia + divisor + pcc is all the acc he has. Don't think he has gkt merits either.

Ah, ok - the merits would just about cap him it looks like.

Makes sense to me.

edit: And the fact that he's able to completely destroy a pimped out drk and bb-mnk/WAR even without gktn merits is ...wow. Yikes.

[Beckwin]

Best case scenario I could pull within 5%, as in say 37 to 32, (/sam, not dicking around with greatsword) but yeah, SAM is a monster right now. MNK definitely woulda been helped by an accuracy buff, but still.

Also, I'm considering using the Blitz Ring I have sitting in MH for xp.... and the dusk gloves my ninja uses.