Current Known Issues (Aug. 30)

[Eaglestrike]

Were people dumping Sniper's/Woodsmans's Rings because of the 2h change or because of the ToAU reward ring?

the 2h change.


@Ryko: define many

Seeing as how I was in the second group on fairy to finish it (at 4AM EST), even a dozen (which is a fair amount) by 4 hours beforehand would qualify my statement.

Edit: Though sendoh does have a point.

Maybe your server was slow or something? I'm pretty sure my group completed the fight at 1am EST and I'm not even sure we were the first group on Shiva to do so.

[Ryko]

Were people dumping Sniper's/Woodsmans's Rings because of the 2h change or because of the ToAU reward ring?

the 2h change.


@Ryko: define many

Seeing as how I was in the second group on fairy to finish it (at 4AM EST), even a dozen (which is a fair amount) by 4 hours beforehand would qualify my statement.

Edit: Though sendoh does have a point.

Maybe your server was slow or something? I'm pretty sure my group completed the fight at 1am EST and I'm not even sure we were the first group on Shiva to do so.

It would be because the only people that far into the missions aside from random groups here and there were in HNMLSes and guess what we were doing till midnight! I actually forget what I did after that (I think exped for 2-3 hours), then the people in my EXP group went to do the missions. Only 1 JP group had beaten it by the point I strolled by and the people I walked past had all pretty much wiped on alexander before we went in, got my crown at around 4:00 since I went to do assaults at 4:11. Fairy's kind of on the slow end unless they feel someone's gonna get some credit before them.

[GSDragoon]

Let's have another thread about how Dragoons were previously not invited to parties because no one understood the awesome power of Fluffy their pet dragon.

That-Is-Be-Cause-Their-Da-Mage-Was-Too-Low. If that were made equal, what does a MNK really have? The past is irrelevant, only the present means anything.

The monk has ... equal ... damage. It's almost as though equal == balance, who could have thought that DD classes would be balanced by their damage, and not by their toy pets or their Chakras.

So a DRG and MNK should do the same amount of damage in a merit situation, but then the DRG can also solo mobs MNK's cannot, and although in less than ideal situations, be an additional healer? That's not truly balanced. The goal should be for MNK to be slightly higher in ideal gear, but close enough it's not a huge difference, and that if you're fighting a piercing weak mob DRG will be the superior choice (like say Colibri).

MNK solos as /nin, right? As DRG/WHM, you have to be able to take whatever gets thrown at you with half HP. Each job is very different in soloing.

[lotmorning]

It would be because the only people that far into the missions aside from random groups here and there were in HNMLSes and guess what we were doing till midnight!

going to go out on a limb here and say camping damn Kings

[kuronosan]

Were people dumping Sniper's/Woodsmans's Rings because of the 2h change or because of the ToAU reward ring?

I doubt that many people finished TOAU by midnight monday.

I did. That's the only reason I sold my Woodsman.

[LD]

Let's have another thread about how Dragoons were previously not invited to parties because no one understood the awesome power of Fluffy their pet dragon.

That-Is-Be-Cause-Their-Da-Mage-Was-Too-Low. If that were made equal, what does a MNK really have? The past is irrelevant, only the present means anything.

The monk has ... equal ... damage. It's almost as though equal == balance, who could have thought that DD classes would be balanced by their damage, and not by their toy pets or their Chakras.

Yes, because inherent acc bonuses and hate shedding abilities....ya know, let aurik do this. I never had the patience for this.

There is a quote... can't quite remember... something about being doomed and repetition... something about time... ah well, whatever.

The point that Aurik missed over and over was that the disparity was far too much in the past, and his suggestion to fixing it was not to make the jobs closer but to make Fluffy a better healer, which doesn't do jack to improve DRG's role in an XP party. Now if you made Fluffy hit like a tank... LOL but that would make Aurik just as upset.

Time's cyclical. Right. Ok. W/E. That still doesn't mean DRG not getting PTs is somehow relevant, because that would suggest you deserve to be superior just because you were shat on for 3 years, not because you actually NEED it. Not how it works.

I don't know, being less of an MP sink or being able to heal others with little to no MP, putting all such hate on a creature that is not the main healer, does it's own damage, and can be recalled relatively quickly, all while maintaining battle flow (even without it), might actually be something of a boon. But what do I know? I'm the strongest Melee in the game, so I can't have an educated opinion on lesser jobs.

[layoneil]

The goal should be for MNK to be slightly higher in ideal gear, but close enough it's not a huge difference

have not seen any parses where this is definitely not true for MNK vs DRG on neutral mob types when both jobs use the same sub (be it WAR, NIN or THF).

[Eaglestrike]

Let's have another thread about how Dragoons were previously not invited to parties because no one understood the awesome power of Fluffy their pet dragon.

That-Is-Be-Cause-Their-Da-Mage-Was-Too-Low. If that were made equal, what does a MNK really have? The past is irrelevant, only the present means anything.

The monk has ... equal ... damage. It's almost as though equal == balance, who could have thought that DD classes would be balanced by their damage, and not by their toy pets or their Chakras.

So a DRG and MNK should do the same amount of damage in a merit situation, but then the DRG can also solo mobs MNK's cannot, and although in less than ideal situations, be an additional healer? That's not truly balanced. The goal should be for MNK to be slightly higher in ideal gear, but close enough it's not a huge difference, and that if you're fighting a piercing weak mob DRG will be the superior choice (like say Colibri).

MNK solos as /nin, right? As DRG/WHM, you have to be able to take whatever gets thrown at you with half HP. Each job is very different in soloing.

Right, but MNK's only source of healing is potions and Chakra, DRG can pretty much solo anything as long as it doesn't have a big damage TP move. DRG can solo a lot more and has almost no resting time. MNK's will have downtime as a lot of mobs have some form of ability to go through shadows or get through them (either a conic damage move or a multi-hit move that'll remove shadows and hit you). You're not going to win an argument that MNK can solo as well as DRG.

[Talisien]

Here's my problem with you and Aurik LD. Today you can go into a merit party and parse 5% less than a DRG or something and come to the forums and say this is bullshit, when a Dragoon could(n't) go into a merit party last week, parse 15% (or worse) lower than a Monk and wonder why the hell he was playing Dragoon. And let's be honest, the Drg would never have been invited in the first place.

Yes, I understand very well Monk and Dragoon are different, and no, I'm not 100% sure they're balanced right now. That said, the fact that people will actually invite a Dragoon or a Monk for the same slot in a party (DD) makes perfect sense to me and shows that is a move TOWARDS balance. This is NOT the era of the BLM where BLMs laughed at melee, nor is it the era of the War/Nin + Mnk where lolDrks and lolDrgs got to solo Lesser Colibri for their buffers.

That's why this patch is a good thing, and tweaking the abilities of the jobs is fine. If your Monk's raison d'etre was parsing 5% higher on the dvsparse than everyone else, I guess this patch is a bad thing though. For the rest of us, we actually like seeing dragoons, dark knights and monks playing together in the same party.

[suji]

[quote=Sagacious Sundi]

black sheep. >_>

What is that supposed to mean? I'm not playing the omfg im an emo bst card. I'm just pointing out you stated something thats incorrect as if it was a fact.

I just interpreted your first sentence as "omfg u guyz will never understand us ; ;". I apologize.[/quote:24f6c]
Best part is that you were more correct than him and you didn't even flip out. Like Lily said, there was definitely TP loss for wild pets, but I suppose if you are a BST who always uses jug pets you may not have noticed. 8)

[layoneil]

Right, but MNK's only source of healing is potions and Chakra, DRG can pretty much solo anything as long as it doesn't have a big damage TP move. DRG can solo a lot more and has almost no resting time. MNK's will have downtime as a lot of mobs have some form of ability to go through shadows or get through them (either a conic damage move or a multi-hit move that'll remove shadows and hit you). You're not going to win an argument that MNK can solo as well as DRG.

not going to argue that MNK is better but what's wrong with downtime if you also kill the mob faster? MNKs tend to kill faster with Counterstance. Subtle Blow and Penance counters the shadow stripping WS.

[lotmorning]

have not seen any parses where this is definitely not true for MNK vs DRG on neutral mob types when both jobs use the same sub (be it WAR, NIN or THF).

I've never been one to restrict pts to only certain jobs, but in all my meriting as brd or mnk i have never seen a drg /nin while now a days if a mnk isnt /nin they wont get invited so saying one job is so much better then nother job is just going to go around in circles. cause mnk has no need to /thf while drg can for sneak attack and mnks cant /war but drg can go drg/war cause of jumping to lose hate. all jobs have a way of bringing out the best in a certain situation

[evilpaul]

Let's have another thread about how Dragoons were previously not invited to parties because no one understood the awesome power of Fluffy their pet dragon.

That-Is-Be-Cause-Their-Da-Mage-Was-Too-Low. If that were made equal, what does a MNK really have? The past is irrelevant, only the present means anything.

The monk has ... equal ... damage. It's almost as though equal == balance, who could have thought that DD classes would be balanced by their damage, and not by their toy pets or their Chakras.

So a DRG and MNK should do the same amount of damage in a merit situation, but then the DRG can also solo mobs MNK's cannot, and although in less than ideal situations, be an additional healer? That's not truly balanced. The goal should be for MNK to be slightly higher in ideal gear, but close enough it's not a huge difference, and that if you're fighting a piercing weak mob DRG will be the superior choice (like say Colibri).

DRG evades like a brick, MNK evades like a gimpy NIN or very gimpy THF and subs NIN for shadows. Both jobs can solo albeit differently.

[Ithorien]

Directly from POL, although I'm sure some of you guys did this yourselves.

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- In the damage calculation when the both hands arms are equipped,
the upper bound correction of the damage value doesn't hang correctly.


- Pet TP of the beast use keeps decreasing gradually on a noncombat.

- The status of automaton has lowered more than originally.

- Whenever a specific head and the frame are combined, automaton start
chanting magic.

[LD]

Just to wrap the DRG thing up as I see it.

Jump & High Jump recast cut in half.
Healing Breath auto-Activation on Melee sub Wyvern at 25% HP.

There, you made you more powerful and gave you a unique support ability.
Mazel Tov.

[Eaglestrike]

Right, but MNK's only source of healing is potions and Chakra, DRG can pretty much solo anything as long as it doesn't have a big damage TP move. DRG can solo a lot more and has almost no resting time. MNK's will have downtime as a lot of mobs have some form of ability to go through shadows or get through them (either a conic damage move or a multi-hit move that'll remove shadows and hit you). You're not going to win an argument that MNK can solo as well as DRG.

not going to argue that MNK is better but what's wrong with downtime if you also kill the mob faster? MNKs tend to kill faster with Counterstance. Subtle Blow and Penance counters the shadow stripping WS.

A solo MNK will not be countering much at all, because you can only counter if you have no shadows up and if you're taking any hits you'll have to rest. Without the damage from counter, if DRG and MNK does the same amount of damage there won't be a kill speed difference between the jobs, and DRG will still have no downtime, as well as the ability to solo harder mobs because there are still going to be mobs MNK will not be able to solo that DRG can. As a THF, who has much higher evasion and a better healing source through bolts than MNK there are mobs DRG can solo I cannot.

[kuronosan]

- In the damage calculation when the both hands arms are equipped,
the upper bound correction of the damage value doesn't hang correctly.

The heck?

[GSDragoon]

DRG has downtime unless they have wyrm armet and ethereal earring, or are fighting bones/pots with at least spirit taker.

EDIT: Also, if the mobs don't hit above 33, they don't get any mp back. Which is one downside to the signet bonus.

[Ithorien]

- In the damage calculation when the both hands arms are equipped,
the upper bound correction of the damage value doesn't hang correctly.

The heck?

It's quoted through Excite JP's translator, the best web translator I could ever find that does complete sentences :/

[lotmorning]

literal JP translation