Strategies to Defeat AV (All Theories/Ideas Here)

[Not Kuno]

Good evening. Before we proceed, please note my post count. Moving forward.

SE has stated in the past that AV's Mechanics have been altered since his last set of defeats.

I have an idea.

Seriously.

Gather several Ls's in sea, several hundred ppls.

CFH.

Defeat AV.

Kaludneisucks, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

That was the only good part of that entire movie, lol.

[draxyl]

Good evening. Before we proceed, please note my post count. Moving forward.

SE has stated in the past that AV's Mechanics have been altered since his last set of defeats.

I have an idea.

Seriously.

Gather several Ls's in sea, several hundred ppls.

CFH.

Defeat AV.

Kaludneisucks, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

That was the only good part of that entire movie, lol.

Um, the penguin bit is hilarious. And, stop looking at me swan.

[Heie]

Good evening. Before we proceed, please note my post count. Moving forward.

SE has stated in the past that AV's Mechanics have been altered since his last set of defeats.

I have an idea.

Seriously.

Gather several Ls's in sea, several hundred ppls.

CFH.

Defeat AV.

Kaludneisucks, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

That was the only good part of that entire movie, lol.

Don't you say that. Don't you ever say that. Stay here, as long as you can. Cherish it. For God's sake cherish it.

http://www.filmwise.com/visual/face_01/image_01.jpg

[Not Kuno]

Ok ok there were a few good parts. But man that scene made me laugh so hard lol.

[Belkin]

Mahman was money. "And may God have mercy on your soul."

How bout you Sideburns, you want some of this milk?

[Angelsin]

Good evening. Before we proceed, please note my post count. Moving forward.

SE has stated in the past that AV's Mechanics have been altered since his last set of defeats.

I have an idea.

Seriously.

Gather several Ls's in sea, several hundred ppls.

CFH.

Defeat AV.

Was done on Siren. AV > Siren.

Details:
http://www.sirenffxi.com/modules.php?na ... pic&t=8343

[Mojo]

I've been procrastinating this post, but here goes.

Saturday we did our routine Jailer of Love session. Going back to my previous big post, we intended to verify exactly what breaks the regen in its entirety. We held our first Jailer of Love for around an hour without doing any kind of damage(with the exception of the occasional Dia I). We were about to get the regen to completely break around the 45-50 minute mark. Our tank was casting Bind to keep hate and it was Iceday for about five minutes, but I am skeptical that affected it given the strong time correlation all of the verified complete regen breaks share. So, given all of our testing thus far, it seems that each pet will result in a small amount of regen loss until it's completely broken.

Luckily, AV finally decided to pop after our first Jailer of Love for the day and we were able to prove a few things.

The wynayvs it summoned were always ABC. If I had to guess, I'd say based on other accounts that DEF will be summoned at the 59% mark and don't have anything to do with locking AV.

I'm fairly certain that my suspicion of AV gaining and losing certain job traits upon activating a two hour ability holds to be true. The last two hour ability AV used before finishing us off for the first time was Meikyo Shisui. While we were recoving, the level 1 person necro holding it was getting WS'd before AV even pulled out its weapons. Later, when the two hour ability it had previously used was Chainspell, he was able to run a relatively large distance before it caught up and melee'd him to death.

We were also able to confirm how effective Fealty is.

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/8467/meteor1mh7.png
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/7804/meteor2bz1.png

We made a few attempts at holding it without dieing. We had a decent amount of people, but not enough to do it smoothly. It went decent for never having attempted this before. We were able to survive through Chainspell, although our tank died on the very last spell >_>.

We handled the wynavs by having people kite them away and have melee beat them down to 5% so Mijin Gakure wouldn't kill us. Each wynav was assigned a tank and a RDM. We'd set a time for the main ally and the kiters to engage which went off without a hitch. The wynavs can't be stunned, but they are susceptible to Silence and Gravity(although they should theoretically build up a Gravity resist). It's a good idea to pull with Silence and apply Gravity once they're a safe distance away then Silence stun any ga spells. Once you've weakened them to 5%, a RDM + NIN should easily be able to hold them without kiting. AV did use Mijin Gakure once. It was right when we pulled(Wynavs doing Mijin, only hitting the wynav ally), so we didn't exactly get to see if weaking them to 5% worked, although I see no reason why it wouldn't.

Unfortunately, we didn't get to try everything I'd like to try. Hopefully it will pop again during our next session, maybe by then SE will have released some information. Either way, I think we've proved it can be held indefinitely. Each of our attempts went on for about five minutes before we wiped from Chainspell or Manafont. We could have survived and continued through both of these situations if we had taken a few more measures, which we'll do next time. I'll probably post more about this later, I'm tired so this will have to be it for now.

[Demosthenes11]

did you get any 2handers beating on it while you had it out? I'm curious how magic damage vs. physical damage is now. With 4-6 pld/nin, 3 nin, 5-6 rdm, 8 whm, 10blm'ish, perhaps a cure rotation is possible? <.<
Iirc, blm nukes were not a problem at all in regards to hate. If you have a cure rotation so that all whms arnt gaining hate so quickly...
I'd suggest rdm/nin tanks but they dont have the hp to withstand any of the magic.

I'm not so sure why, but for some reason I'm leaning toward AV's shit not being lockable, especially if it summons different wynavs the lower it goes

[Thevaultdweller]

did you get any 2handers beating on it while you had it out? I'm curious how magic damage vs. physical damage is now. With 4-6 pld/nin, 3 nin, 5-6 rdm, 8 whm, 10blm'ish, perhaps a cure rotation is possible? <.<
Iirc, blm nukes were not a problem at all in regards to hate. If you have a cure rotation so that all whms arnt gaining hate so quickly...
I'd suggest rdm/nin tanks but they dont have the hp to withstand any of the magic.

I'm not so sure why, but for some reason I'm leaning toward AV's shit not being lockable, especially if it summons different wynavs the lower it goes

Benediction has to be lockable at the very least, or it truly will be impossible.

[Mojo]

We didn't get around to trying that, unfortunately. I think PLD/NIN is a complete necessity for successfully tanking it without running the risk of death or large disruption. This is mainly due to Manafont, Hundred Fists(although you could theoretically use Shadowbind), and Soul Voice. As far as how to handle AV goes, I'm thinking the 'ideal' set up is as follows.

PLD/NIN
PLD/NIN
RDM
BRD
COR
BLU/SMN

WHM
WHM
WHM
WHM
BRD
RDM

You need to pull it to the entrance so Meteor won't wipe you, you'll also need at least two other PLD/NIN on standby. The Cor is giving Magus' Roll, enhanced by the presence of the Blue Mage, as well as Evoker's Roll. The BLU is doing Diamondhide and Shining Ruby. There are a few two hour abilities that require an immediate response.

Hundred Fists

Pop Sentinel, the end.

Chainspell

The BLU uses Diffusion + Saline Coat. Your tank best geared towards magic defense should pop Sentinel to reduce hate loss and the chance of dieing from a gaIII + weaponskill combo, the other tank should pull out of ga range until Chainspell is over. The WHM can utilize a Cure V order to conserve MP as well as Cure V overlap and even hate distribution. We didn't have a BLU nor did we have a Cure V order and our tank almost survived the entire length of Chainspell with 4 WHM. A Baraero set up could also prove effective.

Manafont

Both PLD pop Fealty(You'd have a dead PLD otherwise). Sentinel may also be a good idea to reduce enmity loss. A Cure V order shouldn't be necessary to keep you alive, but you might as well maintain it. Maybe split your WHMs between each PLD. When Manafont is over, one of your tanks needs to gradually lose hate and be replaced by another PLD who has Fealty charged.

Soul Voice

One of your PLD pops Fealty. AV will spam Virelai, which should get resisted. If you didn't use Fealty here, your tanks would get charmed and lose hate, causing much ruckus. Having one tank become charmed shouldn't cause too much trouble. They should be able to get back up on the hate list before AV uses another two hour ability and you want to conserve Fealty when you can.

As far as if completely locking AV is possible, it's difficult to form a solid opinion. It seems highly unlikely that AV locking was just some random bug. I think at the very least there could be a method to lower the frequency at which AV uses two hour abilities. I don't think it would be possible to win without this because of Benediction.

Our plan of action for the next AV is to zerg it with skillchains + magic bursts that corresponde to the current Vana'diel day, Raise, and repeat for a while. Afterwards, we'll do some wynav killing. I would really like to at least verify a regen break and see what happens.

[Kaludneisucks]

Thank You Angelsin. Fun read.

[Lordender]

last time my ls popped it and decided to mess with it we were able to hold it for like 7mins. I managed to nuke all my mp on it, the resists were non-existant and did wyrm damage, 766 burst II low 500 thunder IV's. I ran after my mp was out and managed to escape the meteor that killed everyone like 20 seconds later.

[TB]

did you get any 2handers beating on it while you had it out? I'm curious how magic damage vs. physical damage is now. With 4-6 pld/nin, 3 nin, 5-6 rdm, 8 whm, 10blm'ish, perhaps a cure rotation is possible? <.<
Iirc, blm nukes were not a problem at all in regards to hate. If you have a cure rotation so that all whms arnt gaining hate so quickly...
I'd suggest rdm/nin tanks but they dont have the hp to withstand any of the magic.

I'm not so sure why, but for some reason I'm leaning toward AV's shit not being lockable, especially if it summons different wynavs the lower it goes

Benediction has to be lockable at the very least, or it truly will be impossible.

Could you guys please, for the lord of god, fucking stop posting the retarded "Need to lock bene" shit? WE ALL FUCKING KNOW. We all know everyone is pissed at this mob and most of the linkshells on all servers already gave up.

As you might have noticed, the only way to finally figure out this damn mob is by a step by step learning, but yet this thread is full of retarded ebony panels and jailer weapon comments. Is this still the biggest endgame forum serverwide or not? If yes, then finally act like it is and stop posting useless comments like that.

Mojo I really appreciate sharing all this information here nonetheless. Keep at it and ignore the idiots. >_>

[Therin]

I am confused as to why those Meteors did so little damage to your PLD. I have used Fealty tons, and I've never seen it resist spells as well as enfeebles (for instance, getting hit with Quake II on JoF when you're trying to resist Breakga will still do 1500-2000 damage) - is there something special about Meteor that makes Fealty resist it?

[Max™]

Holy shit, someone actually trying shit with AV.

That Fealty thing is like the first big break I think I've seen in forever, perhaps it's just something special about Fealty that makes it resist Meteor? Is that the Eureka moment?

Please, for the love of god, if you get a Regen Break and run out of ideas, think you would be up for trying the old Wyvnav locking method after his regen is stopped?

I still search from time to time and haven't seen where this has been done with a full regen lock and then the old wyvnav time nuking is tried.

Worst case, it's another idea proven wrong.


Kudos on trying though.

[Phraust]

Considering my exerience this weekend on JoL/AV I came up with a theory, kinda wanted to ask a question here.

iirc, didn't a group kill JoL that kept Bene'ing notice the bene's doing less? Or am I totally off?

Either way, perhaps the trick it destroying AV's "Top end" HP. I.E. somethign like JoL's "Regen" depletion.

Theory:

Some way like a "Same Day Element" skillchain to deplete AV's HP 'cap'.

I.E. Firesday, AV has 40k HP, doing liquifaction for 200 lowers it's HP cap to 39,800 HP, and subsequent Bursts lower that value further or something.

Could be what they meant by "Destroying it's regen". In short, maybe you are suppose to keep letting it Bene, and just whittle away at it's max HP?

[Max™]

120,000 Hp, last I checked.

The idea has come up in various forms, one version was to see if he would Spirit Link himself to death if his Wyvnavs were held at 1%.

No luck so far.

[Phraust]

120,000 Hp, last I checked.

The idea has come up in various forms, one version was to see if he would Spirit Link himself to death if his Wyvnavs were held at 1%.

No luck so far.

Yeah I just pulled a number out my ass.

Spirit linking is a little different than attackign it's HP max. I read around and don't remember seeing that. Hrmmm.... Someone said they were goign to give tips/video etc at fanfest... I still smell bullshit, but we'll see...

[Hanyoko]

Some way like a "Same Day Element" skillchain to deplete AV's HP 'cap'.

I.E. Firesday, AV has 40k HP, doing liquifaction for 200 lowers it's HP cap to 39,800 HP, and subsequent Bursts lower that value further or something.

Could be what they meant by "Destroying it's regen". In short, maybe you are suppose to keep letting it Bene, and just whittle away at it's max HP?

I've generally thought something similar.
"Same Day Element" = weaken AV
"other elements" = strengthen AV

No real proof to go either way.

[Mytiwar]

Good job Mojo.