Zhayolm: 1F, 5F, 6F Poroggo Madames Info

[aurik]

Attempted to reproduce this. Failed.

Here's what we did:
Entered late on Iceday, 77%~ Waxing moon

1F) 4 inner rooms, then 4 MMJ. Opened door before the last Mamool died.
Port @ ~15
2F) NE NW SW SE full clear. Did NOT pop the card NM. Did not open any doors manually
Port @ 35
3F) All south mamools + pets. Did NOT touch rampart or madame. Opened door last.
Port North @ 45
4F) All 6 mamools, opened door, 3rd rampart, Marid.
Port @ 59
5F) No frog, trained the floor, still no frog after opening the door
Port @ ~64
6F) Cleared the floor entirely, no frog
Port @ ~78

[Genosync]

for the sake of curiousity, did you meet:

I am willing to entertain the possibility of a condition being "at least one member of the alliance has no Pathos effects."

'cause yeah there's a good thought there

[Almalexia]

for the sake of curiousity, did you meet:

I am willing to entertain the possibility of a condition being "at least one member of the alliance has no Pathos effects."

'cause yeah there's a good thought there

Two members were completely unlocked and Pathos-free by the end of the third floor: myself (MNK) and Zilong (NIN).

[Sifer]

for the sake of curiousity, did you meet:

I am willing to entertain the possibility of a condition being "at least one member of the alliance has no Pathos effects."

'cause yeah there's a good thought there

Two members were completely unlocked and Pathos-free by the end of the third floor: myself (MNK) and Zilong (NIN).

I think that question was for aurik :X but i would like to know if there was one in kaino's second run as well (although the way they said it really suggest that they did but it wasnt the person that teleported to the next floor).

EDIT: keep in mind that full unlock would include job abilities for blms, mind and intelegence for melee, etc.

[tymora]

Following the fully unlocked arguments...

Assuming fully unlocked here means - Equips + Stats only (magic/ability/weapon/SJ doesn't count)

1st successful pop has 7 fully unlocked members. (Kaino)
If they only cleared the 4 central rooms as they said, there must be someone lacking Magic/Ability/SJ/Weapon. Please confirm this.

2nd successful pop has 5 fully unlocked members. (Almalexia)
Again, there must be someone without some of magic/ability/SJ. (Weapon can go 100% in this case since only 6 people.)

Aurik failed to pop it and he has only 2 fully unlocked members. Perhaps there is a certain number of fully unlocked people that is required?

Interestingly, if this is the pop condition, it can explain why there are absolutely so few cell drops on north path. No drops => force people to farm floor 1 and 2, perhaps 3. So perhaps the pathetic cell drops in the north path has been a clue all along? It can also explain why it has hardly been popped since we are all always in a hurry to reach some floors. Perhaps south side = be in a hurry, north side = take it slow.

Hopefully my group will be willing to test this in some way.

[dyluck]

Why would you assume magic/ability/weapon/SJ don't count towards being fully unlocked? They each have their own pathos status associated with them.

Alma's SS clearly shows at least one member is completely pathos free. I think that may be closer on track. I don't see why magic/ability/weapon/SJ wouldn't count. Interestingly enough this is the one area Aurik didn't mention about his clone run.

[Xerlic]

Maybe the person who initiates the Salvage has to be completely Pathos free for it to pop?

[Sifer]

well, if this pop condition was real, a normal group would fully gear their tanks anyway, only thing that they'd have to do is give them MND/INT/CHR and they'll have at least 1 person thats fully unlocked.

[Suiram]

Tanks should be the first people getting INT anyway after BLMs and RDMs (and possibly RNG/THF for acid bolts).

[Wizerd]

Tanks should be the first people getting INT anyway after BLMs and RDMs (and possibly RNG/THF for acid bolts).

Agreed. It helps a ton.

[Gwynplaine]

Honestly, this has just got to be it. If it's not I give up because it just explains everything perfectly.

It explains why all the groups that spawned it farmed most of every room on 2F.
It explains why all the groups that spawned it farmed most of 3F south.
It explains how it could be spawned when entering the floor, and also be spawned after entering if someone waits to use cells.
It could explain how randomly it seems to spawn for some groups and not others with little or no other noted differences.

Looking at the zone as a whole it also makes sense why the cell drop rates are so generous from 1F-4F, after which cells simply do not drop at all. Which would make 4F essentially a "last chance" floor to get what you need. You could farm the poroggo if you didn't farm the easier mobs on the early floors, which are much harder but still a chance at unlocking before 5F. At the same time it gives some purpose to 4FN numbered ramparts. If somehow you don't have the HP/MP/equip cells you need even after farming mobs, you can intentionally choose the wrong rampart to respawn mobs to farm for cells (someone may have said mobs, or at least poroggo don't reset?).

Most the time if a group takes a similar route like most have to spawn the NM the tank would naturally be nearly fully unlocked. Aside from the obvious, they should also get INT for magdef, and MND for chi-blast. It's probably the damn CHR cell that has made the spawns seem utterly fucking random.

The next thing that comes to mind if the madame can be spawned by X number of people being fully unlocked, is whether 6F is spawned by having 3-5 members fully unlocked before entering? Time is crucial trying to do anything in salvage, so it would make sense why 6F has never been reported to spawn seeing as how such a condition would take some extra time/farming/planning on the parties part.

[Sifer]

If this was true the last floor would most likely be everyone (or just 6) must be fully unlocked. My group wont go till wednesday so I cant test anything yet.

[Sagacious Sundi]

Since 2F/3F/4F/5F spawn conditions don't seem to be similar, I don't see why 6F would have 5F-like conditions. D: Still holding on killing X NMs for the sixth floor.

I also noticed something that also supports the idea that only 5FN/6F drop 35 armor: There's 2 madames of "each type" if they are that idea is true. (2 cell madames, 2 lv15 madames, 2 crate madame, and 2 lv35 madames)

[Wizerd]

Honestly, this has just got to be it. If it's not I give up because it just explains everything perfectly.

It explains why all the groups that spawned it farmed most of every room on 2F.
It explains why all the groups that spawned it farmed most of 3F south.
It explains how it could be spawned when entering the floor, and also be spawned after entering if someone waits to use cells.
It could explain how randomly it seems to spawn for some groups and not others with little or no other noted differences.

Looking at the zone as a whole it also makes sense why the cell drop rates are so generous from 1F-4F, after which cells simply do not drop at all. Which would make 4F essentially a "last chance" floor to get what you need. You could farm the poroggo if you didn't farm the easier mobs on the early floors, which are much harder but still a chance at unlocking before 5F. At the same time it gives some purpose to 4FN numbered ramparts. If somehow you don't have the HP/MP/equip cells you need even after farming mobs, you can intentionally choose the wrong rampart to respawn mobs to farm for cells (someone may have said mobs, or at least poroggo don't reset?).

Most the time if a group takes a similar route like most have to spawn the NM the tank would naturally be nearly fully unlocked. Aside from the obvious, they should also get INT for magdef, and MND for chi-blast. It's probably the damn CHR cell that has made the spawns seem utterly fucking random.

The next thing that comes to mind if the madame can be spawned by X number of people being fully unlocked, is whether 6F is spawned by having 3-5 members fully unlocked before entering? Time is crucial trying to do anything in salvage, so it would make sense why 6F has never been reported to spawn seeing as how such a condition would take some extra time/farming/planning on the parties part.

Your only flaw in all of this (and it's a mighty big flaw at that) is that these new spawns are talking about 5FN - never before seen until a couple days ago. 5FS could be related to the pathos thing, yes, but we have no evidence of it because no one's been keeping track of that. For now we have to assume that while 5FN and 5FS may have similarities in their conditions, they are still a little bit different (assumption would be that 5FS is easier than 5FN, base on 3F/4F condition sets). It's definitely worth trying on 5FS though, having 1 person fully unlocked and then checking the spawn.

Perhaps 5FS is having at least 1 person without pathos on them, while 5FN is having the entry character fully unlocked?

[Sifer]

if it was kill X NMs for 6F madame to pop, people would've poped it before 5FN and 5FS.

[tymora]

Why would you assume magic/ability/weapon/SJ don't count towards being fully unlocked? They each have their own pathos status associated with them.

You get 2 weapons, 1 to 2 magic, 1 to 2 ability, 1 SJ, and some other cells from the initial chest. If you only clear the 4 middle rooms, you get an extra 4 weapons, 4 magic, 4 ability and 4 SJ. Since if you get 2 magic, you get only 1 ability and vice versa, this means that for a party of 6 people, you can at most get:

6 weapons (All unlocked)
(5 magic & 6 ability) OR (6 ability & 5 ability)
5 Subjobs

You won't get these cells again out of Floor 1 so you can safely assume at least 1 person in a group of 6(Almalexia's) and 2 in the case of (Kaino's) doesn't have these unlocked.

[aurik]

We had 6 of 7 completely unlocked.

[Sifer]

We had 6 of 7 completely unlocked.

so much for the idea <_>

well then, i still say its not about killing NMs on previous floors.. something gotta be different with that path for it to pop the NM.

[Uzor]

Poroggo Madame 5th floor north popped and killed, dropped 35 Skadi legs.

Screenshots once run is over.

[Lyramion]

F5 F5 F5