Too much TH can be a bad thing?

[Dammerung]

The only constant on coffer key drops is you will get one on your first kill when nobody in your party has any need for it.

[SchuldigGER]

Would anyone with TH4 like to repeat my experiment? :D

Done it a lot and swapped in and out A Armlets or T knife.
Equipped +th raises your chances extremely.
You only had bad luck. Which i had to suffer too at times. ( up to 3 hours of farming )

I have done coffer key farming at certain areas for up to 3 months each area.
And old school Th4 was a curse , had to help many friends for coffer farming.


Castle O.:

only coffer key drop area before the Genkai 3 pit , monks and bard type yagudos drop bad.
Nin and blm drop better.
average 30-180 minute droppers.

Garbage shitadel :
best droppers for coffer key =weapon type mobs they are across serket area.
average 5-10 minute droppers.

Badeaux:
4 door room
average 30-180 minute drop

Davoi:
after monastic caverns exit and stay right cross the bridge kill all mobs before monastic caverns entrance to the Genkai area dragoons drop well.
average 5-10 minute drop

Castle zvahl:
best droppers in the middle section 24hr NM area.
average 30-180 minute drop

Den of Rancor:
drop best drop of eyes and tonberries
average 30 minute

Uggalepih temple:
best drop of Rogberry area and further downstairs
average 30 minute

Nest:
best dropped of scorpions at the coffer spawn section
average 5-10 minute

eldieme:
average 60-120 minute dropper

quicksand:
average 20 minute drop at the loxley bow Nm area is easy and quick

cauldron key:
easiest are wespes
average 10-20 minute drop

grotto:
best droppers are eyes
average 30 minute drop

Just read this again, and yep its still just as ridiculous and baseless... it kills even more that this person has a Ridill before me .

But if someone can dig up the link to those JP tests i would definitely be intrigued.

If you would read closely you would notice that your statement is ridiculous.
how can you say its baseless when he writes down his personal experience from 3 months of cofferkey farming ?
Ppl that cant read / just say yes and amen, shouldnt be in line for a riddil at all

[spooky]

Please stop crying about Riddils in my thread, cheers.
Back on topic, I went farming again last night in Garlaige Citadel (again with TH4+) we got a key very quickly (3 kills iirc).
However, these mobs don’t drop Tests. My original thought was that TH+4 was making the Tests more likely to drop and taking up the spot where a key could drop; and that by removing 1 TH, made the Tests less likely to drop giving the Key a better chance.
Has anyone seen a Key and Test drop in the same loot pool?

[Septimus]

Sometimes you get the bear, sometimes the bear gets you.

This is the correct answer.

The only constant on coffer key drops is you will get one on your first kill when nobody in your party has any need for it.

I noticed this effect when I was leveling my Adventuring Fellows- there were plenty of nights in Clawrar's Nest where I would get 2-3 coffer keys in 30 kills. At first I thought that maybe Attacker Fellows have a native Treasure Hunter rate, but I noticed that it never works when I go somewhere to specifically farm for a coffer key. The trick is to never say that you are going to farm for a coffer key in the game, it parses your text and will adjust your drops downward. Instead, before you go say something along the lines of "Boy, this is going to be a very productive NPC leveling session, I hope that my inventory doesn't get cluttered with worthless junk" in your linkshell. This has the effect of fooling the Fun Inhibitor Engine™ into thinking that throwing a bunch of coffer keys at you will ruin your night.

And yes, this was totally facetious. But really, you do get a lot of Coffer Keys that you don't want/need while leveling an Adventuring Fellow.

[evilpaul]

I think some keys just drop more often than others. Whether they share a slot with testimonies and whether massive TH lowers their droprates I have no idea.

[Nirokun!]

if you want a coffer key, ask your local beastmaster

[Woozie]

...And yes, this was totally facetious...

Actually, I think you were on to something...

[Septimus]

...And yes, this was totally facetious...

Actually, I think you were on to something...

Sometimes the Fun Inhibitor Engine™ is the only logical explanation.

[Khamsin]

Slightly off-topic but on the same thread, what do you guys think about the following:

An extremely comprehensive (thousands and thousands of trials) study was done about TH, from TH1 through TH4, by the JP community about a year ago. Mobs with well-known drop tables were killed thousands of times to establish the percentage chance of each drop.

TH1 shifted the cutoff percentages of all items down by 1%. The loot tables are done by basically /random'ing and looking up in a table of loot, so for instance if a mob had this as it's table:

Random Value:
0-500 = Crappy Item #1
500-750 = Somewhat Crappy Item #2
750-900 = Mediocre Item #3
900-975 = Decent Item #4
975-999 = Good Item #5

Treasure hunter served to push the cutoffs for all of those down by almost exactly 1%, so:
0-490 = Crappy Item #1
490-740 = Somewhat Crappy Item #2
...etc, etc...
965-999 = Good Item #5

Each progressive TH was another 1% downwards.

If I remember right, the study took nearly 7 weeks and 60,000+ trials against the same mob. The results were accurate to within +/- .01% All other claims about how TH works are essentially just placebo and wishful thinking.

When I first read this, I dismissed it because of the lack of sources and how it didn't explain how TH made such a dramatic difference in # of items dropped from monsters like rams. However, reading OP made me go back and find/reread this. Any opinions?

If someone can actually find those tests, then we'd have something to work with

However, I do recall someone doing tests on tonberry coats? or something like that which also proved +1% >_> but I don't remember who/when just that it was on the forums, now lost in the annals of time

I recall a test on Giant Bird Plumes that also showed it was 1%, so there's 3 independant tests so far that all conclude the same thing.

Now, if assume TH1 is +1% like those tests conclude, does this mean that TH1+TH2+TH3+TH4 = +4%? Or does the strength of TH2, TH3, and TH4 each differ from TH1?

[Sepuku]

I recall a test on Giant Bird Plumes that also showed it was 1%, so there's 3 independant tests so far that all conclude the same thing.

Now, if assume TH1 is +1% like those tests conclude, does this mean that TH1+TH2+TH3+TH4 = +4%? Or does the strength of TH2, TH3, and TH4 each differ from TH1?

I never made a % test with non th, i only farm with thf.
But your theory sounds logical to me.
And that 4% finally adds to the overall drop percentage of the targeted item.
And with more people in your party as thf everyone gets an additional roll for the loot with higher percentage.

btw. which tests can i have a link?

[Aireiya]

Now, if assume TH1 is +1% like those tests conclude, does this mean that TH1+TH2+TH3+TH4 = +4%? Or does the strength of TH2, TH3, and TH4 each differ from TH1?

I don't remember where exactly I got the information from, as I found it copypasta'd into one of the many random ffxi related txt files I have lying around, but I remember a post further down where he said that the TH's were additive. So TH4 = 4%.

The loot table system with rolls for items sound somewhat unintuitive though. I guess a possibility is that the game rolls a set number of times for each monster, with each roll having 0-whatevernumber be 'player receives nothing'. So possible example:

Bumblebee's loot table is: rarab tail, insect wing, honey. So the roll numbers would be split into 4 sections - nothing > rarab tail > insect wing > honey. Maybe the game rolls 3 times for every bumblebee kill so that it's possible that a player receives a rarab tail, insect wing, and honey on the same kill. That would mean that every TH+1 would make one of these items (the 'good' one) drop 1% more often.

Does this system sound logical? If this is how the system is supposed to work, how does adding party members or alliance members change things?

[Eaglestrike]

I don't recall seeing a test about TH1 and TH2 effects. The test only showed the difference between TH2, TH3 and TH4 to be a 1% improvement per tier. That doesn't necessarily mean TH1 and TH2 are only 1% each, though it is possible that's what they are.

[DrObvious]

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=6072

He only tested with thief knife, and it increased both bird plume and giant feather drops by 1%. But since they are both th+1 it's safe to say they work the same.

I'm calling bs on th1&2 only being 1% each, droprate on common items seems massively enhanced compared to no th.

[spooky]

Now, if assume TH1 is +1% like those tests conclude, does this mean that TH1+TH2+TH3+TH4 = +4%? Or does the strength of TH2, TH3, and TH4 each differ from TH1?

I don't remember where exactly I got the information from, as I found it copypasta'd into one of the many random ffxi related txt files I have lying around, but I remember a post further down where he said that the TH's were additive. So TH4 = 4%.

The loot table system with rolls for items sound somewhat unintuitive though. I guess a possibility is that the game rolls a set number of times for each monster, with each roll having 0-whatevernumber be 'player receives nothing'. So possible example:

Bumblebee's loot table is: rarab tail, insect wing, honey. So the roll numbers would be split into 4 sections - nothing > rarab tail > insect wing > honey. Maybe the game rolls 3 times for every bumblebee kill so that it's possible that a player receives a rarab tail, insect wing, and honey on the same kill. That would mean that every TH+1 would make one of these items (the 'good' one) drop 1% more often.

Does this system sound logical? If this is how the system is supposed to work, how does adding party members or alliance members change things?

You've not taken into account Player vs. Mob level difference. For example: if you're exping at lowlevels you will get many more drops from mobs that are around the same level, then if you come back as Lv75 BLM and -ga3 100s of mobs at the same time.

[Lordwafik]

Now, if assume TH1 is +1% like those tests conclude, does this mean that TH1+TH2+TH3+TH4 = +4%? Or does the strength of TH2, TH3, and TH4 each differ from TH1?

I don't remember where exactly I got the information from, as I found it copypasta'd into one of the many random ffxi related txt files I have lying around, but I remember a post further down where he said that the TH's were additive. So TH4 = 4%.

The loot table system with rolls for items sound somewhat unintuitive though. I guess a possibility is that the game rolls a set number of times for each monster, with each roll having 0-whatevernumber be 'player receives nothing'. So possible example:

Bumblebee's loot table is: rarab tail, insect wing, honey. So the roll numbers would be split into 4 sections - nothing > rarab tail > insect wing > honey. Maybe the game rolls 3 times for every bumblebee kill so that it's possible that a player receives a rarab tail, insect wing, and honey on the same kill. That would mean that every TH+1 would make one of these items (the 'good' one) drop 1% more often.

Does this system sound logical? If this is how the system is supposed to work, how does adding party members or alliance members change things?

You've not taken into account Player vs. Mob level difference. For example: if you're exping at lowlevels you will get many more drops from mobs that are around the same level, then if you come back as Lv75 BLM and -ga3 100s of mobs at the same time.

You mean all those mobs that die unclaimed?

[Slott]

if ga3 hits a mob, you still get treasure. Easy to test too, done it several times to quadavs on the way to waughroon. Pull 1 quad, it mass links a shitload, ga3 one, flood in drops

[spooky]

Perhaps I should have clarified this, if you kill mobs you are many levels above; the drop-rate on all items decreases. If you don’t believe be try it for yourself.

[Aireiya]

Perhaps I should have clarified this, if you kill mobs you are many levels above; the drop-rate on all items decreases. If you don’t believe be try it for yourself.

I find this hard to believe. I'll go ahead and test this, but I'm going to say for now that this is just a myth about treasure drops. Do you really think that killing NM's at the appropriate lvl increases drop rate?

[spooky]

Perhaps I should have clarified this, if you kill mobs you are many levels above; the drop-rate on all items decreases. If you don’t believe be try it for yourself.

I find this hard to believe. I'll go ahead and test this, but I'm going to say for now that this is just a myth about treasure drops. Do you really think that killing NM's at the appropriate lvl increases drop rate?

I was talking about normal mobs.

[Sepuku]

Also please dont forget the fix that was made to prevent trains in 2004/5.
-ga killing crawlers at Buburimu Peninsula was the reason for lowering droprates on -ga and area
effect ws kills.
So whenever you kill a mob make sure you dont finish with an area kill.

RMTs stopped immediately after that patch.
Silk farming became a pain in the ass compared to pre patch.