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  1. #1
    Smells like Onions
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Some stupid general questions

    I'm coming back to FFXI in a few days, and I wanted to ask some questions. Not like most of these things have changed while I was away from the game, I should probably have known the answers to these questions back then too.
    But I guess I can't hide how a low-end player I've always been.
    So here we go:

    1) Can Double Attack, Triple Attack and Kick Attack process during a WS? I'm pretty confident DA can, but I was wondering... does it have a chance to process once for every WS, no matter how many hits that WS is composed of, or can it process once for every hit of the WS?

    2) I don't understand a lot about maths, I quit school early and I never really studies maths. I've tried to fully understand formulaes but I usually get lost through the process. Is it true that WS modifiers apply only to the first hit of a WS, in case we're talking about multi-hit WSs? If that's the case then going crazy about modifiers or macroswapping becomes kinda useless when you're using WSs with many hits, because the increase of damage from modifiers would apply only on the first hit and hence it would have a very minimal impact on the whole WS damage. Am I right?

    3) How do % bonuses on WS work? Like 100% TP 1.0, 200% TP 2.0 and 300% TP 3.0. I was wondering if it's a "regular" damage in crease, or a "stepped" damage increase.
    For example let's take into consideration the numbers I just wrote. If I execute a WS at 150% TP what happens? I get 1.5 modifier? Or I get 1.0 because I haven't reached the next "step" which is triggered at 200% TP? Has anybody ever tested this? Also because there are different bonuses with TP. Some WSs receives increased Critical Hits or increased accuracy, some others just receive increased damage according to a multiplier. How do these things work? Is Damage TP stepped? And if it is so, are accuracy and crithits+ stepped too, or "regular"? Has anybody ever dared to test this things? It would be interesting because sometimes you may want to "wait" one more turn to let that 185% TP turn into a 200, without "wasting" those 85% TP.

    There were a few more questions, but I think I've humiliated me and my ignorance enough. Thanks for your attention.

  2. #2
    Smells like Onions
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
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    Re: Some stupid general questions

    bump? ; ;

  3. #3
    Ridill
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Posts
    22,165
    BG Level
    10

    Re: Some stupid general questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey
    I'm coming back to FFXI in a few days, and I wanted to ask some questions. Not like most of these things have changed while I was away from the game, I should probably have known the answers to these questions back then too.
    But I guess I can't hide how a low-end player I've always been.
    So here we go:

    1) Can Double Attack, Triple Attack and Kick Attack process during a WS? I'm pretty confident DA can, but I was wondering... does it have a chance to process once for every WS, no matter how many hits that WS is composed of, or can it process once for every hit of the WS?
    Once per swing, up to 8 total attacks. No attack round, WS included, may exceed 8 attacks.

    2) I don't understand a lot about maths, I quit school early and I never really studies maths. I've tried to fully understand formulaes but I usually get lost through the process. Is it true that WS modifiers apply only to the first hit of a WS, in case we're talking about multi-hit WSs? If that's the case then going crazy about modifiers or macroswapping becomes kinda useless when you're using WSs with many hits, because the increase of damage from modifiers would apply only on the first hit and hence it would have a very minimal impact on the whole WS damage. Am I right?
    Just use STR. (Att needs to be an acceptable level as well, and acc as needed.)


    3) How do % bonuses on WS work? Like 100% TP 1.0, 200% TP 2.0 and 300% TP 3.0. I was wondering if it's a "regular" damage in crease, or a "stepped" damage increase.
    For example let's take into consideration the numbers I just wrote. If I execute a WS at 150% TP what happens? I get 1.5 modifier? Or I get 1.0 because I haven't reached the next "step" which is triggered at 200% TP? Has anybody ever tested this? Also because there are different bonuses with TP. Some WSs receives increased Critical Hits or increased accuracy, some others just receive increased damage according to a multiplier. How do these things work? Is Damage TP stepped? And if it is so, are accuracy and crithits+ stepped too, or "regular"? Has anybody ever dared to test this things? It would be interesting because sometimes you may want to "wait" one more turn to let that 185% TP turn into a 200, without "wasting" those 85% TP.
    It is in fact stepped, I honestly can't remember offhand if it's only at 100/200/300, or like 100/120/140 etc, but I'm 90% sure it's only on the 100's.


    There were a few more questions, but I think I've humiliated me and my ignorance enough. Thanks for your attention.
    um k np

  4. #4
    Campaign
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    Jul 2007
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    6,633
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    Re: Some stupid general questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey
    1) Can Double Attack, Triple Attack and Kick Attack process during a WS? I'm pretty confident DA can, but I was wondering... does it have a chance to process once for every WS, no matter how many hits that WS is composed of, or can it process once for every hit of the WS?
    TA and DA can process during WS, I don't know about Kick Attack but I see no reason why it shouldn't.
    As for processing... I think they can process for each hit of your WS, but there probably is a limit (think about Asuran Fists or Hexa Strike, they would become way too powerful if too many of those thingies were to process on the same WS). Maybe they can process only on the first say 2-3 hits of a WS? Oh and, as usual, DA and TA can't process at the same time, it's either one or the other. KA, supposing it works, can probably process in addition to DA or TA.

    2) I don't understand a lot about maths, I quit school early and I never really studies maths. I've tried to fully understand formulaes but I usually get lost through the process. Is it true that WS modifiers apply only to the first hit of a WS, in case we're talking about multi-hit WSs? If that's the case then going crazy about modifiers or macroswapping becomes kinda useless when you're using WSs with many hits, because the increase of damage from modifiers would apply only on the first hit and hence it would have a very minimal impact on the whole WS damage. Am I right?
    TP Multipliers apply only on the first hit of the WS, the others have a 1.0 bonus. I'm not sure but it should probably be the same for Attributes modifiers. Just dig around and check WS formulae, it's written in there.

    3) How do % bonuses on WS work? Like 100% TP 1.0, 200% TP 2.0 and 300% TP 3.0. I was wondering if it's a "regular" damage in crease, or a "stepped" damage increase.
    For example let's take into consideration the numbers I just wrote. If I execute a WS at 150% TP what happens? I get 1.5 modifier? Or I get 1.0 because I haven't reached the next "step" which is triggered at 200% TP? Has anybody ever tested this? Also because there are different bonuses with TP. Some WSs receives increased Critical Hits or increased accuracy, some others just receive increased damage according to a multiplier. How do these things work? Is Damage TP stepped? And if it is so, are accuracy and crithits+ stepped too, or "regular"? Has anybody ever dared to test this things? It would be interesting because sometimes you may want to "wait" one more turn to let that 185% TP turn into a 200, without "wasting" those 85% TP.
    Actually... this is a very good question, I've been wondering it myself.
    I honestly don't know but why don't you try it? Take a WS which is single hit and that has "Damage increases with TP" properties (no accuracy/critical TP thingies), then go in some low level area, like outside Bastok, and start getting TP and using it, being SAM or /SAM would help for meditate. Make sure you're a job that doesn't have DoubleAttack/TripleAttack/Kickattack or anything that could process during the WS to modify its damage.
    Create a macro that displays the TP value you have when you're using your WS, like for example /echo TP:<tp>; /ws "name" <t>
    Then use a chat logger like FFXIalarm and log everything, then after like a few hours (xD) filter so you can see in the log only combat data, and check
    Then check and see if after a lot of tries you see a damage increase at 150% too, or if the damage is the same-ish as 100% TP, and you need to be at 200+ to see a noticeable difference.
    I think a test such at this would show you how it works
    Well, at least for those WS that work as in More TP = More Damage. For the more accuracy and more crit hits ones I really have no idea, and not necessarily they work the same way as the TPdamage ones do.

  5. #5
    Campaign
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    Jul 2007
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    Re: Some stupid general questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Plow
    Once per swing, up to 8 total attacks. No attack round, WS included, may exceed 8 attacks.
    Oh... I knew this, I remember the KC and DA/TA discussions.
    I had completely forgot about it, thanks Plow.
    Well I talked about a "limit", here is your "limit" Monkey
    And yeah, this confirms what I said before, KA can process during WS, and can process at the same time as either DA or TA (but all in the limit of 8 hits).
    Each additional hit gives you 1% TP, for example the other day as lolPUP I used Howling Fist and got a TP return of 13%, while I usually get just 10% TP.
    That's probably because DA processed on the first hit of the WS, DA processed on the second hit of the WS, and KA processed on the attack turn (I had Bahamut's Hose equipped).

    That's how they work after all, DA and TA can process on each single "natural" hit of every attack turn. So for example if you're a monk or a job dualwielding, you have 2 "natural" hits for a full attack turn. On each of those hits DA or TA can process, if you have the Job Trait of course.
    KA works differently, KA doesn't process for each hit, but for the whole attack turn, no matter how many hits you have inside that turn, no matter if either DA or TA already processed.

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