Temp banned...

[Nighteagle]

texted me lol

[KimimaroKun]

Wow, i traded my 2 woodsman's for 2 sniper's one day, woke up the next and woodsman was 100k while snipers were 400k, i was shocked and confused but it looks like it is stabalizing again. And GO ME! I bought a 86k gil woody :3 (Even though i'll never need it sense i use Man/Joy).

Go Go Midgard Price Gouging! :3

[Mikichan]

texted me lol

Tell him to send you an SS and post it here >.>

[Nighteagle]

he plays on PS2, i doubt he took a picture with his cell phone or camera

[Sigi]

Oct. 5, 2007 Stikyfingas Inoue 300,000
Oct. 2, 2007 Galli Stikyfingas 300,000
Sep. 30, 2007 Mitha Mentor 160,000
Sep. 27, 2007 Stikyfingas Nephtis 300,000

I am going to assume stickyfingas was the person temp-banned.

No, that's NE's mule.

Basically Galli was the patsy temp-banned because NE wanted more gil.

Oh yes, NE's going to be another server's problem

Enjoy!

[Delekii]

I had a GM called on me for pretty much this exact same thing 6 months ago and nothing came of it. In fact what I did was probably much worse, I cleared the entire history of an item with blatantly obvious price fixing (did 10 sales to clear the entire history). Perhaps their charter has changed since then

[DAKPluto]

Temp banned for... capitalism?

aye comrade. Down with the imperalistic dogs!

[Sigi]

The big difference is you did it *by yourself*.
NE used several people by giving the gil to them then having them buy the item. Key words being more than one person and not just himself. So, essentially he setup a scam, and Galli got the tempbanhammer while he got away with the crime.
As far as price-fixing, see here

In neo-classical economics, price fixing is inefficient: the anti-competitive agreement by producers to fix prices above the market price transfers some of the consumer surplus to those producers and also results in a deadweight loss.

In the United States, price fixing can be prosecuted as a criminal felony offense under section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act. [1] In Canada, it is an indictable criminal offence under section 45 of the Competition Act. Bid rigging is considered a form of price fixing and is illegal in both the United States (s.1 Sherman Act) and Canada (s.47 Competition Act). In the United States, agreements to fix, raise, lower, stabilize, or otherwise set a price are illegal per se.[2] It does not matter if the price agreed upon is reasonable or for a good or altruistic cause; or if the agreement is explicit and formal or unspoken and tacit. In the United States, price-fixing also includes agreements to hold prices the same, discount prices (even if based on financial need or income), set credit terms, agree on a price schedule or scale, adopt a common formula to figure prices, banning price advertising, or agreeing to adhere to prices that one announces. [3] Although price fixing usually means sellers agreeing on price, it can also include agreements among buyers to fix the price at which they will buy products.

So yeah, it's really anti-capitalist of SE here

[evilpaul]

The US has all kinds of stupid laws. The US also isn't some capitalist utopia.

[Alistaire]

Quick honest question here: In the OP and reaffirmed later, you say "we did this once". Then someone posts a history of a few and you say "OK we did it a few times." So exactly how many times? Is that history someone posted the whole picture?

[ringthree]

Temp banned for... capitalism?

Price manipulation is capitalism? LOL

Supply and demand, if people weren't willing to pay they price, they wouldn't. Cursed Caps aren't exactly required. If people felt that paying 300k was unfair, they shouldn't do it. Eventually the price would go down.

No, actually it is manipulating price by trying to buy up all of the supply. This is anti-market. The market has already determined the price, individuals then manipulate the prices of items by messing with the supply. Of course the market will eventually re-set the price on the item, but that doesn't mean price manipulation is anything but anti-market.

Just because you know the words "Supply and Demand" doesn't make you an expert on economics.

[Fhqwghads]

If there's nothing in the ToS about this, then your friend was unjustly suspended. I'd have him contact a SGM through POL and find out more info. As far I know, there is nothing in the ToS regarding price manipulation. As others stated, people can either choose to buy at the artificial price, or wait until the price goes back down when nobody buys it. Whining to a GM about it is lame. Reminds me of a child throwing a temper tantrum about how "it's not fair."

[Alistaire]

Just had an idea, is there a way for SE to put some kind of id stamp on items recently auctioned? So history would indicate a # (like a serial #)with the item to show if it's just the same item being sold/bought over and over. Not a full solution since rmt generally buy large quantities of the item...maybe a tag on items bought from ah how much they were bought for? So if someone sold 10 Toreador Rings it would say the person (we'll use the random name "Stickyfingers" not to be confused with "Stickyfingas") to look like this:

"Previous seller of that 'serial #'" sold to Stickyfingers for 100k who sold to "SomeYoungNewb" for 300k.

Without the text would be best but format might be an issue....maybe:

100k <--"previous seller" <-Stickyfingers -> "SomeYoungNewb" -> 300k

So like a timeline going 2 ways. Oooh! Time! WotG! It could be a WotG Time theme!

Probably too hard to incorporate though.

And to Fhq, pretty sure there is (or should be) something in tos, not sure of the wording or where to get it. At work so can't look it up, anyone bored enough to find?

[ringthree]

And to Fhq, pretty sure there is (or should be) something in tos, not sure of the wording or where to get it. At work so can't look it up, anyone bored enough to find?

Not to mention that many things for which GM's can take action against players are not mentioned in the ToS.

[evilpaul]

So, buying a bunch of something for the "wrong reason" and calling that "anti-market" makes it unethical or immoral?

Price Manipulation: If a person lowers their prices and somebody doesn't like it, then it's predatory-pricing. If they raise them and somebody doesn't like it, then it's price-gouging.

All "price manipulation" laws do is criminalize an aspect of the basic workings of reality so that "me! me! me!" crybabies can feel like they're getting "justice" from politicians who are always looking for some "crisis" to intervene in to look important and useful. "Price manipulation" is specifically the crybabies run to the politicians and demand their Right to Buy at Yesterday's Prices be protected. Which isn't a right at all.

How people can look at a bunch of voluntary, mutually beneficial transactions between buyers and sellers of some good or service and come up with a crime from is beyond me. Well, not really. Puritan-types have been doing it for centuries and it accounts for most of the problems in the world.

P.S. In a game where SE basically created a player run economy and has NPCs who sell single Remedies for 22k, I'd say that suspending people for buying and selling shit off the AH is pretty fucking dumb.

[Fhqwghads]

And to Fhq, pretty sure there is (or should be) something in tos, not sure of the wording or where to get it. At work so can't look it up, anyone bored enough to find?

Not to mention that many things for which GM's can take action against players are not mentioned in the ToS.

And which anyone would be 100% correct in disputing. If there's nothing written down which a player can read to avoid a situation that could result in a ban, then that's SE's fault, not the player's. Someone can't be guilty if there's nothing defining a rule that was broken.

[ringthree]

So, buying a bunch of something for the "wrong reason" and calling that "anti-market" makes it unethical or immoral?

Price Manipulation: If a person lowers their prices and somebody doesn't like it, then it's predatory-pricing. If they raise them and somebody doesn't like it, then it's price-gouging.

All "price manipulation" laws do is criminalize an aspect of the basic workings of reality so that "me! me! me!" crybabies can feel like they're getting "justice" from politicians who are always looking for some "crisis" to intervene in to look important and useful. "Price manipulation" is specifically the crybabies run to the politicians and demand their Right to Buy at Yesterday's Prices be protected. Which isn't a right at all.

How people can look at a bunch of voluntary, mutually beneficial transactions between buyers and sellers of some good or service and come up with a crime from is beyond me. Well, not really. Puritan-types have been doing it for centuries and it accounts for most of the problems in the world.

P.S. In a game where SE basically created a player run economy and has NPCs who sell single Remedies for 22k, I'd say that suspending people for buying and selling shit off the AH is pretty fucking dumb.

Seriously, I don't think I have ever read a more completely uninformed string of babble ever. You literally said nothing, and you really know nothing about the term price manipulations or economics in general.

You also might want to look up the definition of collusion while you are looking up price manipulation, instead of just making up your own completely random definition.

[cassiraa]

I for one am highly interested in seeing his dialogue with a GM, explaining why he was temp banned and his rebuttal, etc.

This stinks a bit of unaccountability. Which GM did this and said it was AH, or is this what they are telling us they got banned for.

Scour the POL ToS, It's a player controlled economy and I'm pretty sure that the GMs don't have an official control. In an argument of whether they should or not, I think they should be able to intervene in some situations.
But the question is DID they have the right to as of when this occurred. How could he have known what he was doing was bannable. "General Decency" and "Economic Ethics" aren't something for a GM to denounce someone for.

[Diasura]

http://www.ffxiah.com/item.php?id=15327&sid=28

I got owned by RMT. I was about to buy those knowing that they cost 150k~, checked the price and saw 460k and cried a bit.

(Ok it might not be RMT, maybe just a player with a lot of mules, but I doubt it. Check the sale histories of the people buying and selling, they're all selling and buying similar items.)

[evilpaul]

So, buying a bunch of something for the "wrong reason" and calling that "anti-market" makes it unethical or immoral?

Price Manipulation: If a person lowers their prices and somebody doesn't like it, then it's predatory-pricing. If they raise them and somebody doesn't like it, then it's price-gouging.

All "price manipulation" laws do is criminalize an aspect of the basic workings of reality so that "me! me! me!" crybabies can feel like they're getting "justice" from politicians who are always looking for some "crisis" to intervene in to look important and useful. "Price manipulation" is specifically the crybabies run to the politicians and demand their Right to Buy at Yesterday's Prices be protected. Which isn't a right at all.

How people can look at a bunch of voluntary, mutually beneficial transactions between buyers and sellers of some good or service and come up with a crime from is beyond me. Well, not really. Puritan-types have been doing it for centuries and it accounts for most of the problems in the world.

P.S. In a game where SE basically created a player run economy and has NPCs who sell single Remedies for 22k, I'd say that suspending people for buying and selling shit off the AH is pretty fucking dumb.

Seriously, I don't think I have ever read a more completely uninformed string of babble ever. You literally said nothing, and you really know nothing about the term price manipulations or economics in general.

You also might want to look up the definition of collusion while you are looking up price manipulation, instead of just making up your own completely random definition.

What I've fogotten about economics is more than you know. Seriously: . Keep believing your statist, Keynesian, crybaby garbage, it'll serve those better informed around you quite well.