How are your Dynamis Shell Rules Setup

[Darkdreamer]

This is how the point system works for my shell (repost from our rules post on our forums):

1. For each run you attend, you will receive +2 points. For each run you miss, unexcused, you will be deducted 6 points (3 runs). If you have a RL excuse to why you are missing a run you will be only deducted 1 point. So if you work every Thursday and can come only Sunday, you will still be growing in points each week.

2. All points cap at 32. All city af2 are points free, all you need is to have 4 runs completed with the LS to lot them.
-Beaucidine AF2 = 12 points (6 runs)
-Xarcabard AF2 = 18 points (9 runs)
-Shadow item = 30 points (15 runs)

3. Points cannot be transferred to other people. If at any point in time I find that you are being 2-boxed by someone you and your friend will be penalized on points.

4. After you receive AF2/shadow item you will be deducted the amount of points that item costs.

5. Anyone with the right amount of points can lot on the corresponding AF2 (only if your job can equip it), so if a person has 12/18 and another person has 30 pts, you both can lot on Beaucidine/Xarcabard pieces.

6. If you miss a run you must inform me, or any other sack why you missed the run as soon as possible. You should inform a leader before the run if you can't make it or at the latest the next day; or it'll be considered an unexcused absence.

7. All Dynamis’ except Xarcabard are to be sponsored by the current sponsors. All 100's must be sold to the corresponding sponsor for 500k. You may keep the 100 if you upgrading a relic, but you must show me you have a level 3; I will not take your word for it.

7a. Since Xarcabard is no longer being sponsored 100s that are now won from this zone ONLY can be kept by the winner and they may do what they want with it. They can sell it to a sponsor, keep it for their own future upgrade, sell it out on the open market, etc.

8. Icelands AF2 will no longer go up for free lot without any loss of points. The order of precedence for AF2 drops in Icelands will be this:

1- Like now people with points and with the job level to wear it have initial rights to any AF2 drops in Icelands and lose full points. (this is not a change)

2- If nobody has comment then people with the job able to wear it will have the option to lot on the AF2 BUT it will cost them half points if they win.

3- If nobody meets the criteria of the first two THEN if someone with lotting rights (more than 4 runs) but not enough points to pay for half points have the option to lot on the AF2 and they will then go in the negative for however many they were short by. Until you make up those points you can continue to go into the negative and will not be permitted to lot on any Icelands until you are out of the negative.

4- If none of the above are met then the AF2 will free drop, NOBODY will lot.

We also have an initial Recruit Phase which works like this:

1) When a person first joins they enter in a "Recruit" phase. During this time you are not allowed to lot AF2 (unless I say it is ok). This time is used as an introduction period to the LS and it's rules and to see if you want to stay with us. During this time you are expected to show up to all runs you can get into (there will be no penalty if you can't go to a Dynamis you don't have clearance for). If you show you have very poor attendance, bring unwanted drama to the LS, or any other negative aspect to the shell you will not stay with the LS. During this time you will also not earn or lose any points. This Recruit period last for 4 completed runs with the shell.

2) Long absent members. LS members that were once apart of the LS for runs but end up taking long breaks, no matter the reason, will be subject to the possibility of going through a "Recruit" like phase again where they will not earn points for their first 4 runs. Typically the timeframe for being "reset" is being absent for 6-8 weeks. Depending on reason, length of absence, and prior attendance will dictate how much time away will be allowed without a reset. (Typically anymore more than 8 weeks a member gets fully reset). This is up for discussion and all sackholders are brought in on the discussion to determine whether a reset is necessary or not.

The reason for even doing this is in the interest of fairness to all members. While people are absent others have been able to make it and been working hard for their points and taking on any extra work left in an absence.


While I'm flexible with people on the above rules we've been going under these rules for quite awhile now. We used to run under a seniority based system. But that lead to accusations of favoritism and a hell of a lot of BS drama. Some of the senior members would just jump from AF to AF depending on runs and outright demand lotting rights to various rare Icelands AF2. When we changed to this sytem a handful of people quit because they couldn't manipulate the rules anymore in their favor. Only been a few incidents since of people unhappy due to losing lot. But generally everyone is happy.

Right now I'm currently upgrading Katana and have another sponsor upgrading polearm. Since we lack a 3rd full time sponsor at the moment we just share the lotting in places like Jueno and Glacier.

~Darkdreamer

[Medivac]

goof luck funding a relic by starting a dynamis shell. currency is at an almost all time low, and unless your getting consitant 100 peices you will lose money in the northlands and cop zones.

[Changz]

goof luck funding a relic by starting a dynamis shell. currency is at an almost all time low, and unless your getting consitant 100 peices you will lose money in the northlands and cop zones.

With mixed coin drops (Byne is the cheapest coin on Shiva, avg 5k each now), 200+ coins is profitable on our server at present. Northlands is pretty easy to break 200+ single coins even with a smaller group (~20+). CoP ones are harder to break 200+, but possible as well. The coin market is still dropping fast, meaning more coins per run will be necessary in the very near future to not operate at a loss.

[SephYuyX]

We recently updated our rules to be like this:

- 1 point for showing up @ gather together time.
- 1 point for being there till mega boss
- 1 point for staying until we're kicked
- Everyone picks one job which to lot, switching jobs resets points to 0

Then let's say SMN relic drops. Person with most points in SMN gets 1st dibs, they can pass if they have or don't want, goes down the line. No SMN's need it, it goes free lot.

Simple, eh?

We have seperate points for CoP since we split the costs on those among all attendees.

As to relic weapons, each run has one sponsor. They pay the 1mil for the glass and all currency goes into their upgrade. Seems to work well, but since I"m not doing a relic weapon I'm not sure if they're happy with it.

This is the way we sorta do it.

You get one point for showing up on time, and if you leave before the timer is up, you lose that point :3 We used to do -.5 if you left earlly, but I think we got rid of that, I dont remember.

Each person is allowed to chose the job they wish to obtain AF for when first entering the shell, and it has to be lvl65+. If they want to switch to another job, they will lose all of the points they have gained. If they obtain 5/5 AF, they are allowed to change to another job, but they will still lose half of their total points.

For lotting, who ever has the most points gets the item. You dont lose points for obtaining an item, so no one else will get AF untill that person(s) above them has obtained it. So if youre new to the shell, expect to wait awhile to get AF cuse youll have to either wait untill everyone in front of you has that peice, or if you can pass them in points. The wait isnt really too long now because most people have their AF, so a new a new person entering will probably get city drops fairly quick.

If a RNG item drops, and all RNG lotting people there have it, it will go into free lot. It will go into open lot with any 75RNG, then if no one has 75, anyone with 70+ can lot, if there are no 70~74 there, then 65+, then 60+ and then it's free lot for all if no one has RNG above 60.

You can obtain multipule AF per trip.
All non AF/Coins are free lot..

Did I forget anything?

I used to be in a shell long ago that would do the bidding system, if you had the points you could bid for it, but you would lose the points ofcourse. I prefer the current 'if you have the most points, youre getting all the af' system myself.

[Olo401]

goof luck funding a relic by starting a dynamis shell. currency is at an almost all time low, and unless your getting consitant 100 peices you will lose money in the northlands and cop zones.

If you can find someone to exclusively buy your 100v at higher value like my LS did, you'll be OK.

Usually this will be someone in a HNMLS who has more money than they know what to do with so they're funding a relic weapon.

[TB]

If you can do it (ie you have the programming prowess) Obsidian on Odin has an amazing system. http://www.obsidian-odin.com

http://www.obsidianodin.com/ *

[Taylorman]

Nobody bothered to ask what your upgrading?


my money is on Claustrum.

[Spider-Dan]

My Dynamis LS has declared primary/secondary jobs, with lot progression going all primary -> all secondary -> whoever has the job sufficiently leveled. Northlands, -1, and belt/cape are assigned by leaders (using /point system).

My LS does not allow sponsorship; glass costs are split among the people entering, with all singles autolotting and 100s going to bank (to discount later glasses). Personally, I'm very much against the idea of sponsorship; I see it as barely better than stealing (though not as much now as it was during the inflation period).

[Mojo]

My linkshell does the following.

1 point earned per run

There are 3 categories of points, job points, secondary points, and total points. Each person must choose a primary job to build job points on. They can change their primary job at any time, but will not be able to change back to the same job. When they change, all of their job points are converted to secondary points. Total points are just that, the combined total of job and secondary points.

If AF2 drops, it first goes to the list of people with that job as their primary(must have a positive number of points). It's 2 points for a city AF2, 5 points for an icelands AF2. These points are deducted from their job points. If everybody on the job list has that AF2, it becomes available to lot for anybody with the job 70+, priority stemming from total points. Secondary AF2 is 1 point for city AF2, 3 points for icelands AF2. Secondary AF2 deducts points from secondary points, although they can be taken from job points if the player does not yet have secondary points.

Either way, I highly recommend adding some kind of job priority system in which people build points for a specific job. Simply being able to choose a job you have leveled before you enter the zone, or any other system that doesn't have some kind of set job you choose are incredibly gay(people leveling a job up to 70 to lot an AF2 over someone who had been first for 6 months, etc.).

[Kerrigan]

Nobody bothered to ask what your upgrading?


my money is on Claustrum.

Claustrum? I could equip one, but no way.

It's a toy but not nearly that bad.



A Yoichinoyumi. Rng has always been my favorite job.

I know some of you think it's a waste, but I'll have fun with it, and thats what I want out of the game.


I don't see sponsorship as stealing, I am willing to commit to providing 2M every week, and often just selling singles obtained won't fund a single dyanmis (at least on carbuncle). I am also partnering with a newer ls, Giving them the chance to build their bank, buy abjs, not have to sell s cloth so their whms can get nobles. Don't get me wrong, If I didn't think they will someday be a formidable endgame force, I wouldn't be partnering. I believe it's going to be beneficial to both of us.

[yrpaine]

/rant
try putting together a pickup group that instantly gets profit every run and doesn't have any drama and you can maybe call it stealing. I've seen many shells take weeks of high losses before they either broke or turned things around. What would be stealing is someone sponsoring a group they didn't create for a specific profitable city while the person who got it up and running got mooched off their prior sacrifices.
/endrant

sry i've had too many ppl randomly come ask me if they could sponsor a city run, many of which aren't even in my shell they just know mine's successful.

[Kerrigan]

/rant
try putting together a pickup group that instantly gets profit every run and doesn't have any drama and you can maybe call it stealing. I've seen many shells take weeks of high losses before they either broke or turned things around. What would be stealing is someone sponsoring a group they didn't create for a specific profitable city while the person who got it up and running got mooched off their prior sacrifices.
/endrant

Amen.

Many of the group I am starting out with have never done dynamis. I am ecstatic that I get to help them learn, and I am more than willing to take a the loss weeks along with the ones where I make real progress. I have noticed most of the shells that let members lot 100's are either LS sponsored or split cost. I'm not looking to get rich quick, I am however willing to pay for an LS to learn dynamis, have some fun, get some AF, and when I am done with my bow, I will allow the LS to decide if they want to take on the cost as an LS, or if they want to appoint a new sponsor.

By the way, to fund a dynamis on Carbuncle and break even, you would need:

172 1 Byne Bills
153 O. Bronzepeices
142 Tukuku Whiteshells.

From what I've seen, you would normaly break even on Whiteshells, and loose money on Bynes or Bronzepeices
Yes I know there is going to be the run with 300 singles drop, but thats not the norm.

[Okuza]

Our shell started as a pure Dynamis shell and later expanded into other things. We started out with 1c collected by the shell to cover glass costs and letting players lot either AF2 for one of their level 75 jobs (they had to declare it in comment) or lot 100c. You could only win 1 lot per run. When we were just doing city runs, we also let folks get a split of the 1c at the end (af2, 100, or split above glass cost). Once we started cold zones, we had to stop doing splits in order to afford cold zones. We also had a lot of problems with newbies winning lots over veterans on cold zones and then leaving the shell, so added a few other rules, but still had serious problems with newbies winning lots on items they patently didn't deserve.

Any end-game actively is successfully only based on the efforts of a core group. They're the ones that show up every time and sacrifice at least some of their own personal desires and time so the shell can succeed at it's events. The extra people that notice the success and want to join in now and then are fun to have a long, but they're ultimately inconsequential wrt. event success. Rewarding the tourists over the veteran core group is NOT good for long term shell success.

So, we moved to a zero-sum DKP system. Basically, you earn points when someone else spends points. Items have fixed costs. Person with the current highest DKP wins the item. So, the entire shell averages out to zero points and the person who puts in the most effort is the one who usually wins the item. It's not perfect, but we've found it to be FAR better at taking care of the core group while still being fair to new folks.

We absolutely do not permit sponsorship. That's just one person stealing gil from the shell. Now the shell slurps up all currency and sells it. Then we let people convert points back into gil, which they can then spend however they like. So far, no one in our shell has spent gil on relic weapons. Relic weapons are just the epitome of a bad deal on the effort:reward scale.

-=-=-

BTW, I could see letting someone sponsor a cold zone or a dreamlands run: we get af2, they keep currency. 'Course the average profit on a cold zone is about -500k. Now and then one is in the black, but it's damn rare. Our city runs finance our cold runs and some of our Kirin kills pretty much. If you want currency, ignore the cold zones. Cities drop 2-4x the currency a cold zones does.

[Croaker]

I'm looking to start my own Dynamis shell, and put some serious work into a relic.

I just wanted to know how you setup your shell's lotting rules.

Please say if you go as an ls for relic armor/gil or if you are going to make progress for a relic.

How do you determine who lots AF?
If a private party is paying for all glasses, what compensation do they get?
Any other rules you think are good/bad/ugly?

I did a search on the forums and while I found many threads for "How do you run an HNM LS" but none specific to a dyanmis shell.

Thanks

For lotting I allowed anyone who was in good standing lot AF for any job they had at 75 or 100s, but limited it to one job specified by comment. I determined good standing as having attended 50% or more of the previous 10 runs. This also creates a 5 run minimum before somone is allowed to lot.

For purposes of sponsorship, I payed the 1 mil for the hourglass and lotted all of the single currency. I allowed anyone a chance to get their "share" of coins if they wanted them. If 40 people went on a run and 200 singles dropped, they could pay me 1,000,000 / 40 = 25,000 gil and recieve 200 / 40 = 5 singles. I was very fortunate that I only had a few people in the shell who wanted currency. At the time singles were selling for 70K each on my server. It was something that most shell holders would never offer, but it generally kept people happy.

[Riker]

I run a LS myself; and we have an awesome point system. It rewards senior members but also gives newer members a fair shot at relic.
But im not even gonna get into it because it is a pain in the ass to maintain. So if your set on your relic; do what zosi said.
lot currency and let af's be predeclared freelot. And for the love of god; if you have someone who hasn't beat maat, dont let them lot. Had a mnk go 3/5.. or 4/5 in my LS and he was like 0/20 mnk maat, eventually quit with his relic b/c he coudln't beat maat and my freidn who was 75 lost every one of those pieces to him.

[theo]

You must maintain a 3 out of the last 8 runs attendance (not even 50%, but we chose to do this for those EUs and such who really cannot be asked to attend Wed nights, so they can still miss 1 of those a month). If you have attended 3 of the last 8 runs, you get Prio 1 lots, which also requires that the job be 65+. You can also choose 100 monies.

[...]

Any drops are lotted on by all Prio 1s and go to the highest lot. When all Prio 1s have received their piece, then all Prio 2s drop. If the piece has no one prio'd on it, it is free lot. We have a website with a schedule and signup for a few weeks in advance, and people can put their piece choices there. If someone attends without signing up, they tell a particular leader before the run starts/before they enter what their prio choices are.

Sounds incredibly similar to what we use for city zones. Except instead of 3/8 we use 3/10. Thats pretty lenient in my mind, but we used to have a lot of people who could only make 1 run a week so we wanted to help them out a bit. So far its served us well

Our snow lotting though, is totally tripped out. Its been in place for a long time and is probably considered archaic by some, but its a point system where every run equals one point. City runs count for points too of course, to encourage attendance to those zones.

Basically you get to pick 2 jobs. The main job gets one point per run, the second job gets 0.5 points per run. Whoever has the most points for a given AF2 gets to lot, along with anyone who is within a certain proximity of his/her points (80%). So say you have two people with 90 and 85 points, both of 'em can lot, but the guy with 50 points cannot lot. The "3/10 rule" applies here as well, meaning some jackass who takes a break for a couple months can't come strolling in and lot snow AF2 on his first run back.

It sounds like a lot of math, and it really would be a pain in the ass, but we use an excel spreadsheet that does all the work for us so its actually rather easy. Look at the list, whoevers name is in bold gets to lot.

Edit: just noticed this

And for the love of god; if you have someone who hasn't beat maat, dont let them lot.

Better yet, don't let them into your Dynamis LS <_<; I mean, no offense or anything but in this day and age there are so many level 75 players out there, you shouldn't have any reason to be taking in newbies.

[Kylex]

I run with Frypan on Fenrir and there rules seem pretty fair to me. You recieve one point per run if you stay the whole run. 5 points are equal to one tier. People can choose one main lot, and an infinite number of secondary lots. To lot a piece, primary or secondary, it costs 5 points. Primary always out lots secondary, regardless of points. Obviously, the highest Tier that asks for it gets it or lots against other people who ask that are of the same tier. If no tells are sent for a piece, it goes free for all, where everyone has chance to lot and it only costs the winner 2 points. When you want to change your primary lot, it can be done so at any time, but you must have the main lot changed for 30 days before you can lot any ice zone pieces, accessories, or -1 pieces.

The dynamis is sponsored by a LS member, or multiple members (usually 2). They split the costs of the hour glasses, the sacks lot the currency for them, and they distribute them evenly to the sponsors. If you're not a sponsor, you never recieve any currency. If you recieve a -1 piece, you can buy currency off the sponsors for a discounted price. And that pretty much sums it all up :D