WotG and Tu'Lia

[Ein]

Pretty sure they said that WotG areas were going to basically be old versions of the original areas. Tu'Lia is part of the Zilart expansion so is not an original area.

Xarcabard was part of Zilart right?

Considering some BLM AF is Xarcabard, and other AF of jobs before RotZ...

Well, there shouldn't have been any AF back then, since the level cap was only 50, right? Though, Xarc kinda had to be pre-RotZ due to the whole "Killing the Shadow Lord as the final boss" thing, if I remember correctly. I remember going through that mission at level 55, and thinking "Man, this would be hard-core epic as an alliance of capped level 50's, tearing through all these demons, fighting towards 'ultimate evil'."

At least, I thought it would have been epic... >.>

Edit: Kinda beaten to it.

The cap was 70 by the time RotZ was release, and shortly thereafter raised to 75. The raise to 75 happened AFTER the NA release.

[Septimus]

The reason he uses a piece of the SL is because of "his blood", something about how uh...he holds the anger of the beastmen or something? I dunno, I need to watch it again but it gets pretty iffy around there imo ;(

Tiny spoilers.

I believe that the explanation was that since he was the tale keeper he has a genetic memory (in his blood) tracing all the way back to his Zilart ancestors and he had touched the mother crystal. It's been a while though.

[Khamsin]

- the Kuluu wanted to stop them because opening the gate of the gods would wipe out most of Vana'Diel

Kinda funny how after all that the Kuluu, Zilart and the Papsque went through, we finally throw the Gate of the Gods wide open revealing the path to Paradise and... nothing happens. All that worrying and warfare for nothing. It just ended up being a bunch of aerns and pots.

[Septimus]

- the Kuluu wanted to stop them because opening the gate of the gods would wipe out most of Vana'Diel

Kinda funny how after all that the Kuluu, Zilart and the Papsque went through, we finally throw the Gate of the Gods wide open revealing the path to Paradise and... nothing happens. All that worrying and warfare for nothing. It just ended up being a bunch of aerns and pots.

But that wasn't Paradise, that was the former Zilart capital that was thrown to the bottom of the sea during the Meltdown.

[klvino]

The Zilart CS when you see all the people standing around watching a building glow in the middle of the night was the CS about the attack on Fei'Yin.

Whereas Al'Taieu was pulled into another dimension.

[Khamsin]

A bunch of Aerns and Pots with an all-powerful deity of destruction chained up behind it. Remember that part where we had to go kill it before it got loose? Twice?

Even though I guess both times it was technically us who brought it out in the first place . . .

Bahamut kinda forced our hand, though.

I think the funnier aspect of it is that entire armies of Zilart and Kuluu battled over this and nobody was able to open the gates. Then we come along, and had we cut to the chase, we could have just hijacked an airship and flown straight out to Al'Taieu. We'd be attacked by Ultima/Omega, enter Al'Taieu, kill some aerns, escort a quasilumin around the palace and eventually open the Gate of the Gods that people fought over for centuries without much effort or opposition compared to what people faced in the backstory.

- the Kuluu wanted to stop them because opening the gate of the gods would wipe out most of Vana'Diel

Kinda funny how after all that the Kuluu, Zilart and the Papsque went through, we finally throw the Gate of the Gods wide open revealing the path to Paradise and... nothing happens. All that worrying and warfare for nothing. It just ended up being a bunch of aerns and pots.

But that wasn't Paradise, that was the former Zilart capital that was thrown to the bottom of the sea during the Meltdown.

Paradise must have been a myth then, or they were misguided on how to reach it, because that was THE Gate of the Gods we opened in Al'Taieu and there was no resulting catastrophe.

[LD]

No, it wasn't.
We didn't open anything, number 1. Al'Taieu is simply the 5th mother crystal, Sel'teus just allowed us entry. It's a transdimensional paradox, not Paradise. At any rate, 'Opening the Gate of the Gods' is a metaphor for combining the 5 crystals, which we stopped in RoZ. Tu'Lia was the 'Gate of the Gods' in that was way the means with which Paradise would be unlocked. I believe it was even called that in one of the RoZ CSs. Al'Taieu was never referred to as the Gate of the Gods, just the Celestial Capital, which it is.

I don't understand how you could think Al'Taieu is the Gate of the Gods. What, because Promathia was there? He could have just as easily manifested in Prishe, that was the entire point of the story.

[Rocl]

Uh I thought they were talking about the door leading into the Garden of Ru'hmet called "Gate of the Gods", idk that's just me though

[stinkypoo]

Yeah I didn't bring up CoP in my post because I haven't even finished rewatching Zilart yet and I know CoP expands (or screws up ;x) on a bunch of Zilart stuff. As for people thinking that A'Taieu/the Palace is or holds the gate of the gods, I think that's because there's literally a targetable door named "Gate of The Gods" in there?

edit: according to wiki, the end of 8-1 is:

"Head forward and check the Gate of the Gods (H-8) for a final cutscene and your reward".

So yeah. Personally I get the feeling that they went back on/contradicted a bunch of Zilart stuff with the last chapters of CoP. Or maybe it all makes perfect sense. Need to watch more CS +_+

[SeraphusRagnarok]

Spoilers be here:










It's a dimensional paradox because the Al'teiu mothercrystal, like ALL mother crystals are INTRINISIC to Vana'diel. The Celestial Capital housing the Al'teiu crystal was thrown to the bottom of the sea by Bahamut's attacks. The defense mechanism developed by the Zilart transported the entire Palace and everything in it's immediete vicinity inside the Al'teiu mothercrystal, which accounts for why the flora and fauna in "Sea" are crystalline and drop crystal clusters. Ever see an old Merry Melodies cartoon from the 1940's where a Kangaroo jumps inside it's own pouch and it vanishes into thin air? Well the palace which holds the mother crystal teleported inside the mothercrystal to keep it safe. That's why the mothercrystal is on the bottom floor of Ru'hmet Gardens and you teleport inside it for the final BC yet end up outside of Vana'diel itself. When a soul dies it returns to the mother crystal which originally gave birth to it and they kinda remain there until they are reincarnated into a new lifeform.

The empyrial paradox is as follows:
The Al'teiu mother crystal that which maintain's vana'diel existence. Where is it?
-It resides in the Celestial Capital of the Zilart.
But where is the Celestial Capital of the Zilart?
-Inside the Al'teiu mother crystal.

The Al'teiu mother crystal, which in itself is a vital compotent of Vana'diel, now resides in NOT Vana'diel. Thus all the souls it has cannot return, and thus they all go stagnant. Galka were born from the Al'teiu mothercrystal thousands of years after the palace sank and whatnot. This probably accounts for why Galka do not reproduce, they reincarnate, because their souls do not have a mothercrystal in which to return to.


The Zilart wanted to recreate Paradise by uniting the energies of the 5 mothercrystals via the crystal lines. In this type of world, only the avatars and the zilart may exist. The Avatars, are the sleeping gods (promathia and altana are also gods and avatars since these are synonyms . We can presume Aerns are the Zilarts' true form as they have some sentinence. The avatars wish for paradise again because they can exist freely there. The terrestrial avatars sapped all the energy from the real avatars in order to ensure they don't awaken, once they do they will create paradise again. The avatars are immortal gods, the Terrestrial avatars are far weaker in comparison as they were born from the mothercrystal was split rather than the original true crystal which altana promathia and the avatars were born from. The only reason the celestial avatars help you out is because you and all the 5 races are the divided god, promathia. The celestial refer to the terrestrials as fake gods, when paradise is recreated, the terrestrials ose their powers and become nothing more than mortal beasts.

[Khamsin]

No, it wasn't.
We didn't open anything, number 1. Al'Taieu is simply the 5th mother crystal, Sel'teus just allowed us entry. It's a transdimensional paradox, not Paradise. At any rate, 'Opening the Gate of the Gods' is a metaphor for combining the 5 crystals, which we stopped in RoZ. Tu'Lia was the 'Gate of the Gods' in that was way the means with which Paradise would be unlocked. I believe it was even called that in one of the RoZ CSs. Al'Taieu was never referred to as the Gate of the Gods, just the Celestial Capital, which it is.

I don't understand how you could think Al'Taieu is the Gate of the Gods. What, because Promathia was there? He could have just as easily manifested in Prishe, that was the entire point of the story.

I'm not saying Al'Taeiu is the Gate of the Gods, I'm saying the entrance to Garden of Ru'Hmet is the Gate of the Gods... the very gate that people fought for centuries trying to reach and open.

[Lordshin]

iirc... the gate to paradise was behind the Gate of the Gods in Tu'Lia... if not, Tu'Lia itself...
which means there are more than one Gate of the Gods and only the one in Tu'Lia held the key to attain paradise, since it was built for that sole purpose (Al'Taieu was a city).

CoP does not contradict Zilart...
Eald'Narche tried to open the Gate of the Gods in Tu'Lia we open the gate of the Gods in Al'Taieu
And well technically didnt we release a certain someone bound by "chains" after opening the Gate of the Gods in Al Taieu?


PS: Correct me if im wrong.. havent seen ZM cses recently.. downloading that thing now

[LD]

No, it wasn't.
We didn't open anything, number 1. Al'Taieu is simply the 5th mother crystal, Sel'teus just allowed us entry. It's a transdimensional paradox, not Paradise. At any rate, 'Opening the Gate of the Gods' is a metaphor for combining the 5 crystals, which we stopped in RoZ. Tu'Lia was the 'Gate of the Gods' in that was way the means with which Paradise would be unlocked. I believe it was even called that in one of the RoZ CSs. Al'Taieu was never referred to as the Gate of the Gods, just the Celestial Capital, which it is.

I don't understand how you could think Al'Taieu is the Gate of the Gods. What, because Promathia was there? He could have just as easily manifested in Prishe, that was the entire point of the story.

I'm not saying Al'Taeiu is the Gate of the Gods, I'm saying the entrance to Garden of Ru'Hmet is the Gate of the Gods... the very gate that people fought for centuries trying to reach and open.

You're still wrong, Khamsin.

[Rocl]

No, it wasn't.
We didn't open anything, number 1. Al'Taieu is simply the 5th mother crystal, Sel'teus just allowed us entry. It's a transdimensional paradox, not Paradise. At any rate, 'Opening the Gate of the Gods' is a metaphor for combining the 5 crystals, which we stopped in RoZ. Tu'Lia was the 'Gate of the Gods' in that was way the means with which Paradise would be unlocked. I believe it was even called that in one of the RoZ CSs. Al'Taieu was never referred to as the Gate of the Gods, just the Celestial Capital, which it is.

I don't understand how you could think Al'Taieu is the Gate of the Gods. What, because Promathia was there? He could have just as easily manifested in Prishe, that was the entire point of the story.

I'm not saying Al'Taeiu is the Gate of the Gods, I'm saying the entrance to Garden of Ru'Hmet is the Gate of the Gods... the very gate that people fought for centuries trying to reach and open.

You're still wrong, Khamsin.

No I'm pretty sure we go through the Gate of the Gods everytime we enter the Garden of Ru'hmet.

[Khamsin]

No, it wasn't.
We didn't open anything, number 1. Al'Taieu is simply the 5th mother crystal, Sel'teus just allowed us entry. It's a transdimensional paradox, not Paradise. At any rate, 'Opening the Gate of the Gods' is a metaphor for combining the 5 crystals, which we stopped in RoZ. Tu'Lia was the 'Gate of the Gods' in that was way the means with which Paradise would be unlocked. I believe it was even called that in one of the RoZ CSs. Al'Taieu was never referred to as the Gate of the Gods, just the Celestial Capital, which it is.

I don't understand how you could think Al'Taieu is the Gate of the Gods. What, because Promathia was there? He could have just as easily manifested in Prishe, that was the entire point of the story.

I'm not saying Al'Taeiu is the Gate of the Gods, I'm saying the entrance to Garden of Ru'Hmet is the Gate of the Gods... the very gate that people fought for centuries trying to reach and open.

You're still wrong, Khamsin.

I'm never wrong.*

*Quoting of things I've been wrong about in the past is prohibited.

[Septimus]

Eald'narche refers to it as "Opening the Gates of Paradise", not opening the gate of the gods.

[Rocl]

Eald'narche refers to it as "Opening the Gates of Paradise", not opening the gate of the gods.

Any San d'Orian (or anyone who goes to the Cathedral) should know that >_> the friars with their crazy animations "May Paradise open its Gates to you" and whatnot

[SeraphusRagnarok]

Paradise and the realm of the gods are one and the same I thought. Since paradise is lost, the gods currently exist in that astral plane which is like a limbo.

There is no 'gates to paradise'. It's not a door, it's a metaphor for allowing the gods to reawaken and destroy vana'diel and rejoin the crystals.I think the proper translation would be "the path to paradise", which would also imply the "path to the gods" since the gods orignally existed in paradise. I think this was realized at the end of the San'Dorian mission line when you discover the whole San'Dorian religion is based on false premise. I think it said they read long ago in ancient scriptures that the gate to paradise was metaphysical and it 'exists in you', but Ealdnarche told the clergy that it was a physical gate existing somewhere and Lightbringer was the key to unlocking it. Then the Papsque says he's sorry for the cathedral misguiding everyone for so long etc... But I'm gonna rewatch the CS later, I'm just going by what I think I remember.

[Rocl]

It's been forever, I don't exactly remember it happening like that but I'll rewatch it later

All I remember is the papsque getting a note from Eald'narche saying:

1) Unsheath the Lightbringer
2) Open the Gates to Paradise
3) ???
4) Profit

[SeraphusRagnarok]

-Shamonde recieved a note from Eald'narshe saying Lightbringer is the key to paradise.
-Shamonde allowed the 'whereabouts' of Lightbringer to be "gotten' by the beastmen.
-The beastmen were 'led to believe' it resided in Tavnazia
-The beastmen pwnd Tavnazia full force
-Someone of the Royal Family unsheathed Lightbringer(only a royal family member can)
-A great beam of light was seen from everywhere on Vana'diel
-Somebody set Tavnazia up the bomb.
-Resulting explosion turned the Tavnazian Peninsula into the Tavnazian Archipelago and the residual energy caused weird spacial fluxes which messed up Cape Riverne's gravity (a la the Valley of Forgotten Gravity from Legend of Dragoon) and caused those Dimensional Vortexes to open in Quifim and Valkurm.


I think the Red Mage father of Curilla witnessed this, which was why the church had him assassinated and his corpse stuffed into a locked box and hidden in Garliage Citadel during the War. Which is why you see Shamonde watching you eeirly from the top of the church and why Curilla's father tells you to watchout for Shamonde.

Don't fuck with priests.