WotG and Tu'Lia

[Rocl]

Rochefogne (I think he's Leaute's nephew? or brother?) unsheathed the Lightbringer while escaping from Tavnazia

[Seyrr]

Isn't it possible that the Ru'Hmet one was named after the actual "Gate of the Gods" they were trying to open? Kind of like naming similar structures in a church... it's not the actual deal, but a symbolic representation that's supposed to add to the majesty of, in this case, the Garden of Ru'Hmet. "Here is our recreation of paradise on Vana'diel, where our king reigns in glory until the true paradise is revealed."

... well, until spatial transfers get fucked up and the security systems go haywire, but the idea was nice.

[Raylinn]

This is kinda a useless argument. It could be anything from a mistranslation of the idea they wanted to get across, to being an idea of the followers of Altana that really had no basis in reality, to just about anything else. But just because they are both called 'The Gate of the Gods' doesn't mean they are talking about the same one.

Do you know the muffin man.
The muffin man?
Yeah the muffin man.
Sure I know the muffin man. He lives on Drury lane.
No, I meant the one on 32nd street.

[Narualu]

I think Seraphus is right in the idea that there is no physical location in Vana'diel that is "paradise." Quoted from Kerrigan's History site. :D

Edit: Wow, I've clearly forgotten my history. These quotes pretty much explain paradise.

In another strange room, an operations room – the same in the
lower regions of the Delkfutts Tower stands different figures.
Eald’narche speaking to Selh’teus.
“But this paradise did not last forever. The enormous jewel was
split into 5 parts, and this perfect realm was degraded into an
incomplete world. We were reduced from the superior life forms
of a higher plain into these flawed and insignificant forms.
Thus we must gather and focus the energy of the crystals into
opening a gate to the lost dimension.”

To insure the Twilight Gods existence, Altana stole the
energy of the mothercrystal to create a race of people. In the process the
mothercrystal split into 5 parts and the realm of gods was split from its
higher plain – to be transformed into the world of Vana’diel.

She was shown an
incomplete paradise, where the citizens of the capital returned to their
deity ten thousand years ago. Returned to Promathia. “Opening the gates of
Paradise” is just another way of describing the recombining of the
mothercrystal. A way to restore the world to its original state.

[klvino]

Rochefogne (I think he's Leaute's nephew? or brother?) unsheathed the Lightbringer while escaping from Tavnazia

He's the Queen's brother.

[LD]

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch............
Ok, so that's the name of the door, but it isn't the opening of paradise, so the core of my point is correct.

All this useless crap aside, besides the fact that making another Tu'Lia is unnecessary for many reasons, not the least of which is the stagnation of reusing old content down to the last pixel, this was already explained by the guy with 4 posts; Tu'Lia wasn't activated until ZM8, so while it was always floating, it was completely dead otherwise. The Player doesn't gain access until ZM..I wanna say 12..when he gets that....fuckin'.....thing. So there's enough in the storyline to explain why you can't access Tu'Lia in the past. It's the same reason we wont be able to go to Sea or AU or maybe even the outlands in the past, shit just wasn't allowed to the common man at that point (Al'Taieu only opens every hundred years and AU stayed quiet durring the War.)

[Gwynplaine]

Isn't it possible that the Ru'Hmet one was named after the actual "Gate of the Gods" they were trying to open? Kind of like naming similar structures in a church... it's not the actual deal, but a symbolic representation that's supposed to add to the majesty of, in this case, the Garden of Ru'Hmet.

This is what I think it is. Despite the name theres nothing special about the gate. Just a door, leading to more of the Zilart palace so it's probably just commemorative.

Don't forget that the terms "Gates of Paradise" and "Gate of the Gods" are essentially the same. Same idea just different terminology, San d'Orian church uses paradise, Tavnazian church uses Gate of the Gods I think. San d'Oria taught it should be sought after, while Tav taught it is forbidden to access.

Khamsins partially right, in that during CoP they (Nagmolada specifically) make it seem like you enter paradise when you reach Al'teiaeau. Later though the characters doubts are proven well founded and it's revealed it's not paradise and actually another dimension that is an "incomplete paradise" (think thats the term they used).

The Gates of Paradise don't physically exist anywhere, it's any method by which you could possibly reunite the 5 separate mother crystals in one. One way was Eald trying to restart the Tu'Lia project.

[Zilong]

Resulting explosion turned the Tavnazian Peninsula into the Tavnazian Archipelago and the residual energy caused weird spacial fluxes which messed up Cape Riverne's gravity (a la the Valley of Forgotten Gravity from Legend of Dragoon) and caused those Dimensional Vortexes to open in Quifim and Valkurm.

Riverne's gravity flux is caused by Bahamut's presence and is a "recent" happening in term of CoP storyline, as Prishe was surprised to see the state Cape Riverne was in when you first started the mammet mission.

As for dimensional vortex, I'm pretty sure it's some side effect of Promyvion.

[SeraphusRagnarok]

Quick note: Apollyon= Promyvion-Alteiu

Temenos was the Odruhgdsiubdruilntdhn'Obelist or w/e and is connected to the Crystal Line which is how the souls of deceased enemies exist there(that one Orc that died long ago for example). The Enhanced[Insert creature] is the result of the genetic testing the Zilart did there, their most fsmous was turning Kuluus back into Zilarts...Zilartians? Zilartese? What's the plural for Zilart anyway...

[BRP]

Quick note: Apollyon= Promyvion-Alteiu

Temenos was the Odruhgdsiubdruilntdhn'Obelist or w/e and is connected to the Crystal Line which is how the souls of deceased enemies exist there(that one Orc that died long ago for example). The Enhanced[Insert creature] is the result of the genetic testing the Zilart did there, their most fsmous was turning Kuluus back into Zilarts...Zilartians? Zilartese? What's the plural for Zilart anyway...

Nice theory, but don't go overboard and say it is anything more that. At least with the "genetic testing".

[SeraphusRagnarok]

I'm fairly certain Graviton said they tried to forcibly put the whisper of altana back into the Kuluu, and the Obelisk is where they also did research on creatures. It's likely where the Zilart made the Crystal Warriors too.

[Zilong]

Quick note: Apollyon= Promyvion-Alteiu

Temenos was the Odruhgdsiubdruilntdhn'Obelist or w/e and is connected to the Crystal Line which is how the souls of deceased enemies exist there(that one Orc that died long ago for example). The Enhanced[Insert creature] is the result of the genetic testing the Zilart did there, their most fsmous was turning Kuluus back into Zilarts...Zilartians? Zilartese? What's the plural for Zilart anyway...

That'd be the chamber of eventide, located in the Ruhmet/Huxzoi...not the Ou'phat Obelisk.

And the process seem to be voluntary, at least Eshan'tarl doesn't seem to mention holding any grudges for being a subject, and Nag'Molada desperately seek the chamber so he too can become a Zilart.

[Spira]

Quick note: Apollyon= Promyvion-Alteiu

Temenos was the Odruhgdsiubdruilntdhn'Obelist or w/e and is connected to the Crystal Line which is how the souls of deceased enemies exist there(that one Orc that died long ago for example). The Enhanced[Insert creature] is the result of the genetic testing the Zilart did there, their most fsmous was turning Kuluus back into Zilarts...Zilartians? Zilartese? What's the plural for Zilart anyway...

Apollyon was Lower Promyvion and Temenos Ou'Phats Obelisk before Lumoria itself was implemented.

somehow SE decided not to prolong our misery with that stuff so both zones were cut off from mission storylines. Ouh'Phat is still mentioned by Nag'Molada tho. What really disappointed me rather was that SE never did explain the existence of Temenos or Apollyon.. but seeing as how Lumoria was a big anomaly in itself there probably wasn't a need for it.

As for the OPs question, its been answered too many times before me already :D

Riverne's anti-gravity thing was not caused by Bahamut either. It was caused by an earthquake that happened 'recently'. It says so right on the CoP website..
Since they aren't very specific with time frame, recently could imply within the last 20 years (recently in geographic terms is often a longer time span) or its 'earthquake' could have been caused by the lightbringer (just making a guess)... In any case, Riverne is most likely NOT a floating bunch of islands during the Crystal War era.

About paradise: It does not exist in Vana'Diel. If the 5 mother crystals are reunited to form the "Origin" Crystal, Vana'Diel would supposedly cease to exist. Where the Zilart were living in prior to the division of the crystals, well it isnt very clear.


P.S. Plural of Zilart is the same word. Have you called people Frenchs?

[Lucavi]

All of this discussion really only proves one thing: FFXI has the best plot and story of any MMO. Too bad 3 kings suck, but I'll take a plot that can actually make me think outside of "kill 5 wild rabbits, 10 wild boars, and 15 wild wolves, and then return to me for your reward".

It's likely where the Zilart made the Crystal Warriors too.

The Crystal Warriors are the most enigmatic thing in the game, IMO. Explain more about them -- all I know is that I was happy to fight and kill them, especially after they bitched Raogrimm like that. Oh, and their fight song kicks serious ass.

[Zilong]

Quick note: Apollyon= Promyvion-Alteiu

Temenos was the Odruhgdsiubdruilntdhn'Obelist or w/e and is connected to the Crystal Line which is how the souls of deceased enemies exist there(that one Orc that died long ago for example). The Enhanced[Insert creature] is the result of the genetic testing the Zilart did there, their most fsmous was turning Kuluus back into Zilarts...Zilartians? Zilartese? What's the plural for Zilart anyway...

Apollyon was Lower Promyvion and Temenos Ou'Phats Obelisk before Lumoria itself was implemented.

somehow SE decided not to prolong our misery with that stuff so both zones were cut off from mission storylines. Ouh'Phat is still mentioned by Nag'Molada tho. What really disappointed me rather was that SE never did explain the existence of Temenos or Apollyon.. but seeing as how Lumoria was a big anomaly in itself there probably wasn't a need for it.

As for the OPs question, its been answered too many times before me already :D

Riverne's anti-gravity thing was not caused by Bahamut either. It was caused by an earthquake that happened 'recently'. It says so right on the CoP website..
Since they aren't very specific with time frame, recently could imply within the last 20 years (recently in geographic terms is often a longer time span) or its 'earthquake' could have been caused by the lightbringer (just making a guess)... In any case, Riverne is most likely NOT a floating bunch of islands during the Crystal War era.

About paradise: It does not exist in Vana'Diel. If the 5 mother crystals are reunited to form the "Origin" Crystal, Vana'Diel would supposedly cease to exist. Where the Zilart were living in prior to the division of the crystals, well it isnt very clear.


P.S. Plural of Zilart is the same word. Have you called people Frenchs?

Ingame script on 2-5, upon zoning

~Riverne Site #A01~

Prishe: !? Whoa! What the hell happened here!?

Ulmia: Is this... Cape Riverne...!?

I don't know about you...but considering the Tavnazian survivor has been on the area for at least 20 years, especially prishe who has lived longer than that...being surprised at the state riverne would be kinda weird if it's been that way since lightbringer.

And Riverne isn't that far away from Tavnazian Safehold to not notice if the thing has been like that for a while. Also Bahamut chose that area to be his lair as he plan and amass his army to destroy all of the vana diel humanity...and he happens to be able to manipulate time and space.

The Crystal Warriors are the most enigmatic thing in the game, IMO. Explain more about them -- all I know is that I was happy to fight and kill them, especially after they bitched Raogrimm like that. Oh, and their fight song kicks serious ass.

From what I understand, they are the prototype of all 5 races that was created when the mothercrystal is split, but that's just my guess

[Lordwafik]

Like a lot of people, I haven't done CS's in forever, but another way to look at this :

~Riverne Site #A01~

Prishe: !? Whoa! What the hell happened here!?

Ulmia: Is this... Cape Riverne...!?

The context could also very well be the first time they ever set foot in this zone, considering Ulmia's asking if this is riverne.

"What the hell happened here!?" - you say the same thing if you enter a pigsty of a room at someone's house or if you go somewhere that's been smashed to bits by a tornado, doesn't necessarily mean you've been there before.

[Zilong]

Like a lot of people, I haven't done CS's in forever, but another way to look at this :

~Riverne Site #A01~

Prishe: !? Whoa! What the hell happened here!?

Ulmia: Is this... Cape Riverne...!?

The context could also very well be the first time they ever set foot in this zone, considering Ulmia's asking if this is riverne.

"What the hell happened here!?" - you say the same thing if you enter a pigsty of a room at someone's house or if you go somewhere that's been smashed to bits by a tornado, doesn't necessarily mean you've been there before.

Well, considering Prishe's more or less an immortal who has been in Tavnazian area for a good while, the leader of the survivors in Tavnazia, and is also basically the head of the Tavnazian patrol squad (Justinius, etc) I think she'd know if a bunch of rocks have been floating around for the past 20 years or so.

As for Ulmia, it's kinda a long shot, but the Snowmint Point is like her favorite place to seek solitude, and it's not that far away from Cape Riverne, and I'm pretty sure she'd notice a bunch of flying boulder if it's been around for 20 years. And Ulmia asking if this is riverne could be because of the current state of riverne is too different from the last time she visited it, though of course, it can be anywhere from the day before the event or years prior to that. But I'd imagine considering the isolation and the size of Tavnazia area, one would at least be pretty familiar with the state of their surrounding after living there for 20 years.

In any case, I'm just saying that there is no way in hell a bunch of flying landmarks are gonna slip by Prishe unless it's a recent happening that happen as CoP storyline start, but you're free to draw your own conclusion I guess, plus it's not like anything canon in this game's storyline is set in stone, the fact that WotG is released will probably fuck up the timelining of some of the more important events and happening in the storyline.

Edit:

Going through ingame script, this is the script after killing Minotaur and Prishe's arrival.

Prishe: You wouldn't believe the hell I've been through! Listen up, you lot!
A bunch of nasty critters have gathered on Cape Riverne. I'd keep away from
that place if you like your organs on the inside of your body. Those monsters
don't play nice.

Ondieulix: What's this? What is going on out there?

Parelbriaux: Prishe, I saw a weird cloud stretching out towards Cape Riverne.
Do you have any idea of what it was?

Prishe: Oh, that. I just caught a glimpse of it, but I'm pretty sure that was
the vapor trail of some huge goddamn dragon. But don't you worry your little
heads about it. I'm going out again after I check our provisions. Heh heh!
And this time I'm gonna head in a whole lot further. By the way, have any
of you seen Justinius?

So she just came back from a patrol/sightseeing on Riverne, and when she's back, it's all fucked up like that, so I'm 99% sure all that shit is the "huge goddamn dragon"'s doing

PS: God I love Prishe so fucking much, immortal loli with sailor mouth, too bad that the conclusion of CoP takes out 2/3rd of that trait...at least they left the most important part though ?´??????????

[shirizaan]

Riverne's anti-gravity thing was not caused by Bahamut either. It was caused by an earthquake that happened 'recently'. It says so right on the CoP website..

Actually, I was made to believe that Riverne was made that way when the Lightbringer was unsheathed shortly after the downfall of Tavnazia.

[Charismatic]

I'm with the bahamut theory on this one.
The displacements and crap being there is part of what makes that theory believable for me.

[Kyreth]

My own impressions on doing CoP to that point is heck yes, Bahamut pulled that off. It wasn't anything to do with Lightbringer, and the Tavanzians are as shocked to see the area floating in midair as you are.