Enmity testing - Still Going!

[aurik]

they probably just copy-pasted the same number in the table.

[Kaeko]

LVL8 | HP Cured = 130 | CE = 287 | CE Modifier = 2.2077 ~ 2.2154

Might have issue with this one... got hit once for 1 HP... possibly 288 CE and CE range 2.2154 ~ 2.2231

LVL37 | HP Cured = 282 | CE = 341 | CE Modifier = 1.2092 ~ 1.2128

[Kaeko]

It's working out really nicely if you assume it's divisors.

Assuming it's HP/F(Lv), then the following all work for the above data:

F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.3
F(10) = 0.5
F(12) = 0.525
F(14) = 0.55
F(70) = 1.3
F(75) = 1.375


F(40) runs into a problem, as .875 should give 468 CE, so it'd be worth rechecking that, otherwise it could just be an order-of-calculations thing that could be ascertained later.

Wow great catch on the lvl 40...

Redid this and got...

LVL40 | HP Cured = 340 | CE = 388 | CE Modifier = 1.1412 ~ 1.1441

1 / 0.875 = 1.14286 which does fall in this range ...

[Suiram]

Can you redo Lv40 at the 410 value again, and see if you get 468 or 469? It would go a long way to the future understanding of the formula's structure (in terms of order of operations with intermediate flooring).

Same with the Lv8 one that you might have got hit on, since 130/0.45 should yield 288 CE.

[Ashira]

DORKS



not that i'm much better, standing around as 71 cor/sch using sublimation to tick down HP. I actually went to make popcorn. -.-

:D

[Kaeko]

Just to add onto the list you had earlier...

F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(8) = NO VALUE (mistake possibly here?)
F(10) = 0.500
F(12) = 0.525
F(14) = 0.550
F(27) = 0.700
F(37) = 0.825
F(40) = 0.875
F(70) = 1.300
F(75) = 1.375

This actually looks pretty promising... If we assume some 1-10 values early on... Red values have data backing it up.

F(0) = 0.250
F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(3) = 0.325
F(4) = 0.350
F(5) = 0.375
F(6) = 0.400
F(7) = 0.425
F(8) = 0.450
F(9) = 0.475
F(10) = 0.500

+ 0.025 a level first 10 levels?

[Ashira]

kaeko, pay attn, we're trying to gather for nyzul

[aurik]

Just to add onto the list you had earlier...

F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(8) = NO VALUE (mistake possibly here?)
F(10) = 0.500
F(12) = 0.525
F(14) = 0.550
F(27) = 0.700
F(37) = 0.825
F(40) = 0.875
F(70) = 1.300
F(75) = 1.375

This actually looks pretty promising... If we assume some 1-10 values early on... Red values have data backing it up.

F(0) = 0.250
F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(3) = 0.325
F(4) = 0.350
F(5) = 0.375
F(6) = 0.400
F(7) = 0.425
F(8) = 0.450
F(9) = 0.475
F(10) = 0.500

+ 0.025 a level first 10 levels?

Mathematically equivalent to my original formula for 0-10

[Kaeko]

Just to add onto the list you had earlier...

F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(8) = NO VALUE (mistake possibly here?)
F(10) = 0.500
F(12) = 0.525
F(14) = 0.550
F(27) = 0.700
F(37) = 0.825
F(40) = 0.875
F(70) = 1.300
F(75) = 1.375

This actually looks pretty promising... If we assume some 1-10 values early on... Red values have data backing it up.

F(0) = 0.250
F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(3) = 0.325
F(4) = 0.350
F(5) = 0.375
F(6) = 0.400
F(7) = 0.425
F(8) = 0.450
F(9) = 0.475
F(10) = 0.500

+ 0.025 a level first 10 levels?

Mathematically equivalent to my original formula for 0-10

Yea looks very promising. Actually if you increase the divisor by +0.0125 it actually looks to almost match all the way to 75.

If you look at the jumps though, the mod almost seems to increase more from 70 to 75 than in the 50 ranges.

[Kaeko]

LVL8 is corrected... it's actually 288 CE for 130.

This is actually a good thing since that brings the mod range to 2.2154 ~ 2.2231, which 2.2222 or 1/0.45 falls into.

In addition, I have a couple more...

LVL4 | HP Cured = 70 | CE = 200 | Modifier Range = 2.8571 ~ 2.8714

LVL11 | HP Cured = 175 | CE = 350 | Modifier Range = 2.0000 ~ 2.0057

LVL53 | HP Cured = 380 | CE = 370 | Modifier Range = 0.9737 ~ 0.9763

LVL71 | HP Cured = 585 | CE = 450 | MOdifier Range = 0.7692 ~ 0.7709

Note that LVL10 and LVL11 have the EXACT same modifier ranges... Same is true for 52 and 53, and 70 and 71. This suggests that they are actually the same. I came up with this pattern... These are divisors; black is guess value, red is tested value within an actual experimental range.

F(0) = 0.250
F(1) = 0.275
F(2) = 0.300
F(3) = 0.325
F(4) = 0.350
F(5) = 0.375
F(6) = 0.400
F(7) = 0.425
F(8) = 0.450
F(9) = 0.475
F(10) = 0.500
F(11) = 0.500
F(12) = 0.525
F(13) = 0.525
F(14) = 0.550
F(15) = 0.550
F(16) = 0.575
F(17) = 0.575
F(18) = 0.600
F(19) = 0.600
F(20) = 0.625
F(21) = 0.625
F(22) = 0.650
F(23) = 0.650
F(24) = 0.675
F(25) = 0.675
F(26) = 0.700
F(27) = 0.700
F(28) = 0.725
F(29) = 0.725
F(30) = 0.750
F(31) = 0.750
F(32) = 0.775
F(33) = 0.775
F(34) = 0.800
F(35) = 0.800
F(36) = 0.825
F(37) = 0.825
F(38) = 0.850
F(39) = 0.850
F(40) = 0.875
F(41) = 0.875
F(42) = 0.900
F(43) = 0.900
F(44) = 0.925
F(45) = 0.925
F(46) = 0.950
F(47) = 0.950
F(48) = 0.975
F(49) = 0.975
F(50) = 1.000
F(51) = 1.000
F(52) = 1.025
F(53) = 1.025

... ...

F(70) = 1.300
F(71) = 1.300
F(75) = 1.375

Things start not to work so well later on so stopped early.

I think this pattern is pretty promising though. I think this would account for the fact you can gain a LVL but the mod stays the same.

Definitley need more values past 50 though.

[Suiram]

Did you get a chance to recheck 410 cure at Lv40? 469 is bothering me when it should be 468 according to the pattern lol

[Kaeko]

Did you get a chance to recheck 410 cure at Lv40? 469 is bothering me when it should be 468 according to the pattern lol

I'm actually not comfortable with the 410 HP to 469 CE test. I think I took 1 damage during that...

I was using the 340 HP to 388 CE result.

I can check this for you again though.

[Suiram]

If you took 1 damage then that's great, and don't need to retest it since everything still works out if you did. It's nothing about that lvl or value specifically except that it was 1 more CE than it should have been (which the 1 dmg accounts for).

[Kaeko]

EDIT

LVL56 | HP Cured = 628 | CE = 584 | Modifier Range = 0.9299 ~ 0.9315

LVL56 divisor is 1.075

[Kaeko]

I got enough points to make a post I think...

Here it is for those that don't want to fumble through all the numbers in the last 2 pages...

http://kanican.livejournal.com/30340.html

Also, the overall table of cure modifier values...

http://kanican.livejournal.com/30142.html

[Spekkio]

I got enough points to make a post I think...

Here it is for those that don't want to fumble through all the numbers in the last 2 pages...

http://kanican.livejournal.com/30340.html

Also, the overall table of cure modifier values...

http://kanican.livejournal.com/30142.html

not to be a nitpicker, but someone skimming for data on the LJ post might get confused by a rather critical typo.

test 23E: Does the job level of the target affect the amount of CE generated by curing?

it currently reads as below:
The target's job level does not affect the amount of CE generated by curing.

if i understand what i read correctly, it should read:
The target's job level has an effect on the amount of CE generated by curing.

sorry to bring it up, but if someone's going for the "cliff notes" and just reads the colored text, this will provide the wrong conclusion, so i thought it important to mention.

[aurik]

Another thing that hasn't been tested is whether mobs with levels other than 0 generate the same amount of cure hate. That is, the modifier may not be based on the "cure target" level, but rather the "cure target level difference".

I don't think this is the case, but for exhaustiveness it should probably be checked.

[Kaeko]

Thanks, fixed those typos.

Also, I'm fairly certain about the level difference thing since I would use bunnies (not lvl0) sometimes. I had issues choosing the tests I wanted to post since I was about 2 lines off from the LJ length cap. If it becomes an issue I'll have to post it separately

[ismarc]

I've been wanting to do tests with Foe Sirvente since I first started following the enmity discussions. I currently have it at level 2, but I'm willing to lower it to 1 and increase it up to 3 for testing. Before I test it, I'd like some other folks opinions on the method I've come up with.

I'd previously put off my testing because of how quickly the VE from provoke dissipates. Essentially, because of only a 5% increase to the effectiveness of Sirvente, we end up with the following numbers:
60E/s - Normal
54E/s - Sirvente unlocked (10% reduction in enmity loss? I wasn't sure of the base, but thought I saw that somewhere)
51E/s - Sirvente Lv 2
48E/s - Sirvente Lv 3

The corresponding Provoke decay times are:
30 - Normal
33.3333333 - Sirvente unlocked
35.2941176 - Sirvente Lv 2
37.5 - Sirvente Lv 3

The problem with this is that you have under 2 seconds of time difference for 5% enmity loss reduction. That means, a margin of error of 1 second and every test you do becomes invalid. So, I have now come up with the following test (I copied Kaeko's format because it's a lot nicer than what my notepad looks like):

What is the amount of Enmity Decay Reduction from Foe Sirvente Lv 2?

Testing Setup:

- 1 puller character with Silence access
- 1 BRD/RDM with Foe Sirvente Lv 2 and Dispel
- 1 WHM/WAR
- Both characters must have no enmity merits or be wearing enmity gear
- Use a "level 0" monster
- This test requires a stop-watch!

- All characters must have either Stoneskin or Phalanx buffed prior to starting to ensure 0 damage

- Puller pulls with Silence while the 2 test characters move to the same distance
- BRD/RDM casts Dispel once and Foe Sirvente once (CE = 340)
- Wait >= 8 seconds for full VE decay
- WHM/WAR casts Flash, then provoke (CE = 181 VE = 3080, TE difference of 2740E)
- Document the amount of time taken for Player 1 to retake hate

- Repeat for other levels of Foe Sirvente

Reference info:
0% reduction = 60E/s = 45.6666 seconds for player 1 to retake hate
5% reduction = 57E/s = 48.0701 seconds for player 1 to retake hate
10% reduction = 54E/s = 50.7407 seconds for player 1 to retake hate
15% reduction = 51E/s = 53.7254 seconds for player 1 to retake hate
20% reduction = 48E/s = 57.0833 seconds for player 1 to retake hate

[Kaeko]

We axe'd this test because we couldn't reproduce the lowering of the VE decay rate...

This was the old "test 19" on my blog

It was actually done then removed b/c we found it did lower decay rate originally, then some1 posting here redid and it did not. We redid it and found no decay rate decrease.

You can test htis yourself but evidence so far shows it does not do anything to ve decay rate.