Job Adjustments

[BRP]

i can see the new dream meripo set comeing up

if 2 sambas can applie on mobs then
DNC haste samba + drain samba + additional cureing
BRD marches
COR chaos and additonal roll
+ 3 DDs

a pt without any healer

I think Dancers can function as a healer. Though... isn't it only possible to have one Samba at a time?

[Damane]

I think Dancers can function as a healer. Though... isn't it only possible to have one Samba at a time?

thats why I said if 2 sambas can apply to a mob, tough if haste samba + cureativ dances are enough and drain samba is not needed it can also work with only haste samba and the DNC doing the main cureing

[Sanjiyan]

Native Recycle trait with *good* gear that enhances it and 1min Unlimited Shot cool down, {Yes, please.}

There's many ways to adjust RNG without buffing the job beyond other DDs (though it can use a boost anyway) to make it more attractive to play. RNGs are so rare these days, that nobody can say the class isn't suffering.

Cheaper ammo, more status effect ammo, traits to make a stack of ammo last longer, adjust/add some abilities to give RNG a niche, more ways for a support job to buff a ranged weapon, higher level JAs/JTs that lets RNG do what it does better than other jobs (like SAM/RNG), changing ranged calculations to make r.acc and r.atk mean more, adjust the way the whole job is played (eg. auto-ranged attack would be nice), give RNGs more survivability/solo ability, etc etc.

None of it really requires overpowering the job. Personally I temporarily retired my RNG at 63 because it just ain't worth playing at this moment in time especially after the 2-handed buff. I'd love to get back into it though, and velocity shot is a good step. Though it doesn't do much to offset the cost of RNG, it just makes it easier to do the same damage faster and spend more gil in the process.

[Lucavi]

Tell me to fuck off again, and you're banned, btw.

Not that I really give two shits one way or another, but generally isn't it better as an intellectual to simply break down and embarass a poster through the use of logic and rapier wit, than to simply pull rank and assert your mod status?

You don't owe -me- any intellectual consideration when I do what? Where did -I- willfully forget the past effects of a jobs dominance? Are you unable to differentiate between someones outlandish opinion and my own, which I made on this same page?

Yeah, somewhat like this.

Back on topic, what else could anyone really say about velocity shot? We'll find out about it when it gets here. They haven't given us any additional information about it, and last I checked, most speculation threads get locked and left to die out at sea.

[Judai]

I think it's usually better not to tell mods to fuck off in the first place~

[Lucavi]

True, but mod's shit stinks just like anyone elses. I'd rather not tell anyone to fuck off in the first place, as its terribly base and does nothing outside of demeaning one's own intelligence, but to essentially "fear" a mod simply because of some online title seems a bit... silly. We're getting off track, though:

back to the random posts crying and whining about rng.

[Kazen]

I think it's usually better not to tell Admins to fuck off in the first place~

[suji]

Tell me to fuck off again, and you're banned, btw.

Not that I really give two shits one way or another, but generally isn't it better as an intellectual to simply break down and embarass a poster through the use of logic and rapier wit, than to simply pull rank and assert your mod status?

[quote:bortibza]
You don't owe -me- any intellectual consideration when I do what? Where did -I- willfully forget the past effects of a jobs dominance? Are you unable to differentiate between someones outlandish opinion and my own, which I made on this same page?

Yeah, somewhat like this.[/quote:bortibza]
You should read posts from top to bottom instead of bottom to top.

[Lucavi]

You should read posts from top to bottom instead of bottom to top.

I did, I was simply illustrating a point of why it was deemed necessary to threaten him, when he'd already responded to his posts in a way that provides the argumentative "zing" that everyone seeks when having an internet battle. It'd be a technical "whoosh" if I ever bothered to shoot for those.

[VZX]

Damn 2 pages of RNG

If a ranger fires an arrow that costs ~150 gil and deals 150 dmg, and a warrior swings his great axe once (costs 0 gil), and deals 200 dmg in the same amount of time, then the game isn't balanced. Nevermind the possiblity of the WAR double attacking and dealing 400 dmg instead, while no ranged attack can do the same.

Rapid Shot is basically double attack >_>

Not anywhere close >.>, although it seems good on paper.

[Xavier]

You should read posts from top to bottom instead of bottom to top.

I did, I was simply illustrating a point of why it was deemed necessary to threaten him, when he'd already responded to his posts in a way that provides the argumentative "zing" that everyone seeks when having an internet battle. It'd be a technical "whoosh" if I ever bothered to shoot for those.

While I get what you're saying, I think you misinterpreted the "threat". Both posts, all I asked him to do was actually talk about the issue in a productive way, and not respond with something that contributes nothing, or tells someone to fuck off. Both times, he responded with a big ol' fuck you and your family. The threat was over trolling and not disagreeing with me. You're free to disagree as much as you want, so long as its more substantial than "I don't owe any reasoning to you, fuck your family".

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Rapid Shot is nice, but in no way comes close to a true double attack.

[Palin@Ramuh]

Is it that unreasonable to think that RNG should have an edge? I don't even have RNG leveled, and wouldn't ever level it. However, RNG spends lots of money to do damage. Other DD spend nothing, and probably do more damage. Is that fair, no.

People here have compared RNG to COR and NIN. A Support and a Tank. RNG is PURE DD ONLY. You have to compare it to other PURE DD ONLY jobs, or else your comparison is flawed.

if RNG is required to spend money to do damage, it shouldn't be gimp compared to other pure DD jobs. In reality, the fact that they are REQUIRED to drop money for damage should entitle them to at least SOME edge. Whether you consider that edge as being Ranged and out of lot of AOE or a damage edge, that is personal opinion.

I personally believe if RNG is dropping money (whereas other pure DDs arent), they should do more damage. It's not THAT unreasonable.

[TB]

I'd gladly trade a fucking sneak ninjutsu for Jubaku: Ni. -.-;

[Kenai]

I always thought RNG did have it's own edges. Barrage is still awesome (prolly the best JA there is) and they can hit kited mobs, use different bolts and arrows better than anyone else to land their respective effects, and the favorite mob in the game to merit on (colibri) just happens to be weak to piercing.

And for the record, I have spent millions of gil and more time than I care to admit on automaton parts and those stupid frame-making quests (none of which even drop from HNMs as of yet), but you won't hear me QQing about needing to outparse every other DD at everything, not to metion what BST can eat up. My reward for that work is currently soloing and sitting in Whitegate, occasionally sneaking my way into an event for parsing and hard job-performance info. I'll settle for comparable damage in merits and a few things only I could do on endgame mobs, be grateful you have that at least.

[Anakron]

if 2 sambas can applie on mobs then
DNC haste samba + drain samba + additional cureing

Only 1 samba per dancer...only question is if you can have 2 sambas with 2 dancers.

[Tempyst]

Is it that unreasonable to think that RNG should have an edge? I don't even have RNG leveled, and wouldn't ever level it. However, RNG spends lots of money to do damage. Other DD spend nothing, and probably do more damage. Is that fair, no.

People here have compared RNG to COR and NIN. A Support and a Tank. RNG is PURE DD ONLY. You have to compare it to other PURE DD ONLY jobs, or else your comparison is flawed.

if RNG is required to spend money to do damage, it shouldn't be gimp compared to other pure DD jobs. In reality, the fact that they are REQUIRED to drop money for damage should entitle them to at least SOME edge. Whether you consider that edge as being Ranged and out of lot of AOE or a damage edge, that is personal opinion.

I personally believe if RNG is dropping money (whereas other pure DDs arent), they should do more damage. It's not THAT unreasonable.

Any good DD will spend plenty of money on their way to 75, and plenty more trying to further increase their damage output.

[Xavier]

Thats not exactly an accurate statement because it assumes that rangers don't spend money on gear too. Its also inaccurate because once you purchase a piece of gear, the cost for that upgrade is paid for, so eventually you will reach the point of needing 0 gil, whereas you are never done spending money on ammo.

[Palin@Ramuh]

Everyone spends money. Really? No shit.

please dont tell me you are so naive as to not know what I am talking about. Everyone spends money on food and gear. RNG is REQUIRED to spend ADDITIONAL money to pump out damage per attack. You can count the money every time you shoot a shot. You can't do that with a ridill WAR. After he has gear and food, he has no additional costs.

RNG has to continuously pay for damage.

Honestly, you can't deny this.


What happens after this is a value judgement. Everyone is gonna hve their own personal opinions. I don't personally find it so outlandish that RNG top tier damage if not the Best because they have to pay out of pocket for damage, whereas no other pure DD has to.

[Kaelan]

I personally believe if RNG is dropping money (whereas other pure DDs arent), they should do more damage. It's not THAT unreasonable.

If you did things by that logic, you'd also have to make Ninjas consistently better than Paladins

[Xavier]

I personally believe if RNG is dropping money (whereas other pure DDs arent), they should do more damage. It's not THAT unreasonable.

If you did things by that logic, you'd also have to make Ninjas consistently better than Paladins

If you're talking about XP parties, Ninjas are consistently better than Paladins.

If you're talking about HNMs, a PLD/NIN and a NIN/DRK can spend the same amount of gil. I don't follow your conclusion.