In light of Repose (:D) I require Bard help :D

[Plight]

So you're saying it would be worth specifying every light crystal-dropping mob in the game regardless of how negligible the additional resistance is?

Edit: Resist Sleep trait applies to Lullaby also, so PLD type mobs will be somewhat resistant.

[Stolin]

Never tried, but I would guess that Fafnir resists Lullaby. Always just had a black mage elemental seal sleep 2 him if we've needed.

High level stuff like faf or even cactrot will resist lullaby 95% of the time no matter what but they can be lullabied. A NIN/BRD in my old LS managed to lullaby faf with bard as a sub.

[Xerlic]

Also, the most obvious bastard to resist (and then reflect) lullaby: Colibris. Not as impossible as Light elementals or Carbuncle but up there with Greater Birds and Aerns- aka Lullaby works but nowhere near as foolproof as it usually is.

No offense to you or anything, but are you one of those BRDs that xps in full haste setup and tries to cast lullaby without wearing any CHR/skill gear? These are usually the people that I see having problems keeping Greater Colibris slept at Tanjwhatever Isle. I don't use any haste gear whatsoever and I never have problems keeping Colibris lullabied. I usually get less than 5 resists during the course of a merit party and we usually stop around chain 150s.

Not trying to call you out or anything, but I've never noticed Colibris being resistant to light based sleep like some of the other mobs mentioned, so I found it kind of odd.

[Wizerd]

Also, the most obvious bastard to resist (and then reflect) lullaby: Colibris. Not as impossible as Light elementals or Carbuncle but up there with Greater Birds and Aerns- aka Lullaby works but nowhere near as foolproof as it usually is.

No offense to you or anything, but are you one of those BRDs that xps in full haste setup and tries to cast lullaby without wearing any CHR/skill gear? These are usually the people that I see having problems keeping Greater Colibris slept at Tanjwhatever Isle. I don't use any haste gear whatsoever and I never have problems keeping Colibris lullabied. I usually get less than 5 resists during the course of a merit party and we usually stop around chain 150s.

Not trying to call you out or anything, but I've never noticed Colibris being resistant to light based sleep like some of the other mobs mentioned, so I found it kind of odd.

I think they tend to wake up earlier than most mobs - such as around the 15-17 second mark (1/2 resist), more often than other monsters. Greater Birds, however, I've never had problems sleeping on BRD, and they always seem to snooze for the whole duration. Just because it's light based, doesn't mean it'll resist light based sleeps.

However, Tonko is right about Tonberries.

There really isn't a lot that Bards can't sleep - a lot less than the list of things Black Mages can't sleep I think.

[sb]

A bard in debuffing gear should not have a problem at all with colberi. The only times I noticed partial/full resists was playing around in a speed casting build (i.e. hp gear to activate minstrels ring).

[Vigilia]

Also, the most obvious bastard to resist (and then reflect) lullaby: Colibris. Not as impossible as Light elementals or Carbuncle but up there with Greater Birds and Aerns- aka Lullaby works but nowhere near as foolproof as it usually is.

No offense to you or anything, but are you one of those BRDs that xps in full haste setup and tries to cast lullaby without wearing any CHR/skill gear? These are usually the people that I see having problems keeping Greater Colibris slept at Tanjwhatever Isle. I don't use any haste gear whatsoever and I never have problems keeping Colibris lullabied. I usually get less than 5 resists during the course of a merit party and we usually stop around chain 150s.

Not trying to call you out or anything, but I've never noticed Colibris being resistant to light based sleep like some of the other mobs mentioned, so I found it kind of odd.

Nope, usual merit setup on colibris is AF2 hat, AF1+1hands/legs, w.torque, HQ staves, proper instruments etc., only 3 merits in Wind skill atm though and no Musical earring, been putting them off as BRD's not exactly my main job. I'm not saying Colibris are massively resistant but still resist more than Trolls/Mamools where I never have to look over my shoulder. Like someone mentioned above- you don't get full resists much but often they wake up quicker than most other mobs, long before recast timer on Foe Lullaby is up and I'm not using Horde with three Wivres on top of me. In a meritburn it doesn't matter really as they rarely live that long but something to watch for if you ever have to keep one slept for long or if you're leveling on them in the 50s and your party's not killing one in under fifteen seconds yet.


Also slightly off topic, why not make a list of things that only light-based sleep works on as well? Some are obvious like Dark Elementals but not many seem know that for example Hecteyes have massive resistance to dark-based sleep (I don't know if they're fully resistant though) and it's something we almost always have to tell peeps when they come to Dynamis for the first time on BRD.

[Foustian]

On the topic of whether or not Greater Birds can be slept with dark-based sleeps, I have two experiences with the birds in Valley of Sorrows.

1) A RDM/NIN and a WHM/NIN were duoing Adamantoise, and had no problem keeping a raptor add asleep, but never, for even a second, was the bird add they got slept.

2) I was duoing Adamantoise with a RDM, who could not for the life of him sleep a bird add. I don't remember what he was subbing so I don't know if he tried Elemental Seal or not, but he repeatedly failed to sleep it.

[Wizerd]

I hope Repose is a 1min spell, instead of 30sec like lollaby.

[rrynn]

i went out and tried to sleep the TOO WEAK greater birds in mis.coast on rdm. 8 merits, pluto's staff, af2 hat, af1 body, master caster's active, nashira pants, torque, earring, darksday, anrin obi. even subbed blm for elemental seal. and they wouldn't sleep. i've seen brds sleep the greater birds in meadows while meriting, but i've given up on trying to ever sleep them w dark based sleep.

[Spekkio]

interesting to consider, whm is the first job (when subbing blm, which may be passe with the advent of sco) to possess both a capable light and dark based sleep on the same job. this versatility will allow a whm to choose the element most effective for the situation. as such, while it's important to remember which mobs are most vulnerable to which sleep type, any mob that can be slept, a whm/blm will have the tools to put down.

[fantasticdan]

interesting to consider, whm is the first job (when subbing blm, which may be passe with the advent of sco) to possess both a capable light and dark based sleep on the same job. this versatility will allow a whm to choose the element most effective for the situation. as such, while it's important to remember which mobs are most vulnerable to which sleep type, any mob that can be slept, a whm/blm will have the tools to put down.

Uhh hello blu?

[Ryphen]

I've never had a greater bird of comparable level go to sleep with dark based sleep. Even with using Ele seal. I haven't been out to Lufaise in forever, so I don't really remember how lullaby works on them, but I want to say they have a higher than 5% resist rate if I recall correctly the beating the bard would take while trying to get them to sleep in camp. Does anyone remember Abraxus dropping light crystals before dropping wind crystals? I seem to remember that for some reason though I might be going crazy.

As far as colibri go, if I compare my lullaby resist rate to my Sleep resist rate, it's definitely higher. I think I've failed to land Sleep on like, one. Though the sample size isn't anywhere near as large. I'd say they definitely do have some kind of light resistance thing going though, because they fully resist the additional effect damage from holy bolts a lot. The additional effect from Ice arrows would proc a lot better.

[Ganzar]

Can't lullaby shades. (or at least, extremely resistant)

[drewbixcube]

I know for a fact Chariots(Nyzul at least) can be slept with Light Shot(COR), did it last night.

[Plight]

So, anyone found the source of the Repose scroll yet?
Nevermind - viewtopic.php?f=2&t=26219

[deced]

i was wondering if people could just dump things that resist light-based sleeps

Keep in mind that for lullaby, often times skill can outright nullify traditional elemental properties to an extent. Bards not using skill gear/merits cannot sleep Detectors in sky except maybe a fluke. Once you get some skill gear/merits, you can sleep Detectors as reliably as a rdm. I have no idea if this will hold true for Repose.

Few things to note:

Lamia - Totally immune to lullaby as far as I can tell / been told by reliable people
Aerns - Extremely difficult to lullaby pre-merits. Post merits/gear (I'm sitting @256 for both singing and wind), I can sleep the ones in Al'Taieu something like a 70%+ rate (eyeball, non-parse), and the ones inside Hu'xzoi and Ru'Hmet @50-60%. The ones on the second floor tend to suck more than the lower floor ones, assuming this is a level based difference.
Euvhi - Never had a Euvhi of any kind (save JoFaith) resist a lullaby. The ones for Limbus Card and the ones inside are both easy to sleep.
Fomor - The ones out in Lufaise/MisCoast I can sleep no problem (to my memory, never specifically tested it). The ones inside Sacrarium are death to you to try to sleep. This may simply be a case of level trumping resist properties.

fully resistant:
light elemental
carbuncle
qutrub? (that sucks lol)

Carbuncle from Dynamis summoners do NOT fully resist a lullaby. I can put them to sleep with lullaby. Positive I've done it multiple times in cities. Believe I've done it in Glacier, but it's been so long I can't be sure that's correct. Either way, it's never a smart idea to have a BRD take care of a Carbuncle, but they _can_ technically be slept by lullaby.

Like Lamia, never encountered a Qutrub I could lullaby. However my experience is generally restricted to the handful of Dvucca Island parties I've managed to get out there.

The Lufaise exp Greater Birds (with those Rams) can be reliably slept by lullaby after a certain point in +skill. I have no problems with them now, but I did use to. Was near maxed on merits before Nyzul ever came out, so Greater Colibri have never posed a problem.

In regards to Limbus, that's a totally new ballgame. For whatever reason, Limbus mobs don't necessarily follow traditional lullaby "rules" so to speak. I have no problems sleeping things in Temenos West, which makes sense, cause they're all just run of the mill animal monsters. In Apollyon NW, however, lullaby works for the first floor, but NONE of the others. Which is odd, cause I shouldn't have any problems sleeping wyverns and bugards, but they're outright immune. If I recall correctly, the DARK elementals on the top floor of Apollyon SW are immune or HIGHLY resistant to lullaby which doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm told certain NMs like Xolotl are difficult to lullaby (no idea if true or not). I can sleep him just fine. His pets sleep easily as well, but they build resistance fairly fast.

Antlions in Sheep in Antlion's Clothing ENM build resistance to Lullaby fast even though normal Antlions in Attohwa don't seem to.

Tonberries are light based.

But sleep fine to lullaby. Could get it on them even before I had many merits and only had a AF2 Roundlet.

Never tried, but I would guess that Fafnir resists Lullaby. Always just had a black mage elemental seal sleep 2 him if we've needed.

Well, that's a case where you can just say Fafnir can be said to resist Sleeps in general, not lullaby-specific. Applies to black magic as well. Just more reasonable to have ES black magic sleep, whereas no one ever brings a BRD/BLM to Dragon's Aery.

Like someone mentioned above- you don't get full resists much but often they wake up quicker than most other mobs, long before recast timer on Foe Lullaby is up and I'm not using Horde with three Wivres on top of me.

Don't know if it's like Detectors where skill can seem to "break" it, but Greater Colibri sleep the full 33 second duration for me off Mary's. It's no different than Mamool or Trolls. Side note: I don't avoid Horde because of Wivre, you can just kill them if you get an add in exp, no big deal, but more for the fact that I don't want the Colibri recasting it back at my party.

[Drek]

whm is the first job... to possess both a capable light and dark based sleep on the same job.

Blue Mage has both light and dark based sleeps, as well.

--Drek.

EDIT: Right, there was a whole other page to this thread... good work, team.

[Similli]

i was wondering if people could just dump things that resist light-based sleeps

Keep in mind that for lullaby, often times skill can outright nullify traditional elemental properties to an extent. Bards not using skill gear/merits cannot sleep Detectors in sky except maybe a fluke. Once you get some skill gear/merits, you can sleep Detectors as reliably as a rdm. I have no idea if this will hold true for Repose.

Few things to note:

Lamia - Totally immune to lullaby as far as I can tell / been told by reliable people
Aerns - Extremely difficult to lullaby pre-merits. Post merits/gear (I'm sitting @256 for both singing and wind), I can sleep the ones in Al'Taieu something like a 70%+ rate (eyeball, non-parse), and the ones inside Hu'xzoi and Ru'Hmet @50-60%. The ones on the second floor tend to suck more than the lower floor ones, assuming this is a level based difference.
Euvhi - Never had a Euvhi of any kind (save JoFaith) resist a lullaby. The ones for Limbus Card and the ones inside are both easy to sleep.
Fomor - The ones out in Lufaise/MisCoast I can sleep no problem (to my memory, never specifically tested it). The ones inside Sacrarium are death to you to try to sleep. This may simply be a case of level trumping resist properties.

[quote:2pspfxsb]fully resistant:
light elemental
carbuncle
qutrub? (that sucks lol)

Carbuncle from Dynamis summoners do NOT fully resist a lullaby. I can put them to sleep with lullaby. Positive I've done it multiple times in cities. Believe I've done it in Glacier, but it's been so long I can't be sure that's correct. Either way, it's never a smart idea to have a BRD take care of a Carbuncle, but they _can_ technically be slept by lullaby.

Like Lamia, never encountered a Qutrub I could lullaby. However my experience is generally restricted to the handful of Dvucca Island parties I've managed to get out there.

The Lufaise exp Greater Birds (with those Rams) can be reliably slept by lullaby after a certain point in +skill. I have no problems with them now, but I did use to. Was near maxed on merits before Nyzul ever came out, so Greater Colibri have never posed a problem.

In regards to Limbus, that's a totally new ballgame. For whatever reason, Limbus mobs don't necessarily follow traditional lullaby "rules" so to speak. I have no problems sleeping things in Temenos West, which makes sense, cause they're all just run of the mill animal monsters. In Apollyon NW, however, lullaby works for the first floor, but NONE of the others. Which is odd, cause I shouldn't have any problems sleeping wyverns and bugards, but they're outright immune. If I recall correctly, the DARK elementals on the top floor of Apollyon SW are immune or HIGHLY resistant to lullaby which doesn't make any sense at all.

I'm told certain NMs like Xolotl are difficult to lullaby (no idea if true or not). I can sleep him just fine. His pets sleep easily as well, but they build resistance fairly fast.

Antlions in Sheep in Antlion's Clothing ENM build resistance to Lullaby fast even though normal Antlions in Attohwa don't seem to.

Tonberries are light based.

But sleep fine to lullaby. Could get it on them even before I had many merits and only had a AF2 Roundlet.

Never tried, but I would guess that Fafnir resists Lullaby. Always just had a black mage elemental seal sleep 2 him if we've needed.

Well, that's a case where you can just say Fafnir can be said to resist Sleeps in general, not lullaby-specific. Applies to black magic as well. Just more reasonable to have ES black magic sleep, whereas no one ever brings a BRD/BLM to Dragon's Aery.

Like someone mentioned above- you don't get full resists much but often they wake up quicker than most other mobs, long before recast timer on Foe Lullaby is up and I'm not using Horde with three Wivres on top of me.

Don't know if it's like Detectors where skill can seem to "break" it, but Greater Colibri sleep the full 33 second duration for me off Mary's. It's no different than Mamool or Trolls. Side note: I don't avoid Horde because of Wivre, you can just kill them if you get an add in exp, no big deal, but more for the fact that I don't want the Colibri recasting it back at my party.[/quote:2pspfxsb]

To any well geared and merited BRD this is 100% true. Aside from a few things that outright resist, or build a resistance, stacking skill and CHR will negate most elemental properties. I sleep Detectors/Aerns/etc fine in skill gear and for Euvhi/Colibri/Mamools I don't even bother switching out of fastcast gear because I have such faith that one of my 2 lullabies will land. If your looking at how best to stick Repose to resistant mobs all I can say is that from BRD experience stacking skill will highly benefit you and neutralize most natural resistance.

If you're not getting most (above 90%) Colibri to sleep the full 33 seconds off Foe Lullaby its time to reevaluate your BRD gear. Horde lullaby isn't a good alternative, meriting your Lullaby recast and getting a good -DMG/Blink-tanking the mobs is preferable. When I merit on Colibri I use nearly full fastcast/haste save possibly Musical earring, Wind Torque, and maybe AF+1 hands or Legs (I usually prefer Sha'ir and Haidate here for the recast). These coupled with Apollo's/Mary's is more than enough to sleep birds. Your mileage may vary depending on merits though. In this case wear AF+1 or at the very least AF will give you better results.

Limbus is just wierd and for the most part I just equip -DMG in Apollyons when mobs link and kite them so the don't kill a tank. The dark elementals are resistant in nearly full skill gear, minus gjallorhorn, with 8/8 wind/singing merits and something like 110-120 CHR. Makes no sense. In Temenos though I have no trouble sleep pretty much anything save a few examples I'm sure, although tbh I can't think of them.

[Nirokun!]

so many conflicting accounts of what sleep and what doesnt idk who to believe so i can update the first post ;(

[Spekkio]

whm is the first job... to possess both a capable light and dark based sleep on the same job.

Blue Mage has both light and dark based sleeps, as well.

--Drek.

EDIT: Right, there was a whole other page to this thread... good work, team.

well played. i admit my error...which is sad, as i have a 61 blu atm.