Scholar Discussion attempt #2

[Toth]

You know...if healing isn't a big issue for a SMN, the ability to Aspir and use a few spells with reasonable accuracy could be really cool...I have to try it out :D

P.S Can anyone bump my Scholar Handbook thread on KI? I have a lot of good info to add to it but unless it gets bumped back up, I don't want to waste my time ; ;

[Gilthas]

The only /SCH spells you'd need accuracy for is Aspir/Drain and elemental spells up to Water II.

So yeah, I don't really see /SCH as a viable sub for SMNs just because of Aspir.

[evilpaul]

Hmm.. I was about to admit that /SCH might not be entirely too bad for situational SMN use if it lets them land silence or sleep or something somewhat reliably. Same for a somewhat reliable aspir. But then I realized Scholar doesn't have any enfeebling magic, not even gravity from the demo let alone sleep or silence. So all it would really let a SMN do is aspir while still being able to sneak/invis, cure, raise, etc. Of course, that's at the expense of erase, -nas, curaga, stoneskin and blink. But hey, at least they could cast Regen II!

If you were mainhealing on Greater Colibri as SMN, it wouldn't be a bad sub. Aerial Armor and Earthen Ward are still decent buffs. If you don't need status cures it doesn't sound bad at all really. Regen 2 and better MP conservation than /WHM provides.

Not the new primary SJ for SMN or even really a required one, but I think it's can be situationally useful.

[Evelyn]

I think melees would get mad when the colibris reflect elegy and theres no one to erase :/

[Kaslo]

I think melees would get mad when the colibris reflect elegy and theres no one to erase :/

Erase what? There is nothing to erase!

[Evelyn]

elegy is a slow effect that cannot be overwritten by haste last I checked, and BRDs like to cast it when they pull last I checked... (and not all party members have shadows)

[evilpaul]

I'm kind of wondering why your melees would take so long to kill a bird that the BRD needs to re-apply Elegy midfight?

[Kaslo]

elegy is a slow effect that cannot be overwritten by haste last I checked, and BRDs like to cast it when they pull last I checked... (and not all party members have shadows)

Well I have never had a melee get hit with elegy in the 50+ merits I have got off greater birds, even if they did usually my other brd is /whm. Haste doesn't overwrite elegy yes, but elegy doesn't overwrite haste either

Overall if someone is hit with elegy your group sucks to begin with...

[Wizerd]

Quit spouting when you don't know what you're talking about. It's quite easy for melees to get elegied a time or two during a merit party, provided their shadows are down - and easier for the pulling BRD to get elegied.

There's a delay after you cast elegy before the mob casts it back on you, and when I was pulling on BRD throughout the non-linking Colibri, my melees often provoked very fast, even before it cast again, and that gives a 50% chance that the elegy is going to be cast on them instead of me. Not to mention Elegy -> Sleep, more often than not, causes the Colibri to cast Elegy and then Sleep afterwards, and I would hope as BRD you don't have hate by the time it wakes up. Casting another song definitely doesn't make them forget the song before, and I tested this countless times by casting multiple threnodies after lullabies, to try and block out lullaby.

Oh and Kaslo, Greater Birds don't reflect.

PS: I'd have to say "If no one but your BRD in your group is getting elegied, then your group sucks at crowd control." in response to what you said at the bottom of your post. DRK/WAR is win in low level Colibri merit.

Edit:

Scholar Discussion attempt #2.

Right-o, so how about those Helices? <_<

[ruf]

Scholar Discussion attempt #2.

[Naramaska]

Next question then:

So, are all Helices the same damage but different element? Or do they increase in potency as you go to higher levels like most BLM spells.

And, more importantly: Enfeebling or Elemental?

[Not Kuno]

Next question then:

So, are all Helices the same damage but different element? Or do they increase in potency as you go to higher levels like most BLM spells.

And, more importantly: Enfeebling or Elemental?

Read the thread: Nobody knows yet.

[Shadowstalker]

we'd need a 65 scholar for that to happen, highest thats posted his experience is 61. you do the math.

I'm aware. It's just something to think about as people get higher in level, (hell 65 probably isn't that far away if someone is already 61, right?)

Kohana, what sub have you been using to level Scholar? If you're looking to determine whether magic attack bonus affects helices, you could compare values of your damage /whm vs. /blm, I think?

[Kaslo]

Quit spouting when you don't know what you're talking about. It's quite easy for melees to get elegied a time or two during a merit party, provided their shadows are down - and easier for the pulling BRD to get elegied.

There's a delay after you cast elegy before the mob casts it back on you, and when I was pulling on BRD throughout the non-linking Colibri, my melees often provoked very fast, even before it cast again, and that gives a 50% chance that the elegy is going to be cast on them instead of me. Not to mention Elegy -> Sleep, more often than not, causes the Colibri to cast Elegy and then Sleep afterwards, and I would hope as BRD you don't have hate by the time it wakes up. Casting another song definitely doesn't make them forget the song before, and I tested this countless times by casting multiple threnodies after lullabies, to try and block out lullaby.

Oh and Kaslo, Greater Birds don't reflect.

PS: I'd have to say "If no one but your BRD in your group is getting elegied, then your group sucks at crowd control." in response to what you said at the bottom of your post. DRK/WAR is win in low level Colibri merit.

Edit:

Scholar Discussion attempt #2.

Right-o, so how about those Helices? <_<

Dee Dee Dee

I was refering to Greater on the Bird mobs (Greater Colibri) which was being discussed way to not use logic there!

I'm just saying in my merit parties I have never once had a melee Elegy'd and even if it ever did happen I have a BRD/WHM there to Erase (though, like I said, they never have to)... Did you even read my post or just see Greater Birds (Colibiri, incase your not paying attention again)?

Once again back on topic what this means is with a good merit party RDM/SCH will probably be more beneficial than RDM/WHM...

[Naramaska]

Next question then:

So, are all Helices the same damage but different element? Or do they increase in potency as you go to higher levels like most BLM spells.

And, more importantly: Enfeebling or Elemental?

Read the thread: Nobody knows yet.

Hence why I was asking--was hoping Kohanacat had gotten a skillup or something while using it so we'd know

[whoami]

well unless his skills are under 200 only base skill gets a skill up so yeah only way to tele is if they didnt have dark/ele/enfebling past 170ish or past 200 to tell which. Id say try both books frist that cuts it to 1/3 choices right there. then compare /whm /rdm to /blm thats 0/1/2 MAB traits then play with int or mnd. my geuss is its elemental but im cheering for enfeebling. Seeing as how we get dark magic (drain/aspir) comparable nukes/lvl to blm up to tier 3 prot/shell/regen for enchancing and cure 1-4 for healing 0 divine and 0 enfbebling best bet id wager is elemental if this patern of spells learned for sch (ele dark heal enchanc) up to highest lvls possible without merits.

[Hadibou]

- An issue wherein the maximum number of charges for the scholar ability "Stratagems" was not functioning correctly has been addressed.

Goodbye 3 charges at lvl 10. Oh well, I suppose it's just fair game... at least we played with this for one week, need to wait higher levels now ; ;

[Lokim]

I'm just saying in my merit parties I have never once had a melee Elegy'd...

You're either full of shit or you've got your filters set wrong. Why do you insist on becoming a pariah on every forum you ever join? Go back to making stupid claims on the Carbuncle forums, at least there you're not embarrassing the rest of us.


I'm really curious to see how helices stack up once their modifiers are discovered. It might take a while for people to get used to the change, but I think a true DoT mage class will be a welcome addition to most endgame fights, assuming the helices are worth it. I'm essentially required to level it to 37 for my white mage, but I think this is a job I wouldn't mind taking the rest of the way.

If only it could wear Morrigan's Robe...

[Genosync]

Next question then:

So, are all Helices the same damage but different element? Or do they increase in potency as you go to higher levels like most BLM spells.

And, more importantly: Enfeebling or Elemental?

Read the thread: Nobody knows yet.

Hence why I was asking--was hoping Kohanacat had gotten a skillup or something while using it so we'd know

we're all dumb as shit.

Manifestation, Helix. If it works, it's enfeebling. If not, we still don't know, but we know it's not enfeebling.

[Naramaska]

we're all dumb as shit.

Manifestation, Helix. If it works, it's enfeebling. If not, we still don't know, but we know it's not enfeebling.