Little disappointing?

[Ryko]

Like how most of you forgot how ToAU began... with nothing.

When one is making a point it is in said one's best interest to not flat out lie.

A shame it's not a lie, good sir.

So you ignored the entirety of what was mentioned in this topic as far as TOAU goes huh? Nothing? It was missing 1 new assault area, salvage, and einherjar. It still had 15 assaults, plenty of new exp camps, a worldspawn with moderately useful drops... far far far far faaaaaaar from nothing. If you're not lying then you're delusional, pick one.

[nightmaric]

What's Moderately useful about Cerberus was that most of his drops were actually given stuff to craft with several months later.

Outside of his hides/meat - the only drop it had that interested anyone was Algol.

[Ryko]

What's Moderately useful about Cerberus was that most of his drops were actually given stuff to craft with several months later.

Outside of his hides/meat - the only drop it had that interested anyone was Algol.

The cerb mantle (/+1) was not "several months later"... The bow and mantle were great additions to fire resist builds (the mantle being a perfectly good full time shadows up piece) and the sainti are a good enmity option for ninjas, the only one I think was added later were the sainti. The algol is sorta duh.

[fantasticdan]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't ToAU come with 11 zones and 15 assaults and 1 HNM. WotG currently has 17 zones, the mini campaign missions (8 to start with?), and 1 title NM. Doesn't WotG actually have more than ToAU did?

Only 3-4 of the available WotG zones are new.

And not including BC areas or boats, I think ToAU launched with 12 or so NEW zones. Not to mention most ToAU zones themselves are HUGE compared the old or the few new ones in WotG, and stretch across many maps each.

[Khrno]

Outside of his hides/meat - the only drop it had that interested anyone was Algol.

Algol only interested DRKs. I laugh at WARs that care about GS since they can't SS, even PLDs make better use of them.

And like it has been said multiple times already in this thread and just above by Ryko, main drop by Cerberus, right at start was Hide for the mantle, great for tanking and HQ is best DD mantle there is, I want it instead of my Foragers. Certainly worthy items, not like a "title NM" that drops what? 86 gil?

[Sho]

Like how most of you forgot how ToAU began... with nothing.

When one is making a point it is in said one's best interest to not flat out lie.

A shame it's not a lie, good sir.

So you ignored the entirety of what was mentioned in this topic as far as TOAU goes huh? Nothing? It was missing 1 new assault area, salvage, and einherjar. It still had 15 assaults, plenty of new exp camps, a worldspawn with moderately useful
drops... far far far far faaaaaaar from nothing. If you're not lying then you're delusional, pick one.

I can't believe you just counted 15 Assaults, and neglected the other 35 with your count of Nyzul, Salvage, etc-- it is content you know, but I guess moot. Also sorry to say that claiming Cerb wasn't as common as it is now-- was on lockdown for a good while on my server (you should know that a mob that you can't claim is no good to you... ever). I'll give ya the exp areas, tho they were moderately useful for a time, until people flooded the camps from sky and sea, lol.

And yeah nothing, I still say, when you compare to how it is now. That was a bare-bones expansion back then, same as it is now with WoTG. It's whatever mein, not gonna sit here and argue on expansion content.

[Ryko]

I can't believe you just counted 15 Assaults, and neglected the other 35 with your count of Nyzul, Salvage, etc-- it is content you know, but I guess moot... And yeah nothing, I still say, when you compare to how it is now. That was a bare-bones expansion back then, same as it is now with WoTG. It's whatever mein, not gonna sit here and argue on expansion content.

It is moot since I wasn't discounting nyzul, salvage, etc but rather was only counting content at the beginning of TOAU. "Relatively nothing" and actually, truly nothing are 2 different things, since the relatively obviously changes as time passes.

Also sorry to say that claiming Cerb wasn't as common as it is now-- was on lockdown for a good while on my server (you should know that a mob that you can't claim is no good to you... ever). I'll give ya the exp areas, tho they were moderately useful for a time, until people flooded the camps from sky and sea, lol.

Yeah I guess you have a point about claiming the mob, guess I was a lucky one with having the mob pretty much on dead lock for the first 2 months.

[Sho]

Must meet ya half way on shit-- I think WoTG will either have some expansive (like the magnitude of Salvage) new content updates, or it'll have it's current applications modded many, many times over (like Beseiged). It really does feel like it's 5~10% complete, vs ToAU being like 15~20% at the get go. Ahh well, we'll see in January.

[Gwynplaine]

The things I'm most interested in personally with expansions are the new trends they can set. Basically, the way gameplay evolves because of the new enemies/gear/events etc. Buying ToAU there was no bullet point on the back of the box showcasing faster, better means of partying, and yet this was one of AU's strongest points.

I think it's entirely too soon to judge Wings too harshly. Campaign is still largely not well understood, and potential party/merit camps are still being rummaged through. Lack of any apparent HNM, or any NM for that matter is boring and disappointing I suppose, although not real surprising of them.

And if zone uniqueness is getting dragged into this, don't forget that Bhaflau Thickets, Wajaom Woodlands, and Caederva Mire are superficially the same damn zone. Different mobs, and one has fog. They're the Betty and Veronica of FFXI zones.

[LD]

Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't ToAU come with 11 zones and 15 assaults and 1 HNM. WotG currently has 17 zones, the mini campaign missions (8 to start with?), and 1 title NM. Doesn't WotG actually have more than ToAU did?

Only 3-4 of the available WotG zones are new.

And not including BC areas or boats, I think ToAU launched with 12 or so NEW zones. Not to mention most ToAU zones themselves are HUGE compared the old or the few new ones in WotG, and stretch across many maps each.

You can't just discount 10+ zones just because they LOOK like an old one. The measure of a zone is the content inside it. Yes, it's mostly a C/P, but they also added a lot of aesthetic, geographical, and technical details they make them undeniably different and new. Further, in actual traversable space, TOA zones aren't bigger than a lot of the old ones. Wajaom gives the illusion of a lot of space, but it's really a series of narrow passages with the occasional larger area. Even with its multiple areas, Bhaflau is probably smaller than any one of the nub zones.

And if zone uniqueness is getting dragged into this, don't forget that Bhaflau Thickets, Wajaom Woodlands, and Caederva Mire are superficially the same damn zone.

That too. Don't forget Sacrarium/Phomuina/Garlaige/Bostaunieux and Fei'Yin/Delkfutt/Ru'Avitau/Ve'Lugannon.


All you people have to fucking chill with the TOA comparisons. It added a LOT to the game in terms of innovation (exp areas 2-6x as good as the former average, very small to very large scale activities, an incredibly good item obtainable by anyone) and we should all be happy if this expansion even comes close, and it might.

Sigil is vastly superior to even Sanction, the only thing is doesn't do is collect Allied Notes (which makes sense, since if you're exping, you're not necessarily contributing to the War effort.) Campaign Battles allow one to engage in Beseiged-type battles in a much more approachable fashion, and more frequently. Campaign Ops allow you to be as active or inactive as you want and give a decent reward. Imagine Assault gave IS instead of area-specific assault points. That's pretty much what that is. Sprinter’s Shoes can be obtained even more easily than Turban (a lot more, really :x) and stack with other forms of movement+.

However, saying WotG has no significant flaws is also being ridiculous. We'll drop the major technical flaws, since every expansion release tends to have that, and I'm sure we all remember how Besieged was to begin with. So far, no one has found a Merit area comparable to Imps, Puks, or Colibri (and that IS something.) So far, WotG seems to lack a satisfying amount of story, even by ToAU standards. There are fewer Campaign Ops to begin with than there were Assaults, and they seem to take less effort. The only HNM-like creature is about as hard as a Jeuno NM or NQ Behemoth and drops nothing but a title.

WotG does seem to be weaker than ToAU was when it started, but it's not like things wont be fixed, so it's only as big of a deal as you choose to make it. I like what it already does and the fact that SE will build on that makes me optimistic for the future.

[sunb1ind]

Part of the reason why alot of people are really turned off at this expansion I think is the complete lack of fucking content in the update and the disc. Where the fuck is the gear/synths/new zones at? What reason, other than campaign, do people have to buy this expansion right now?

Unless 30 bucks means shit to you, the only thing smart to do right now is to wait for something worthwhile in the upcoming announcements. You gotta be pretty damn naive and/or dumb to think this expansion's release is anywhere close to TOAU.

What I do like in this expansion so far is the potential for campaign. This event could easily turn out to be a fun way to join in a wide-scale event at anytime solo or w/ a small party and get decent rewards ala Assault. They just forgot the whole rewards part. Dancer and Scholar both seem pretty unique, let's hope they turn out useful as they are fun.

Well, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt, since we don't know what they'll be adding to the upcoming patches.
They could just add in armor, spells, the summons, etc. and the joke would be on everyone here who looks for information in the DATs LOL
http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/7...2630869jn9.jpg
Wishful thinking

[fussel]

From the sounds of it, all the mobs are things that only 60+ can take on, and you still need to InviSneak everywhere.

I find it a bit disappointing that people cry wolf when they know nothing.

Level 10-12 worms for duo right outside Bastok Markets [S] (which is reachable on foot in 5 minutes from Port Bastok after you got the Maw).

And yeah, I'm pretty sure on exactly level 10-12 for those Worms, were EM-T on 10, were DC-EM on level 12.

Valkurm Dunes, I foresee your last days...

[BRP]

I will admit it's very bad what SE did with music and maps. Extremely lazy on their part. My high expectations wanted to see remixes of old music in either in a dreadful or lively mood. I would have settled for just new maps though. I hope they at least add new maps through updates, it was a poor choice to exclude them.

Aside from that, ToAU gave us a new city and that's where most of its hype comes from. More importantly it included 15 Assaults, exp camps, and a broken Besieged. I think WotG lacks most is exp camps. It might be possible to find a few though, I have yet to see experiments. Having a HNM like Cerberus would have been nice, but that's a lot of hype too. Both expansions had a very poor mission start.

I expect Campaign to be adjusted like Besieged, Campaign Ops becoming more complicated and detailed, and many new camps coming from the addition Shadowreign Beastmen strongholds and Northlands. I don't expect any replacements to present Jeuno or Al Zahbi, so if one won't be satisfied until they add that, I'd expect disappointment in their future.

[Khalil]

I expect Campaign to be adjusted like Besieged, Campaign Ops becoming more complicated and detailed, and many new camps coming from the addition Shadowreign Beastmen strongholds and Northlands. I don't expect any replacements to present Jeuno or Al Zahbi, so if one won't be satisfied until they add that, I'd expect disappointment in their future.

Sage Sundi: "We were hoping to design Campaign a little less different than Besieged, but in the end, we weren't able to do so. The reason; lolps2limitations."

[Sagacious Sundi]

I don't expect any replacements to present Jeuno or Al Zahbi, so if one won't be satisfied until they add that, I'd expect disappointment in their future.

Something tells me their intention was for there to be a steady flow of players in all major cities. Like, they intended us to still keep our homepoints in Al Zahbi land, but thanks to the Warp Taru Bros., transportation to your home nation/Jeuno is easy which in turn makes travel to the past relatively easy.

[fantasticdan]

I will admit it's very bad what SE did with music and maps. Extremely lazy on their part.

This is what bothers me, even thou nearly all released content is copy and paste, they STILL can't manage to do basic things like include functional maps. The fact that they haven't updated the music either is pretty disappointing.

Why do you think they decided to reuse existing zones for the majority of WotG in the first place? Was it because they thought time travel and seeing these zones in the past was going to be the coolest thing ever? Not likely... This was in almost all certainty, the answer they came up with when the question was asked, "How can we create a new expansion pack to make money and keep players playing, with only a couple programmers and very little resources?" I think the very nature of the expansion says a lot about what we can expect in terms of future content and updates from SE.

That's not to say there won't be some fun things to do in WotG eventually, some worthwhile gear, and some nms/hnms/whatever. However, I'm guessing this expansion in it's entirety is going to have significantly less content than the others when all is said and done.

[LD]

They, uh HAVE updated the music, seemingly in every area that had it.

[eva00r]

Part of the reason why alot of people are really turned off at this expansion I think is the complete lack of fucking content in the update and the disc. Where the fuck is the gear/synths/new zones at? What reason, other than campaign, do people have to buy this expansion right now?

New jobs = enough reason, isn't it ?

[Siatdiat]

Yeah because Blu/Cor/Pup are completed, and the new jobs will be completed very soon I'm sure, they wouldnt do anything silly like wait 2 years to do it right?

[Solarus]

WotG has a lot of POTENTIAL. But it does still feel like a bit of a demo/beta. Seems to be the accepted thing lately, that companies just let their use base test their products for them.

It's just kinda weird wandering around a place that should be populated, yet to find that it's mysteriously empty, or there are locked/non existent doors. Fort Karugo-Narugo for example, there's an seperate map there with 5 large rooms, all completely empty. Other than 1 NPC there, right in the middle, that you have to find for a quest/mission. Garlaige is another example, half the map full of empty rooms. Just seems kinda odd.

The lack of NMs is kinda weird too (Other than Sandworm). I'm not sure if it's on purpose, or just another thing that they forgot to add. I almost get the feeling that it's another of SE's ways to try and prevent RMT. There are no money drop NMs, and drop rates on most mobs that are farmable solo are pretty bad.

Campaign has the potential to change a lot of how we play, but at the moment it's not so great. Especially in the stronghold areas when you're looking for NPCs, and have to wait half an hour for it to end for them to reappear. But even if you are actually trying to do campaign, it's not too easy to actually find the battles, or the NPC that lets you participate, half the time. Generally there's just one small battle going on somewhere in the map, but they're not easy to find. Simple solution - when campaign starts, or when you zone it, it could just say that beastmen are attacking at a specific <pos>. Still, if you CAN find the NPC and the mobs, then you can get some nice easy exp from it.

That said, I AM actually enjoying the expansion. I love new stuff, story, and exploring. And I made some money out of it. So I can't complain. Still, I'll probably be done with all the quests today or tomorrow, and that won't leave much content until the next update.

Oh, and pixies are awesome.