Randomer Question Thread

[Absolutely Virtue]

This question is somewhat related to the one above about skilling up on self vs mobs. I've been playing for 6 years now, and I don't know the answer. I'm embarrassed.

How do Ninjutsu skillups work?

Every other skill I leveled had things that just went up naturally (Enfeebling, Enhancing, Healing, Elemental, etc). You play the job, and stuff just leveled up. And in the case of singing/strings/etc, I just went to Sea and leveled on goldfish. I never really thought about it.

Ninjutsu is like those singing/strings skills. You /could/ just stand in town casting shadows/monomi/tonko on yourself, and eventually you'd reach the cap. Or you /could/ fight goldfish and just jubaku/hojo/kurayami them forever. And judging from personal experience, I think we all agree that this will go much faster, although I don't know if anyone has figured out a formula or anything that proves how much faster.

There is no "cap" on things like singing and ninjutsu (unlike weapons), right? So I /could/ also go out to East Ronfaure and just jubaku/hojo/kurayami a rabbit and eventually max my skill, right? Ditto with elegy and threnodies. But again, this would take forever, presumably because the mob is such a low level.

Does anyone know if there is a formula for how that works? I'm pretty sure all the evidence is purely anecdotal, right? Just wondering, and feeling dumb.

[Ultimagi]

You won't get skill ups beyond 5 casting Elegy on a level 1 enemy. It works the same as weapons if you're using it against something.

[Araelus]

You won't get skill ups beyond 5 casting Elegy on a level 1 enemy. It works the same as weapons if you're using it against something.

The upshot of this is why Besieged is great for skill-ups.

[Thorny]

This question is somewhat related to the one above about skilling up on self vs mobs. I've been playing for 6 years now, and I don't know the answer. I'm embarrassed.

How do Ninjutsu skillups work?

Every other skill I leveled had things that just went up naturally (Enfeebling, Enhancing, Healing, Elemental, etc). You play the job, and stuff just leveled up. And in the case of singing/strings/etc, I just went to Sea and leveled on goldfish. I never really thought about it.

Ninjutsu is like those singing/strings skills. You /could/ just stand in town casting shadows/monomi/tonko on yourself, and eventually you'd reach the cap. Or you /could/ fight goldfish and just jubaku/hojo/kurayami them forever. And judging from personal experience, I think we all agree that this will go much faster, although I don't know if anyone has figured out a formula or anything that proves how much faster.

There is no "cap" on things like singing and ninjutsu (unlike weapons), right? So I /could/ also go out to East Ronfaure and just jubaku/hojo/kurayami a rabbit and eventually max my skill, right? Ditto with elegy and threnodies. But again, this would take forever, presumably because the mob is such a low level.

Does anyone know if there is a formula for how that works? I'm pretty sure all the evidence is purely anecdotal, right? Just wondering, and feeling dumb.

Find someone lowmanning jailer of fort or ix'drk, stand still, spam nuke wheel repeatedly. You save them a lot of time and you get extremely good skillups. Alternatively, do the same thing in besieged. Debuffs can only give skillups if they stick in my experience, and you can only stick each debuff once :/

[Absolutely Virtue]

Does it work that way for Enhancing, too? As in, if I'm level 40 WHM and my Enhancing is gimped, will I get faster skill ups if I spam protect on my level 75 friend than if I spam it on myself? I've got no way to test this, and I never thought to test it back in the day.

We all know this works, of course (speaking about Araelus' point, see also healing magic spells on undead in KRT bones parties back in the day, lol). I wasn't really asking about /how/ it works, but rather /why/ it works. As in formula, testing, etc. Sorry for the confusion.

[Spekkio]

iirc, it works like xp calculations in besieged and campaign. if you stick the spell or resist, it gets a roll for a skillup. if you get a "no effect" message b/c a copy of the effect is on the mob and not overwritten, you get diddly.

[Araelus]

So far as I understand it, the skillups on weapons check something along the lines of [Level_Cap - Current_Skill] with the target providing the Level_Cap and the greater this difference value is, the greater your chance of skilling up. This also somehow produces the possible values of the skillup (0.5 through 0.1).

This is similar to crafting's [Recipe_Cap - CurrentSkill], although so long as you can hit a mob for at least one point of damage you can skill up from that strike (as compared to crafting's stricter limits). When you cast a spell on a monster, or in the case of enhancing, on any NPC, it does a similar check to the weapon skilling.

What that actual formula is remains unclear. It was cracked for crafting, because crafting has a relatively small window before it does not allow you to attempt the synth. This meant people figured out they needed to be below the Recipe_Cap by X skill levels, depending on day/moon/etc. all that garbage.

My advice would be to cross-check your current skill level with what Job Level that skill would be blue for. Find a monster which would check T~VT to that Job Level, and go at it until the skills slow down. Then re-check and find a higher level monster.

So say you are on Warrior and you want to skill Axe. It's at 105 right now. That's the cap for Warrior lv34. So you want to fight a level 38 monster.

For Enhancing magic your best bet is Besieged, because the NPCs there are very high level, and because the whole level thing does not apply to other player's characters, so far as I know. I hope this is helpful.

[rlas549]

Oh man, I can't wait til next besieged so I can chainspell protect an npc over and over for my last few levels.

[GeneJackit]

Whats the deal w/ the weapons that have "echantment: Stone" on them?

wth does that mean?

[Jakson]

Whats the deal w/ the weapons that have "echantment: Stone" on them?

wth does that mean?

I think it just means that you cast Stone on your target. Nifty.

[SaviorSelf]

After having said weapon equipped for the duration required, you can go into your inventory and "use" it on an enemy. Too bad none of the weapons with enchantments like that are even remotely worth it...

[Ruiner]

Does anyone have a link to the tests for the one-hit weaponskill accuracy bonus theory?

[rlas549]

I think I remember reading that excal added effect does not cause extra hate and I want to say that it was proved to be slashing dmg(?). Does the same apply for enblizzard, etc.? I'm more curious about the former, the latter I assume is just magic dmg, though that's what I assumed excal effect was too.

[Araelus]

It was proven to be slashing damage, dunno on the enmity portion. En-spells are elemental magic damage that can be resisted, based on the m.acc+ tests. Blanking on thread names/links...

[stewie]

What's a good AH RDM bind setup at 75? Guessing something like
Aquilo's/Bugard+1//Phantom
AF/Enfeebling Torque/Loq. Earring/Phantom Earring
AF/Errant? Don't know here/Snow/Snow
Prism/Penitent's/Mahatma/Avocat

[Aragon of Odin]

You're confusing because even in your set up you have you have non-ahable items which leads me to wonder what other options you have.

Purely AF/AH items could go.

Aquilo's
Ice Grip/Bugard+1
Phantom Tathlum
AF2/Wise Cap+1/Elitle Beret+1(not 100%sure which would be better)AF+1
Enfeebling Torque
Enfeebling Earring/Phantom/Loquacious
AF Body
Mahatma Cuffs
Snow/Snow
Prism
Witches Sash/Penitent's Rope
Mahatma Slops
Can't remember what I used for feet before I got Avocat, possibly Yigit for the INT.

Upgrades, for hands not really a lot of options, I use Morrigans Cuffs for the M.ACC, Goliard could work well too or Master Casters Bracelets in areas they work. Altrustic Cape for back, if can't get that Gleemans if you do Einhejar. Nashira Seraweels for legs if in a Limbo shell, and Goliard for the feet if you do Nyzul.

[stewie]

You're confusing because even in your set up you have you have non-ahable items which leads me to wonder what other options you have.

I'm planning on doing the ZNMs solo, the only even I currently do is Limbus, and I'll likely have a good shot at nashira once I get 75. Was just wondering what I could do until then, I was assuming the fast cast from AF would be better than Wise+1?

[rlas549]

I'm planning on doing the ZNMs solo, the only even I currently do is Limbus, and I'll likely have a good shot at nashira once I get 75. Was just wondering what I could do until then, I was assuming the fast cast from AF would be better than Wise+1?

or you could always start the cast off in Warlock(+1) and switch to Wise(+1) for when the spell goes off.

[stewie]

or you could always start the cast off in Warlock(+1) and switch to Wise(+1) for when the spell goes off.

Do I only need to start the cast in fast cast gear to get the recast effect?

[rlas549]

Do I only need to start the cast in fast cast gear to get the recast effect?

recast only happens if it is on when spell goes off, so if that is a concern, you need to keep it on the whole time. Out of curiosity, is this a hypothetical or a specific mob you are worried about bind timer?