DM ninjaed?

[Wavyhill]

Just tried DM 3 times and fully wiped on each of them trying to use the supertank method. Main pld would run in and aggro everything just fine. Second pld would pull EV out of the fray just fine, but then at some odd point afterwards GK, HM, and MR would lose all hate on the main pld and go slaughter everyone in the teleport room for no reason I could see. Has anyone else had this problem recently? Or did we fuck up somehow?

[MarkM.]

Did this recently with some ls mates, it seemed just as easy as when i did it the first time. Since we didn't have anybody with flee with us, I ninja'd my way around the edge of wear the mobs spawn, popped a pair of powder boots, and then proceeded to get pwnd by them. Did the kite method while the majority of the ally picked them off one at a time. I dont know why the super tank method didn't work, but my suggestion is change your strat if it keeps ending up with a loss. Good luck!

[Aihree]

Don't suppose you had a SMN in your alliance who was using Release, perhaps?

SMN and Brave Tanking do not go together. Using Release on an avatar will cause any of the "brave tanked" mobs to have hate for the SMN. They will also, as they beeline for the SMN, build hate for anyone they pass or get near who are in /heal . It all goes downhill then.

Can also happen if someone too near the mobs uses /heal - it generates hate and then all goes to heck again.

[Apelila]

Same for BST pets - release in general fucks up hate while super tanking.

[bercus]

Tell your DRG not to use his Wyvern till you fight the last Arc Angel
Wyvern dies = AAs run wild.

[Celebrindor]

Having not seen the supertank method, I guess I'm still shocked people use this way of defeating DM. 2 reliable sleepers, one kiter, and knowledge of the BC and some quirks in it are all that's needed to keep the AAs at bay.

Probably common knowledge but I'll throw it out anyways-

1. Archangel TT cannot teleport out of the circular room at the end of the long hallway. Almost all strategies have you defeat him first, as his magic IS extremely dangerous. However, just fight in the hallway and you will never be in danger of him. This means you can focus your attention on 4 mobs and 2 pets rather than 5 and 2, saving him for last actually.

2. Second benefit of fighting in the hallway is in case of a wipe (or planned wipe after X number of enemies defeated) no one gets stranded in the circular room.

3. If you break your alliance and enter one of the individual AA fights in the same Ampitheater entrance one party at a time, you can freely build 300TP against one AA, have a RDM gravity, bind, or sleep the Archangel and then run away from the battle and exit, keeping your TP. Then you can reform your alliance and enter Divine Might with free full TP. No time wasted, no opo-opo necklaces/sleeping pots needed.

Still one of my favorite fights in the entire game.

[stinkypoo]

1. Archangel TT cannot teleport out of the circular room at the end of the long hallway. Almost all strategies have you defeat him first, as his magic IS extremely dangerous. However, just fight in the hallway and you will never be in danger of him. This means you can focus your attention on 4 mobs and 2 pets rather than 5 and 2, saving him for last actually.

I've argued this so many times over the years (also because of reason #2), but people always ignore me and say "Nu u have 2 kill teh taru 1st lolz". Logic is overated! -_-

[jibini]

1. Archangel TT cannot teleport out of the circular room at the end of the long hallway. Almost all strategies have you defeat him first, as his magic IS extremely dangerous. However, just fight in the hallway and you will never be in danger of him. This means you can focus your attention on 4 mobs and 2 pets rather than 5 and 2, saving him for last actually.

The problems with staying out of the circle as that you're a lot more constricted, and all of the AAs have at least one AoE move that they can use that immobilizes the target:

TT: Amon Drive, Petrify
MR: Havoc Spiral, Sleep
GK: Dragonfall, Bind
HM: Cross Reaver, Stun
EV: Shield Strike, Stun

If your kiters can't kite, due to getting hit with any of the above, they tend to go down pretty quickly. Same applies if people just holding AAs are getting hit with AoE from other AAs. Killing TT fast and getting him out of the way gives you much more space to seperate the remaining ones out.

You can also run out of range of crap like EVs Spirits Within much easier if you're kiting in the circle, rather than risking her use it as you pass her in the hallway.

Not to mention that if you do start with TT, it's not terribly hard to take it out within the first 10-15 seconds of engaging. That leaves you with the same 4 AA + 2 pets, but a lot more space to deal with them.

[Tsuko_Asura]

Having not seen the supertank method, I guess I'm still shocked people use this way of defeating DM.

Sans manaburn, its still the easiest strategy you can come up with. You'll only have three people max anywhere near the main circle, so inopportune wiping positions really aren't an issue. Supertank also revolves around killing AATT last, just as you suggested, considering you can't exactly drag him to the teleporter.

I mostly prefer the supertank method because you're only relying on two people(Tank, and dedicated healer), rather than as many as eight people in charge of kiting and keeping said kiters alive.

[Callisto]

To the OP: the above posts are correct, it was a pet dying or being released that caused it. We wiped last week b/c we forgot to tell our DRG not to call out a pet inside.

Having not seen the supertank method, I guess I'm still shocked people use this way of defeating DM.

Sans manaburn, its still the easiest strategy you can come up with. You'll only have three people max anywhere near the main circle, so inopportune wiping positions really aren't an issue. Supertank also revolves around killing AATT last, just as you suggested, considering you can't exactly drag him to the teleporter.

I mostly prefer the supertank method because you're only relying on two people(Tank, and dedicated healer), rather than as many as eight people in charge of kiting and keeping said kiters alive.

We use Supertank, but still always kill TT first. BLMs/BLUs/SAMs wipe TT right after the PLD aggros, then 2nd tank pulls MR back. Supertank holds the other 3 in the corner close to the steps so that he can raise if he goes down, and we just do one at a time from there. Works perfectly aside from our last run where Supertank got 1-shotted by some fluke lol...

[omgaggrohelpme]

Well, whats the set up you used?
i've done this with full Monk, full BLM's, full SMN's, and with 18 random ppl from LS.
w/e we do the random we just take 1PLD/NIN 1NIN/WAR and w/e WAR's are on, we have the mages just time nuke the TT out and hes done, then PLD/NIN gets PLD, NIN/WAR gets hume and the WAR's just voke the others, usually the Hume is the one we kite and we just let the PLD/NIN and a RDM alone with the Elvaan. Galka, Mithra, Tarutaru are all jokes --; just look at them as Dynamis-Xarc mobs and its easy as hell for us.

we've done DM with about 12 and cleared with just a Taru RDM dead, he nuked the galka at start -_-;

[Suiram]

In addition to the pet release thing, another thing you should know that can screw up the "supertank" method is someone in the same PT resting. Years ago in between updates for CoP, my CoP static decided to finish up Zilart missions as well, and the method kept failing for the final BC until we figured out that was the cause. Also I'm not 100% sure on this but I think spikes as well as enfeebling effects like Iquirra gear curse will also screw it up.

[Wavyhill]

Thanks everyone. Almost positive it was caused by the drg's wyvern dying now. Nobody in the ally I spoke with had ever heard of that issue.

[Lexa]

Pets/AoE spells will mess up superkite everywhere. Found out first time when I was doing PM2-5 runs for friends.